My Experience In Getting A Loved One Out

by notsurewheretogo 17 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  sowhatnow

  i had sort of one of those lightbulb moments myself, Im glad you found such an interesting twist on reasoning.

  it does take little bits of info here and there to get one to think more logically, and the problem is we deny our error because its troubling to us.

  I always felt that If God is perfect, and all powerful, and there is no sin in him and no error then it is inpossible for him to create something or someone that would have the possibility to become inperfect, like satan, evil in it self would have to exsist to be passed on to a creation.

  we can only create things that are equaly in perfection to ourselves. there fore God has to have had some knowlege of bad, in order for it to manifest itself in one of his creations.

  yea i get like that, lol ypur right God is not going to allow improper information to be dispensed which would result in damage to humans ,this would make HIM bloodgulty!

  then i read this,someplace,

  the bible states that the appointment over all the belongings is made after jesus arrives, matthew24:46,47

  the master has not yet arrived , as the memorial is to cease upon his arrival 1st cor 11 vs 26

  since the memorial is still being celebrated, apparently he hasnt come .
• 

  Oubliette

  notsurewheretogo: So either God is the author and is teaching us wrong things and then corrects it or the men teach wrong things and Jehovah corrects it.

  Thanks for your interesting post and congrats on getting your wife to wake up to TTATT. I'm glad your approach is working.

  That being said, I have to respectfully disagree with the sentiment of others expressed above: this is NOT great logic.

  In the interest of encouraging truly great logic, I am compelled to point out that your argument is a form of false dilemma and is incorrect in both its form and its conclusion.

  The truth is in fact an alternative that you seem not to have considered: Men teach wrong things and Jehovah (God) has nothing to do with any of it.(I say this in reference to religion in general and the teachings of the WTBTS in particular).

  As to "where should you go," at John 6:68, Peter allegedly said to Jesus, " “Lord, whom shall we go away to? "

  It was all about WHO should be followed, a person. It was not about a location or, in the case of the WTBTS, an organization.

  I suggest you learn to put away black and white thinking as it is not a sign of a mentally healthy worldview, learn to embrace ambiguity with a flexible mental attitude, love your wife deeply and ENJOY YOUR LIFE free from the manipulation and control of this cult.
• 

  Phizzy

  I do agree with your points Oub, but your conclusion i.e.

  " Men teach wrong things and Jehovah (God) has nothing to do with any of it.(I say this in reference to religion in general and the teachings of the WTBTS in particular). "

  has to be reached by the poor illogical J.W by going first of all through the steps in the O.P.

  If you lead a horse straight to water, you may not be able to get him to drink, you have to convince the horse he is damn thirsty.

  The unscrambling of the Mind-controlled brain takes care and effort, and is a slow cumulative process, each tiny step of the way the befuddled J.W needs his or her hand held, they need to be led to the water slowly and gently.
• 

  Vanderhoven7

  Good OP
• 

  notsurewheretogo

  I think Oubliette has misunderstood me?

  In no way do I think "So either God is the author and is teaching us wrong things and then corrects it or the men teach wrong things and Jehovah corrects it." is true from either point of view.

  I agree with Oubliette in that men make things up and Jehovah has nothing to do with it because I don't believe in any god...

  But my two fold point that I mention is from the point of view as a still-in JW.

  They are the ones that has to believe either "So either God is the author and is teaching us wrong things and then corrects it or the men teach wrong things and Jehovah corrects it."

  Once you use that logical thought and get the person to eventually wake up they THEN believe as Oubliette says "Men teach wrong things and Jehovah (God) has nothing to do with any of it."

  But a still-in dub cannot get to that conclusion without first debunking in their minds that the GB are under God's direction hence what I post is the first step, the conclusion Oubliette posts is another step after that...

  Does that make sense?

  My wife is just realising that perhaps the GB are not under God's direction but she is not at the point where she thinks men make up stuff and there is either no god or a god has nothing to do with it.
• 

  mrquik

  I also found it helpful to start with points they agree on. Jehovah is a God of reason & love. For him to knowingly allow the GB to publish doctrine that allowed thousands to die needlessly is a violation of the primary tenet of the true religion; Love. That being the case & we know it is impossible for God to violate either principle, the responsiblity falls on the shoulders of the GB who now must be recognized as promoting their own opinions as facts. And you know what they say about opinions....
• 

  Rattigan350

  "As to "where should you go," at John 6:68, Peter allegedly said to Jesus, " “Lord, whom shall we go away to? "

  It was all about WHO should be followed, a person. It was not about a location or, in the case of the WTBTS, an organization."

  Not exactly. When Jesus asked them if they are leaving him also, Peter replied

  “Lord, to whom shall we go? Thou hast the words of eternal life,"

  He liked the sayings of life and if he left Jesus where or to whom would have sayings like them.

  I don't think a differentiation of whom or where matters. The focus was leaving Jesus. Then Jesus vs someone else or no one.
• 

  Oubliette

  NSWTG, thanks for your thoughtful response.

  I do understand the progressive nature of trying to wake up someone to TTATT.

  That being said, please reconsider my statement: "Men teach wrong things and Jehovah (God) has nothing to do with any of it."

  There is nothing about this that implies that there is no God, (although this is what I believe), only that God has nothing to do with the WTBTS, its hopelessly misguided and quite probably fraudulent leaders, and the R&F followers who have been scammed.

  Best wishes on reaching your wife,

  Oubliette