Why not be totally free from it all?

by braincleaned 31 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Bob_NC

    Same here about the Bible god, whatever name you chose to give him.

    This god created sea life that [almost] all eats other sea life while it is still alive. Watch any nature show to see how whales and sharks eat live seals that are mortified trying to get away. Who would create such a feeding system?

    You already know about the food chain on the African plains. Same thing. Animals innards eaten out of them while they are still alive. The Bible says that god saw all this and it was good.

  • prologos

    as to your point # 1 " if god--

    It seems that the creation/nature setup is ver efficient, culling the less fit, providing food, and developping the best specimen&(speciwoman) at the same time.I recall from traumatic experiences in my life, cutting my leg with saw, falling meters, that the mind does not register immediate pain. May be a salmon being skinned alive by a bear, has it's brain overwhelmed and can bear it. just trying to give a possible creator credit for escape mechanism.

    Species have run their course, as have massive stars, individual humans (Hupersons)

    should we complain about lack of love in the congregation, if it is really nature's way?

    concentrate the feeling for the family nature & nurture? but

    would we have the Acropolis, the Pyramids, Chartre, Warwick without religion?

  • Ucantnome

    i have a friend Vince who recently lose her child do you think she would benefit from atheism?

  • braincleaned

    prologos, not sure what your point is... are you saying that all the mayhem is "good"?

    Ucantnome, the answer is absolutely!

    I was still on the fence when my dad died. My JW mom asked me on of the most difficult question: "Do you mean to say you do not think you will see dad again?"
    Wow... hard one. I answered candidly that I in fact did not believe in the resurrection anymore. When push comes to shove, I cried my father's death believing I would never see him again.

    In time, my mom had more trouble with his death than me. For me, death was well stated by Mark Twain, when he said,
    "I do not fear death . I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience."

    This of course, works well when we keep the person alive in our heart, as I have.

    I'm very sorry to hear about the death of your friend's child. Maybe the parents will be better off with faith... I can't make that judgement call.
    However practical faith is in those tragedies, I still think Bertrand Russell's quote is the best at the end:

    "there can't be a practical reason for believing what isn't true. (...) Either the thing is true, or it isn't. If it is true, you should believe it, and if it isn't, you shouldn't. And if you can't find out whether it's true or whether it isn't, you should suspend judgment. But you can't... it seems to me a fundamental dishonesty and a fundamental treachery to intellectual integrity to hold a belief because you think it's useful, and not because you think it's true."

  • Tiktaalik

    Thanks for a thoughtful thread topic Brainy. Your reasoning closely resembles my own. My atheism is firmly rooted in the impersonal cruelty of nature.

  • Ucantnome

    thank you i will direct her to your thread

  • braincleaned

    As you can see Tiktaalik, although obvious, many still rationalize it using the red herring fallacy of ignoring the premise to steer in the way of how "practical" the cycle of life is — totally ignoring the point that if God is all powerful, he could have controlled wildlife population in a perfectly peaceful and loving way.

    Of course, he doesn't exist — hence the need to rationalize.

  • braincleaned

    Thank you Ucantnome.

    Ucantnome's friend, if you read this, please accept my most sincere condolences.
    As a father of two, I can only imagine how hurtful this must be.

    I don't know what your beliefs are... so my answer to Ucantnome is one coming from my sincere understanding of now.
    Losing the hope to see my father again was incredibly painful... but I found some joy in keeping my dad alive in my heart.
    Death is peaceful and uneventful, it's Life that can be such a test of character, difficult as it often is.

    I take great solace in the thought that my father is resting in peace.

    My love and most positive thoughts go to you.
    Vince Deporter.

  • prologos

    nature is good for us, for we are alive.

    nature is efficient for the good of the species (plural).-- efficient: the refraction index

    nature is also extravagant: birds of paradise.

    my point: enjoy your life without (resorting to) warwick.

  • braincleaned

    English not being my first language, it sometimes fail me — I can't find the definition of warwick... embarrassing.
    Could you please explain it to me?

    In my OP I meant to make the point that:

    nature is good for us, for we are alive... then we die, often painfully.

    nature is efficient for the good of the species (plural).-- efficient: the refraction index
    98% of known species have become extinct.
    And I could argue infintely on the fact that nature is not as efficiant as it could be if an intellegent and powerful god was at it's root.

    nature is also extravagant: birds of paradise.
    Yes... that I won't argue.

    I do enjoy my life now. Godless and free. :)

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