My Muslim friend's and the Koran. (page 2)

Simon

Most JWs are not 'liars' but will lie to their closest 'friends' when asked about 'the truth'.

Don't think casual friendship can win over a lifetime of indoctrination and generations of manipulation.

I can see why you would steer clear of sensitive issues. Having my views crammed up my arse might be a prime conversation topper in your world but not mine. There are ways to talk --even if indirectly-- about freedom. And we should if we send the young to die for it--what do we do at home?

You love freedom. So do I.

By the way, I am a 62 year old she.

Maeve

PS. Clue me--Attack you as a person? I disagree with your advice. Is that the same as trashing your comment? Apology if you felt contempt . This is a discussion forum, no?

new hope and happiness

loveandhayeexams,

I am aware of Rushdie and the Cartoonist,i appreciate your concern, and i am aware that in Austria it is illegal to posess a copy of Mein Kampf.

But i think my Muslim friends are fair minded and educated enough in friendship to not be impressionable by " islam". Infact i think they are aware of it, and they prefer Western Values.

new hope and happiness

Humbled thank you for the positive post to LUHE.

LoveUniHateExams

@humbled - I'm sorry for what I said about you.

@nhah - I am concerned for you. I think that most people here on JWN are indeed decent people and I would include you in that.

Maajid Nawaz is a decent man and a moderate, serious muslim. He has received numerous death rates for asking awkward questions.

What makes you think that Schmoes such as me or you can cross the muslim minefield and make it to the other side unscathed?

Take a long, deep think about this before you do or say anything on this matter.

new hope and happiness

LuHE....thank you for your concern.

THE CASE FOR COMPROMISE...one afternoon on the ice skating ring my little boy got his shoe lases tied together.

I decided to give chase and stop him tripping over his feet.

It was me who tripped over my feet.

I have met concentration survivors. I loved their spirit. This spirit which was not of fear or hatred but love and EDUCATION.

LoveUniHateExams

@humbled - generally speaking, the Muslim World doesn't go a bundle on 'freedom', does it?

@nhah - we're not talking about falling over on the ice and bruising your leg here, are we?

I realise I'm swiftly becoming a pain in the a$$, but be careful.

humbled

LUHE,

No problem. I actually prefer it when someone bothers to tear me a new one--I survived anal canal cancer for over a year now-- If it comes back, I get in touch with you .

In truth, the problem of fearing to talk is a huge concern of mine. I was raised in a family that suppressed dialogue and fought it, I ended up in a religion that offered freedom of religion and found it false. I hate it-- there is no save haven for ourselves and our children when we fear.

I do agree with you that caution is needed--that's why I say not to go head-on with frightened Muslims--- but come in side ways with our own experience of repression( the JW experience). We are free to express the adverse effect it ultimately had on all we wanted to protect---particularly our children. We can elaborate on the wretched effect it had on our girls. We can expand on the repression of our young men.

It isn't an original idea--this idea of coming in sideways-- NOT directly-- with a story or example that WE know applies to a certain subject--others have used it to good effect. We have this shared example: In our Witness days we remember the story of the prophet Nathan telling the story to the king, David: The story was of a man whose single young she-lamb was taken fom a poor family and slaughtered for the rich neighbor's meal--And the story hit home for David. He had done the same by screwing Uriah's wife.

Such an approach creates freedom because of the "plausible deniability" it allows. I have had to use it often myself when there have been volitile matters in our family to discuss. I've disagreed with my own husband over matters that have involved criminal matters and our children. Often there are issues that have to be dealt with round-about. But they have to be addressed eventually.

Chickens DO come home to roost.

Maybe we can shoo them away for a time--but they propagate and will move into your house sooner or later.

And, LUHE, I admire that you care so much for NHAH that you flew in my face. It was rattling but goddammed real.

Maeve

Band on the Run

Truly moderate Muslims exist and thrive! This forum has been racist of late. Disparaging a major world religion is not good. There is so much in our own tradition that is deplorable --the sacrifice of Isaac, the flood story, the rape of women, major war crimes by Israel. The list of questionable items could go and on. One can view these Biblical sources as a tradition. The Bible also teaches respect for parents, to love each other, not to steal, etc. I suggest you investigate Islam, not rely on some crazy posts here. I know American Muslims. They are no threat to me or anyone else. I am tired of my personal beliefs being defined by Christian fundamentalism rather than what I actually believe. I suggest Muslims are similarly upset.

poopsiecakes

Islam is not a race, it's a religion that has many people in its grip. I don't understand how it's possible in 2014 to be all chill when it comes to a religion that teaches the kind of stuff this one does about how to treat women. I've said this before and I'll say it again - there is no way that it's ok to teach people that women need to be covered up in order to be acceptable. The WT prints something like 'women need to listen in silence' or 'apostates are mentally diseased' and the board erupts - rightly so and calls it what it is, hate speech. But somehow it's ok with Islam. I don't get it.

Has the WT somehow become more dangerous than Islam because you know someone who's a really nice Muslim? I know plenty of really nice Muslims and they're not the problem. Their religion IS a problem and I think we should all be able to tell the difference having come out of a destructive cult. Nice people doesn't mean their religion is nice or above critisism.

My Muslim friend's and the Koran.

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