A JW encounter in Hong Kong

by Listener 10 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Listener
    Listener

    Last week I was in Hong Kong on a holiday and ran into some JWs. I was in a large shopping mall and noticed a number of JWs holding out a pamphlet to passerbys. Before I knew it there was one walking towards me and stopped right in front of me stopping me from moving forward.

    The JW was virtually shoving the pamphlet towards me and said “I would like to offer you this pamphlet that directs you to a web site that will answer all your questions that you have about life”. I found it really offensive and although I was on holidays I was angry and decided to stop and talk. I said ‘really, are you a Jehovah’s witness?” He said ‘why, yes we are”. I only knew because I had seen the strange looking pamphlet on here and again I was annoyed because he did not introduce himself as a JW and made the bold claim that their website would provide all the answers that I could possibly have. This is a bold faced lie.

    I had little patience at this stage and said I am sorry to hear that you are a JW. He put on that fake expression of looking sad and asked ‘sorry to hear that, what makes you say that’. I then decided to take my conversation into one direction and said it was because the JWs are not following what the bible says but rather follow what a few men tell them.

    I thought I would start out with a simple example and mentioned the idea about not celebrating birthdays and how the bible did not support that idea. He looked relieved as he knew the answer to that. He nodded his head and said that my feelings were understandable and he himself had for many years had a problem with that teaching until he looked into it further and understood why they don’t. He then went into their normal explanation of how the bible mentions it twice etc. Etc. I then said that the bible does not state it is wrong. He then said “Oh, yes, it does not say it directly but what is more important for us to do is to get an understanding of how God feels about these things”. I couldn’t believe he just said that but I let it drop until later in our conversation.

    I then mentioned a few of their teachings, such as the FDS and this generation and how they had made so many changes. The JW female next to him piped up and proudly stated that there had been many changes in their teachings. I mentioned that it was important to understand why they are making all these changes.

    I brought up their false predictions about the timing of Armageddon and mentioned 1914, 1919, 1925, 1975 and before the end of this century (being last century). There wasn’t much response here but he did mention he had never heard of the ‘before the end of this century’ idea. So I said how it was stated in their publications a couple of times but he wouldn’t find it on the CD Rom because the org. Had changed the wording and it could only be found in original Watchtower magazines.

    After all this small talk I said to him that these things were not my greatest concern and I was troubled about a much more serious matter. He was very interested and asked me to explain. I then talked to him about the org. teaching that Jesus was not the mediator for most of mankind in a strictly legal sense even though 1 Timothy tells us he is. He said he did not get this understanding according to their teachings. By this stage he had told me he was a 42 year old Elder from Canada who was brought up in the truth since he was 6. I told him that this certainly was a teaching of the JWs and all he needed to do was type in ‘Jesus mediator anointed’ into his CD rom when he got home. I then proceeded to explain the repercussions that this teaching has, including the idea that the other sheep were not part of the New Covenant.

    I again told him to look it up in his CD Rom which he said he would do, as he couldn’t say much about it I then went on about their beliefs being man’s teachings and not God’s.

    In conclusion I told him that my JW sister, who was nearly 50 had just recently got married. She is a strong believer and she married a non believer. She had done this in secret, virtually eloping and none of the JWs new about it or knew that she had been dating. I said this was very sneaky as she knew that by doing it this way she would not be disciplined. He said that was absolutely correct and she would not be disciplined. I then said, now isn’t that very interesting. Here the bible makes it very clear not to marry outside of ‘ones kind’. This instruction is direct and unmistakeable. Yet when we consider the ban on celebrating birthdays which is not anywhere near as clear in the bible the organization will disfellowship a person for disobeying their command regarding this but not for marrying a non believer. He had nothing to say about this.

    He wrote down on a slip of paper his telephone number and said I could call him anytime. I thanked him for it and I was stunned when he said ‘so aren’t you going to give me your number?’ Talk about being forward but it seems that they have public preaching down pact in Hong Kong. I told him I live in Australia and am on holidays but I could give him my email address. He said great and he would look up the issues I had presented and get back to me. Somehow I don’t think he will because at one stage he asked me if I had been reading outside material to which I told him I certainly had as it provided me with an open view and recommended JW Facts to him and the benefit of that website.

    When I was leaving the mall I noticed another bunch of JWs at the entrance and they were just as forward by actively approaching passerbys, blocking their passage and trying to engage them in conversation. It was such a contrast to the literature cart I had seen a couple of days before where the JWs there were like statues, speechless and non engaging.

    I was very nervous to start with and know I did not handle this as I should have but I think by making an effort it will give me more courage to speak confidently in the future.

  • LoisLane looking for Superman
  • losingit
    losingit

    Awesome!!!!

  • clarity
    clarity

    Nice going Listener.....you might have started him on a 'new'

    journey!

  • disposable hero of hypocrisy
    disposable hero of hypocrisy

    Good work! Interesting about the birthdays / marrying only on the Lord contrast.

  • Aunt Fancy
    Aunt Fancy

    I think you did a great job talking to them. Maybe they will look up the info and it will make them think. The elders must be getting info from the WTBTS about "outside" material. It seems that the elders always ask that question when someone brings up false teachings. When I was in I never heard anyone ask that question.

  • etna
    etna

    Thats great listener. Im from Sydney, and I had a friend of mine come by the weekend who is an elder. I would like to tell him a few things as he will try and getme back. I don't want to talk really against them as I have kids that are still in and then they wont talk to me. But im sick of the bs they spin.

  • jookbeard
    jookbeard

    brilliant work!

  • happy@last
    happy@last

    Well done, you did good and gave him some homework of his own to do.

  • rjharris
    rjharris

    May I suggest that the next time any have a conversation with a JW, do not say that "They do not follow the Bible."

    Why, because this is where they want you and you and this is what they want you to think.

    Rather, none of us are supposed to be FOLLOWING THE BIBLE, but should be FOLLOWING CHRIST.

    This is where so many fall into a trap. They engage in this "following the Bible" and "the Bible says this" and "the Bible teaches that." The Bible teaches NOTHING. One does not follow the Bible.

    It is Christ that teaches and he is our only Teacher. We should NEVER ascribe to a book what Christ is what we should be doing with him in mind: Following and believing in him.

    "But YOU, do not YOU be called Rabbi, for one is YOUR teacher, whereas all YOU are brothers." (Matthew 23:8)

    "YOU address me, ‘Teacher,’ and, ‘Lord,’ and YOU speak rightly, for I am such." (Matthew 13:13)

    Open your eyes and observe what the world of Christianity - to include the WTBTS - is doing to you: It is getting you to revere and defend a book rather than the "person" of Christ - who is alive and able to teach us still as he promised to be with his disciples until the end. Yet, it is a book most of you turn to and give reverence and prominence to.

    A quick scan of the official WTBTS website is telling. It features a book - The Bible - more than anything else. Notice in the menu of the website, you do not see "Christs Teachings" but you see "Bible Teachings."

    Many of you will not make much of this, but I do. The Bible is not a teacher, Jesus Christ is our Teacher. Think!!!

    The Bible has cleverly replaced Jesus as Teacher.

    Did The Most High God command us to listen to an organization or a book? Did he send an organization or a book? No! His command to us is clear at Luke 9:35:

    "This is my Son, the one that has been chosen. Listen to him."

    Sadly, His Son is not being listened to. An entire book has replaced him.

    R. Jerome Harris
    e-Prophetic.com

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