Why Evolution Is True--something that scares me

by DS211 24 Replies latest jw friends

  • DS211

    So im reading "why evokution Is True" by coyne and the page im on is talking about Darwin and natural selection:

    "But natural selection was also the part of evolutionary theory con- sidered most revolutionary in Darwin’s time, and it is still unsettling to many. Selection is both revolutionary and disturbing for the same reason: it explains apparent design in nature by a purely materialistic process that doesn’t require creation or guidance by supernatural forces. "

    Ill tell you why:

    A born in creationist will see this as Satanic mentality...you know the whole "the serpent told eve she would not die but her eyes would be opened to know both good and evil" thing.

    or if the creationist is asking questions this could really hit his faith hard And perhaps put a dent or crush many things that string together his/her perception of reality, hope, peace, salvatikn, etc

    i know that prob didnt come out right but thats what i thought of when i read it.

  • Hortensia

    You seem to be having a stressful day -- I read your other thread, too. Facing reality can be difficult and painful. Don't worry too much about it; just get what you can out of each day. I don't think there's any point in looking back and regretting, or in looking too far forward and having still more regret.

    It's a sad thing that this life is probably all there is. But, it makes life more precious and we don't want to waste it.

  • rmt1

    The marvels of deeply catching a glimpse of how the world actually works is a more potent opium than religion.

  • Ruby456

    I feel for you DS211. have you ever done one of those scary rides in a theme park, the ones that defy gravity? you know it will end, right? my advice is to try to think of this path that you are testing as a scary ride when you want to gain some detachment but to enjoy it even so.

  • cantleave

    Ruby has hit the nail on the head. Breaking down down a life long paradigm and seeing the world from a new vantage point is scary. But the more you learn and more accepting you are of reality the less traumatic the process becomes. The way I look at it is I will never know or try everything so I simply want to learn and experience as much as I can before I lose consciousness forever.

  • designs

    The celestial Lone Ranger won't be riding to the rescue, this is it. There is a tremendous amount of good you can do in your life, go for it.

  • Perry

    The bible predicted the UNIFORMITARIANISM in later times ... the foudation of evolution.

    "There shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, and saying, 'Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. For this they willingly are ignorant of... the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished" (2 Pet. 3:3-6).

    It's hard for me not to quote Mark Twian here:

    ("Life on the Mississippi," chap. 17): "Now, if I wanted to be one of those ponderous scientific people, and 'let on' to prove what had occurred in the remote past by what had occurred in a given time in the recent past... In the space of 176 years the Lower Mississippi has shortened itself 242 miles. That is an average of a trifle over 1 1/3 miles per year. Therefore, any calm person, who is not blind or idiotic, can see that in the Old Oolitic Silurian Period, just a million years ago next November, the Lower Mississippi River was upwards of 1,300,000 miles long... There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact."

    But seriously there are mountains of evidence to blast holes through the standard evolutionary naturalistic worldview paradign.

    Get right with God through the blood of Jesus and he'll take you places and show your things you NEVER DREAMED of. He did it for me.

  • cofty

    Read that statement again, read it out loud a few times, think about how utterly idiotic is sounds...

    "Get right with God through the blood of Jesus" - Perry

    Its just vacuous nonsense. Its ancient pagan mythology about appeasing a wrathful god with the sight of spilled blood.

    Reality just is what it is. It doesn't ask for our approval or consent. As Ruby said its both thrilling and terrifying at the same time.

    Many believers can accomodate both faith and reality but not the sort of blind dogma advocated by Perry's fundamenatalism.

  • Seraphim23

    Hi DS211, it is disturbing on the face of it. However the Christian view of not reading Genesis literally has been around for millennia, well before the modern understanding of evolution.

    On the point of natural selection not requiring guidance from supernatural forces, one has to read between the lines here. The reason is that all sorts of processes don’t require intervention in nature. Rain for instance is a process caused by many factors of nature ranging from gravity, to the melting and freezing point of H20 and so on. In turn rain itself causes erosion and other processes of nature.

    Because the nature of processes themselves seems to be dependent on other processes before it, it can be tempting to think that the need for intelligence is surplus to requirements. Of course when it comes to a specific process amid the countless ones in nature, it is true than no direct intervention, meddling or help is required. An ice cube doesn’t need help in melting after all because the factors required for this process are already there but where did they come from? Is it possible to trace back all processes to a fundamental point?

    A computer program can be described as a process and some sophisticated software can even simulate natural selection to solve an industrial problem for example. However the information for this program and the hardware on which to run it was the result of intelligence. Any design that comes from the program itself is really information that is either in the program, which has to have a programmer of course, or the hardware which has to have a builder or a combination of the two.

    Nature is far more complex than the example above but it is by no means proven that the processes of evolution didn’t come at some point from an intelligent mind. If one however isolates a single process of nature and points at it and says that such a process produces this clever result, but didn’t require any intervention and intelligence then that someone is making a misleading statement by obscuring the issues. First of all intervention and intelligence are not really equivalent terms. Something can be designed as with a machine like a car for instance, but not require intervention after the initial manufacture. As well as this, isolating a single process in the car like fire for instance and then saying it doesn’t need intelligence is misleading, because it ignores all the surroundings context of the car itself which did.

    These are simple metaphors to get some of the issues over but nature is far more complex but it has not been proven than the whole machine and processes of the universe did not at some point require intelligence. The problem with certain brands of Christianity is its leaning towards literalism and assuming they know Gods mind as well as he does. However there is hope for the theist.

  • designs

    cofty- Perry will stay hooked with his human sacrifice religion for probably another 2 decades. Facts and science mean little at this stage. The great tragedy is to teach these old myths to kids as true.

    There are millions who still cannot see the implications of Gallileo and Capernicus's findings, stunning.

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