What is your reality?

by Billygoat 16 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  COMF

  Hi, Jerry.

  But I since I don't believe the Watchtower has any connection with Christ, I won't let them taint my view of him and steal *my truth* away from me just because they lied to me using Christ as their con.

  Just a thought here, no big deal. The way you worded that made it sound like a black-or-white thing: either believe in God/Jesus, or else the Watchtower stole your truth from you. That means that if you ever reach the conclusion that there's nothing to it all, you'll have that stigma attached. I'm just curious whether you've considered that. If your reasoning led you, somewhere down the line, to the same conclusion I've reached, would you fight against acknowledging it, generate some cognitive dissonance in yourself? And do you realize that if that is the case, then the Watchtower still has control over your thinking?

  COMF... not wanting to subvert faith, just looking at it straight on.
• 

  MegaDude

  Fred/COMF,

  What I've noticed is that many people who exit the Watchtower have such an unpleasant experience with religion or faith that they swing from one extreme to other -- from being highly religious as a JW to becoming agnostic or atheist. For some I've talked to, it seems like a kneejerk reaction. Others have put a lot of research and study into their views, and I respect their reasons. My point in saying I wouldn't let the Watchtower steal anything from me means I won't *necessarily exclude Christianity from being true just because I got conned by Jehovah's Witnesses, who claim to be Christian.*

  I keep an open mind on this subject. That's why I enjoy talking about it at our apostofests. I like to hear other people's opinion about things whether they conflict with my views or not. I thought what you said about getting on with life made a lot of sense. That's why I remembered it. I am currently questioning what my personal "proofs" are for my beliefs. Who knows where I will end up as far as my personal beliefs? This is a road I travel alone. After the Watchtower, I don't feel much like trusting anybody *completely* on the subject of the truth of this life.

  If I didn't believe in God, I think I would pretty much be philosophically in line with Satanists. They don't believe in Satan or God, that man is simply a higher developed animal, and they believe "do what thy will is the whole of the law."
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  gravedancer

  Interesting thread and concept...

  Based on what you wrote, Billy, then Individual Reality (IR) = the personalization of perception/reality for an individual.

  If that is true then IR is also highly framed in accordance with state and time. The persons mental state at a point in time. That means someone who is drunk will experience and personalize a reality at a point in time depending on their level of intoxication (their state).

  If one experiences frequent state changes and shifts in stste do they have differing realities?

  If realities change then - is there a "danger" point at which the person starts "living" in different worlds, while the REAL world likely has not changed much at all? That would definitely seem to be the case. If the differential in individual reality is marked from collective reality on a high scale we assign terms on all sides of the spectrum ranging from "insanity" to "genius" to the individual.

  One can then look at the factors altering state such as drugs, brain chemistry, music, religion, faith, romance....and on and on.

  We are all affected in some way by changing states and therefore have differing realities...learning how to change the states can change our realities. Changin the realities can in turn change the next level of states....

  These levels become patterns in our lives. We have heard the term "downward spiral" or someone is "on his/her way to the top". Those individuals are basing their states on perceived reality and using that to launch to the next IR.

  I could go on but it gets personal from here so I will refrain.

  edited to crosslink this thread which seems highly relative to this subject http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=25603&site=3
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  gravedancer

  In his book "Religion Explained: The Evolutionary Origins of Religious Thought" the author (Pascal Boyer) examines closely how brain synapses are important as to the fact that human beings have religion in the first place. It is only now, with recent contributions of the cognitive and neural sciences and evolutionary biology to the understanding of the nature and origins of the human mind, that we are in position to successfully provide such an explanation.

  Religion, he suggests, is a by-product of the way our minds evolved to negotiate the natural and, more importantly, the social world.
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  bigboi

  The only problem I have with idealism is that sometimes it prevents you from seeing things clearly. IOW, idealistic ppl,imo, often go through life with blinders on. That can be detrimental to a person. I agree with what gravedancer said basically. Reality is realative. There is a subject and some research by a doctor that is bieng discussed on another thread that gives evidence that lends some credence to the fact that basically how we view the world is largely a by-product of our brains trying to sort things out as we navigate through life.

  Situations and circumstances change all the time and they, to large degree, affect our perception of reality.

  ONE....

  bigboi
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  SixofNine

  One day one of my little nephews came up to me and asked me if the equator was a real line that went around the Earth, or just an imaginary one. I had to laugh. Laugh and laugh. Because I didn't know, and I thought that maybe by laughing he would forget what he asked me.
  -- Deep Thoughts
  by Jack Handey
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  jst2laws

  Billy,

  I like this kind of thread. You must be a peace maker at heart.

  Hope to seeing you this summer.

  Megadude,

  Very good. I agree completely

  I won't *necessarily exclude Christianity from being true just because I got conned by Jehovah's Witnesses, who claim to be Christian.

  I suspect many were Christians when they went into the organization
  but are no longer now that they left the organization. If it were not for the distrust and disbelief that results from being "conned" wouldn't we normally default to just being Christian again upon leaving? The fact that many do not could be evidence the WT changed them, or is still influencing. Horrible thought!

  But to be consistent with Billy's theme of varying reality, maybe this phenomenon is just the consequence the experience, of our spiritual growth.

  Jst2laws