My Dad called

by Elsewhere 27 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Elsewhere

  When I decided to DA myself my parents came by to "encourage" me. I explained to them that at no time did I ever really believe what the JWs taught. I explained to them that I had always been an atheist... I just played along to keep everyone happy, hoping that one day I would catch on to the whole "god" thing - this never happened.

  Months later my dad asked me how I could reject god with so much evidence that "proved" that god existed. I asked him to outline some of the "proofs" he was talking about. It didn't take much effort for me to dispute the evidence. Eventually my dad was saying that physical proof was not important and that belief in god was all based on faith.

  That is when I told him that I was incapable of faith. Even if I were capable of it, how would I know that I was coming to the correct conclusion since there is no way for me to test my conclusions.

  He gave up saying: "You just have to have faith."

  I wasn't trying to break him or corner him. I was just trying to help him understand. I just wanted him to stop tormenting himself over me. I just wanted him to stop blaming himself.

  The brief times I am able to forget about his suffering over me, I am truly happy. It isn't until I see my father tormenting himself that I become depressed.

  I wish he could just accept me for who I am and love me for who I am.

  "As every one knows, there are mistakes in the Bible" - The Watchtower, April 15, 1928, p. 126
  Believe in yourself, not mythology.
  <x ><
• 

  dungbeetle

  >I wish he could just accept me for who I am and love me for who I am.<

  Been thee and done that.

  But people like this are addicts. Excessive religiosity has been around a veery very long time, thousands of years, and in some cases it's actually a medical diagnoses.

  Your family sounds about as miserable as an alcoholic that is still drinking. You don't see the parallells?
• 

  MegaDude

  Dave,

  I can empathize with you not wanting to ever have to speak to JWs again. But since they know where you are at now, why not have fun with them. Do like I do! Heh, heh. Print a long list off the internet of every ridiculous thing the Watchtower has ever said. I keep mine close to the door. When they call on you, say, "Brothers, I just am confused that the Watchtower is really the truth because of....and hand them the list. Play the confused person who has lost his way and is looking for assistance. Start reading from the list. Do so in a patient, sympathetic way. Watch with amusement as their smiles turn to frowns, the blood drains from their face in fear, and as their eyes grow wide in horror at the VERY IDEA that their God/Watchtower could have uttered such nonsense. Who knows? You may very well plant a seed that may help another unfortunate trapped in the Watchtower to begin his journey out.

  I've been visited a number of times. As I watch the panic begin to grow in their eyes, I always find that therapeutic, and it reminds me how fortunate and glad I am that I'm not on the other side of the door.
• 

  JT

  Eslewhere says:

  "I told him that I respect his right to believe as he will, but I expect the same in return."

  "Ever since I left the bOrg he has changed. He looks at me differently. He talks to me differently. He always has an air of stress and worry"

  "Why can’t he just let go and accept me for who I am?"

  Elsewhere

  I have been on the net for almost 6 yrs now and your comments are all too true and too regular in terms of exp that folks have with family still in-

  you have asked questions and and ask to be respected by your folks ,but sad to say High Control groups don't work that way

  here is my advice to you and anyone reading this-

  It is so important that if you don't do anything in the next few days or weeks you take the time to READ READ AND READ AS Much as you can

  on how High control groups impact folks, this way while not relieving you of all the pain and suffering at least you will understand WHY AND HOW A Person is affected

  In fact if you do enough research on the matter like many of us who had to learn the hard way like you and others are right now

  You will see that instead of getting angry or mad, or upset you will feel sheer SORRY FOR FOR THem

  FOR YOU will realize that they have very little control over what they are doing AS LONG AS THEY CONTINUE TO TAKE THE DRUGS wt offers- meetings, talks, conventions and associating with others who reinforce the wt mindset

  Until they are willing to examine the cards on the table in connection with wt-- THE WAY in which they deal with you and
  "REFUSE TO RESPECT" your choice (you are chosing to worship SATAN) HOW CAN they respect such a choice? Is how they veiw you.

  Many of us had to learn the techniques of how to deal with family still in the hard way, you don't unless you just want to feel that pain we felt.

  every single thing your dad said or did is straight out of JW 101 on how to deal with folks who question the Slave-
  his comments are straight from the TEXT BOOK

  it is very important that we never forget what we learned in wt and use it to our advantage, otherwise we end up very frustrated and hurt like you and so many others are (including many of us who learned it the hard way)

  there is a guy call Steven Hassuim, somthing like that others will correct me on his name. but anyway he has written some excellent materail on helping one to deal and understand the mind of a cult member

  everything that is normal to most folks is reversed for jw

  you get a good job, but don't sell books on the weekend - you wicked

  you go to college but no meetings-- you are wicked

  you buy a house and work in the yard-you are wicked and materilistic

  you buy a 2 door Benz- you are not spirtual should have gotten a 4 door

  and on an on we go

  I keep seeing so many former jw say:

