Other Sheep question (page 2)

AnnOMaly

Hey wizzstick, somebody wrote in about that 1951 quote, questioning the 144,000 figure. LOL!

w52 1/15 p. 62 Questions From Readers

According to the article “Hated for His Name” in the September 1, 1951, Watchtower, hundreds of thousands of Christians died in the “ten persecutions” starting in Nero’s time, 144,000 dying in Egypt alone during one of the persecutions. How can this be harmonized with the Scriptural limitation of 144,000 placed on the number being in Christ’s body, and which position was the only one open to Christians during those centuries?—J.A., Dominican Republic.

The article did not class with any finality the individuals that died during these persecutions, but spoke of the results in a general way. Note that a key qualification was made in the case referred to in the question: “In the province of Egypt alone, 144,000 such professed Christians died by violence in the course of this persecution, in addition to another 700,000 who died as a result of fatigues encountered in banishment or under enforced public works.” The victims are identified as “professed Christians”, not Christians in fact. Many of those persons might have been caught in the wave of persecution, but may never have actually preached the truth or followed in Jesus’ footsteps, being only professed Christians. They knew the world they lived in was rotten and they were listening to the message of the Christians and willing to die for it even though not in line for the high calling in Christ Jesus. Many professed Christians today might be willing to die for their faith, but still not be Jesus’ footstep followers and meeting the Scriptural requirements for such.

Isn't that insulting to those who made the ultimate sacrifice for staying true to their Christian beliefs?

bats - thanks for the scan. I couldn't locate a Russell era quote.

wizzstick

WOW! Thanks AnnOMaly. Brilliant follow up.

That's incredible. People were willing to die as a Christian in horrific circumstances but get dismissed as professed Christians to save a theological belief.

Jaw on floor.

Crazyguy

The whole thing is pathetic, when one lies they have to lie some more to try to cover up the loose ends from the original lie. The 'other sheep' Jesus was talking about were or are the gentiles. All Christians are anointed. The great crowd come out of the tribulation and are like those that left Egypt with the Israelites. Christians of today and of the past are the symbolic 12 tribes that are spoke about in Rev. 7 and from them come 144k which are probably the martyrs that died in Jesus name over the century's. All are one flock and have one shepherd.

Dagney

Yep, the math is what got me. The house of cards began to crumble. When reading of the persecution of the early Christians, and the numbers , you knew that what and how they died so overshadowed anything that little group in NY ever could ever do. WT was full of BS in anything they explain...about anythng.

Skipping over the outstanding faith of the early Christians, Perpetua being my favorite, and highlighting the their own "sacrifice" ,(18 mths in jail?) was repulsive to me.

It's all in the math. Good find Ann. Sigh.

prologos

but tentatively they have admitted that the non anointed from 33 to Armageddon are their so-called."Other sheep". thusly:

Non-anointed = 12 tribes= earthly class outside the 144 000. August 15 WT 2009 page 8 par. 4.

since the sealing of the "anointed" will be finished just prior to Armageddon, not 1935,

WHEN DID THE SEALING START?

with the martyred, apostles, disciples of course. the 12 foundation stones.

but where were they sealed OUT OFF? the 12 tribes. Wt Februart 15, 1998, page 20 par. 10. so

There always were 12 tribes = earthly class=other sheep around since pentecost. according to HIDDEN Wt doctrine.

and of course these billions were PARTAKERS, other sheep all, except when Rutherford stopped that in 1935.

could not allow everyone get everlasting life without slaving can we?

salvation comes from placing wt,goldenage, not showing faith in Christs ransom by partaking. right?

Crazyguy

Nice find ANN, it really shows the exalted self righteous ass holes they really are, exactly what Jesus told us not to do!!!!

Vanderhoven7

marked

Crazyguy

Another contradiction worth mentioning is that, at first they thought the great tribulation started in 1914 and the of course the ones coming out of this great tribulation starting in the 1920's on were the Great Crowd. In 1960's they stopped the idea if the great tribulation already started and said it was a future event, so who are these members of the great crowd now?? They must be something or some one else, but who? Anointed followers of Christ? Nah the WT would never say that that would mean their leaders were now nothing special!!!!!

Listener

Wizzstick, your research on this is proving really worthwhile.

According to the WT those faithful men of old (pre 33CE) have the earthly hope of resurrection. This makes them of the same class as the other sheep yet Jesus said he was still to gather the other sheep, it makes no sense.

prologos

whizzstickcrazyguy all, you have this right.

If we look at the epic struggle for truth since Christ, the martyrs sacrifices,

the spiritual heights that was reached by

Galileo, nearly tortured to death by the Inqusition,

Keppler, disfellowshipped for his bible comments,

Copernicus, Newton hiding their bible comments.

the majestic music coming from their souls, bach, hayden, ---

the bible translators Luther, Tyndale, Wycliffe---

Just because their beliefs were at variance with current 2013 fresh light. dos not mean

They were Apostates. no,

Billions of partakers will go ahead of the ones WT has told to Pass the bread please, Pass the wine please.

Dont exercise faith, by partaking -- but try to gain salvation through FS, H2H reporting time.

distribute the "Millions that lived in 1918 will never die booklet".

Other Sheep question

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