  "Look dad i respect your choice to go to the hall now would you respect my choice not to go"

  to a loyal jw we sound like we have been smoking Crack BY ASKING THEM THAT

  all their life they have been given 2 choice jah and satan - they are chosing jah and you are satan so to them they are saying how can i RESPECT YOU FOR MAKING SUCH A DUMBA$$ CHOICE

  AND THAT is how they veiw us when we ask that question

  well by understanding that littl simple fact along with other things that make a person a jw, we can avoid putting our heart on the table only to have it beaten to death and we feel the pain

  so ck out some of the High control group ref material on the net it will give you an insight into their littlw world that will blow your mind but will help you to understand how to walk the minefields of their world

  last but not least is my favorite site

  many feel that if i printout all the errors of wt and show the proof and document everything my folks will be out of wt this weekend and we will be at the lake laughing about all the time we wasted in wt world

  and then one finds out that is not the way it happens at all- they are rejected and why

  well ck out these 2 links-- IT gives an interesting look at a possible reason

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=7798&site=3#92744

  http://www.csicop.org/si/2000-11/beliefs.html

  just my 2

  hope it helps
• 

  Farkel

  Scully,

  : You might consider getting a "BEWARE OF DOG" sign, and a recording of a large dog barking and snarling that is activated when those Loving™ dubs come to your door

  How about a "BEWARE OF APOSTATE" sign, with a case of Campbell's split-pea soup along each side? On those boxes, place a sign that says "Apostate Ammo - Magnum Loads!"

  That oughta do it.

  Farkel
• 

  4horsemen

  Elsewhere,

  You mentioned your dad at times reminded you of a "broken animal". This struck a chord in me of my grandfather. He was born in 1915, and not certain how long he's been JW but he was already one at the Yankee Stadium assembly. Obviously, he's seen a thing or two.

  My question to you is how did your father respond/react to the 1914 "generation" flip flop? My grandfather of course accepted it on the surface, but subconsciously I think he realizes he's been duped. What can he do though? It's all he's got left and it is my feeling that since that change his mental outlook (read that as depression) has adversely affected his health. He very much reminds me of a "broken animal". It's a sad sight because, physically, he has outstanding health, but mentally he is destroyed, and his spirit without question is sickened.

  I can not imagine such a feeling and can only hope you dont see signs of this with your father.
• 

  4horsemen

  JT,

  You forgot the other black/white issue someone mentioned before if you're a JW:

  If you have a successful business (or a "wordly" job where you make more money than most JW's) you're materialistic

  BUT

  if you're old, have to rent, have no insurance, and cant retire you're a poor planner.

  Talk about all or nothing value system. I think I'll change my screen name to Xanax
• 

  Elsewhere

  4horsemen,

  My family would be best described as a "reformed" or "advanced" JW family... they have the "kinder gentler" way about them.

  When it comes to movies, entertainment, association, etc. they are far more tolerant than most JWs. They even have un-Thanksgivings on Thanksgiving Day – turkey with all the trimmings, I was also able to go to college in the early 90’s. All of this and they are considered to be an example family.

  OVERVIEW OF FAMILY:
  Father is an elder.
  Mother is of the anointed.
  Brother is working toward the ministry school for COs,
  Sister #1 married a “fine upstanding brother”
  Sister #2 is home schooled.
  Grand Father #1 is PO
  Grand Father #2 is of the anointed (dead)
  I Aux pioneered and temped for two weeks at bethel

  Many other uncles and relatives in positions of “responsibility” (authority).

  My question to you is how did your father respond/react to the 1914 "generation" flip flop?

  With all of this in mind, as far as I can tell, my family took it without blinking. I even called them and told them it was going to be announced at a convention they were about to go to. (used info from a site like this one) When I told them, they acted like it was nothing.

  In their minds, the bOrg can do no wrong – and if it does, “Jehovah will fix it in due time.”… as my dad said, he needed to “humble himself to ‘god's arrangements’”

  "As every one knows, there are mistakes in the Bible" - The Watchtower, April 15, 1928, p. 126
  Believe in yourself, not mythology.
  <x ><
• 

  Francois

  Connie Lynn - I've been out over 25 years. One conversation with my mother can put me over the top. I don't understand how anyone can be so dishonest with themselves. She's read Ray's book. She is aware of the pedophilia. She has a head like a block of lead.

  JWs avoid me like the plague. I've got the goods on 'em and they know it and they know I give no quarter. Actually, engaging a JW in debate is like pulling a gun on an unarmed man.

  $0.02.

  Francois
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  WildHorses

  Dave, Hang in there sweetie. Try not to get angry with your father. He is just doing what "he" thinks is best. Why not just explain to him that there would have been nothing he could have done that would have kept you in the Org. Maybe that will lesson his guilt feelings.

  As far as the Dubs coming to visit you. Why not tell them that (I think you have the wrong house) if they come knocking? That way they will not bother you again.

  Lilacs

  
  

  I don't want someone in my life I can live with. I want someone in my life I can't live without.