Restrictive vs Permissive

LucidSky

Hardcore Dubs can be quite restrictive on their kids. They are simply following organization rules but try to impose them on their children: No school sports or activities for you and absolutely no parties with those evil, worldly corruptibles in your class. Oh, and you must never, ever be alone with someone of the opposite sex because the instant you are, you'll just be ripping each other's clothes off... I'm not sure if it was because they were in the spotlight more, but it seemed to me that the kids with the hardcore parents were the ones getting baptized early and then getting disfellowshiped or reproved a couple years later.

JW parents have huge issues of mistrust and they close the channel of communication because their children fear reproof. Why would you ever want to talk to your parents? They aren’t going to try to care and understand or even help you. They are simply upset with you and want to spit out council from the Society and take steps to make sure it never happens again. So the children often lead double lives and try to hide everything and then feel guilt-ridden and depressed about it.

Any personal observations or insights?

concerned mama

Lucid Sky, oh my gosh, that is one of the first issues that made me look into all this weird JW stuff. I am not JW, but my young daughter's boyfriend is. His rules are so rigid, yet he lives such a double life. He doesn't talk to his parents about what is in his heart, because there will be no communication or give and take. He gets away withgoing to all sorts of wild parties (without my daughter) by saying they are get togethers. They must not want to see or deal with him. He talks to me.

It was the DOUBLE LIFE that got me. His Mom telling me that JW kids were better behaved and more moral than worldly kids, which is why they couldn't mix with others so they wouldn't be corrupted, and at the same time, her then 14 year old son out till 2 in the morning drinking at parties with other older JW kids.

I would be more concerned about him corrupting my daughter, than her corrupting him. Of course, since his parents don't allow him to see her outside of school, I'm trying not to get in too much of a dither about it. He would be much safer and doing more age appropriate stuff hanging around with his worldly school friends and my daughter than doing what he does with the JW kids. Now, if they would only break up..........

I just don't get it.

JT

INTERESTING POST

i agree 110%

just an added point is also jw are concerned about IMAGE

HOW WILL IT LOOK
For i know many jw parents who would allow thier kids to do certain thing till one of the elders wives made a comment about it

and at that point the image factor kicks in- the constant focus on HOW IT LOOKS in my exp has been a driving force in the lives of so many jw.

the wt is so slick- many times they will not come out and say
NO YOU CAN'T, instead they will use buzz words to get the same results

"mATURE yOUTHS' "SPIRITUAL MINDED YOUTH""SETTING A FINE EXAMPLE"

"Loving parents" "it has been observed among many"

so while they never come out and say yes or no- they set the stage so that one can only come to one conclusion if they want to have the Groups approval.

as my old DO JC Howard used to say:

"WHICH WAY IS THE SOCIETY LEANING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

JT

I would be more concerned about him corrupting my daughter, than her corrupting him.

WELL STATED--

I would highly suggest that you have your daugther break off this relationship as soon as possible

you daughter can and will be influence by this religion in a manner that you will not know

as a former elder i have dealt with so many folks like your daugther who dated jw during their youth and heard something in discussion with the witness boy/girlfriend and it was years later, sometimes 20 yr later and when they have a problem in their life they recall that they were toLD go to the Kingdom hall

and years later they end up being some of the most ACTIVE JW you have ever met

so get her as far as you can from this guy- true he needs help ,but you don't want to sacrifice your daughter in the process

just my 2

email me if you like

[email protected]

james

concerned mama

Thanks, James, I will.

rhett

I just remember this family my sister was friends with back in the 80's. The oldest son was on the fast track to becoming an elder. He pioneered, worked cleaning jobs so he could go out in service more, was never alone with the good JW girls, all of that stuff. Then one night he snapped. After he finished cleaning he went to go play pool (as it turns out he was a bit of hustler) and snort some coke and went out of his mind. He went back to the car dealership, stole all the money in the place, trashed it, stole a car, decided he didn't want to put his family through what would happen because of it all and went back there while they were sleeping and set it on fire after pouring gad all over the place (luckily they got out). He was eventually picked up somewhere out west a few weeks later after wrecking another car he had stolen. Where is he today? An elder somewhere in Kentucky.
I also remember all the kids I knew from my old congregation in Owensboro Kentucy. Most of their parents were pretty strict about making sure they only spent time with other JW kids. Luckily I moved to Indiana at the start of middle school because I've turned out to be the only one that has never served any jail time or had an addiction problem. Those fine JW's youths served god and all turned out to be juvenile deliquents. Good thing those worldly kids didn't come in and corrupt them!
Oh yeah, concerned mama, get your daughter away from her JW boyfriend. I'm totally speaking from experience here because I was that guy at numerous points numerous years ago. Tell her to go date a nice normal boy who's not in a cult.

concerned mama

Both of you are right. I have said it a million times. This forum is helpful, so she hears it from others, here. She posted a few times a long time ago as Little Red Birdie.
But most of all, I am trying to teach her to think. Why is this nice, charming, sweet, infatuated boy, who is also such a close friend, so wrong for her? I think she is slowly starting to understand that certain of his less desirable personality traits are related to his upbringing and religion. That his family will never accept her, and allow him to see her without sneaking. But they are so attached to each other, and that is what scares me. I truely think he would leave the JW for her if he was older...but he isn't, so that is that. I just want it over.

If I just forbid the relationship, I am acting like a JW parent. I would lose all communication, and likely just cause outright rebellion. Instead I supervise, I talk, we talk, she talks, I show her this thread, we talk some more.......and I wait.

concerned mama

edited for clarity

dmouse

Even among Jws hardcore parents are looked down on to some extent. I remember a group of more relaxed JW parents talking about an elder and his strictness with his children; the group were unanimous in the opinion that his children would eventually rebel and leave the 'truth'; and they did, both of them.

My own son is a JW (sort of, it's complicated) and he has started to develop friendships in the 'world'. There is the added element that my son is desperate for 'normal' friends to balance out the psychobabble from the bros. It's possible that your daughter, concerned mama, is acting as a psychological lifeline for the boy.
Just a thought, 'cus I would hate it if my son was rejected by 'worldly' friends at this delicate time in his development. He has already suffered enough rejection due to his expressing doubts about his religion. His 'friends' at the hall have been ordered to not associate with him until he sorts himself out.

As you say, teach her to think and talk about the nonsense this religion promulgates - that, and you, will act as her protection.
I agree that in forbiding her you fall into the same trap as the JWs.

God, it's hard being a parent.

Dawn

LucidSky you are right on!!

That was exactly me as a teenager - my parents were so restrictive and I completely rebelled by leading a double life. I went to meetings and was a "good witness" when they were around, then snuck out with my "wordly" boyfriend, went to parties, started drinking at 17 and ended up pregnant and unmarried. What a mess!!

My little boy is now 16 and I am so glad that he is free from all of that. It's so great to focus on "what is the right thing to do" instead of "how will this look".

A while back I looked up some information on what the JW's think of school sports - all the stories were horror stories about how kids got into drugs, etc. because of the time they spent in extra-curricular activities and missed meetings. Well - my 16 year old has been in sports since 1st grade and only goes to an occasional meeting with his grandma to keep her happy. Guess what - they think he's so great at the KH that they've been asking my mom if he can spend time with their kids - they feel that my "wordly" 16 year old who is very involved in sports is somehow a good influence on their teenagers - isn't that funny?!!

Xander

Concerned....

Your situation sucks on a lot of levels. It's generally better to stop them before a relationship starts, but once it does....

Honestly, if he is living a double-life, I think it could be safely said he WOULD NOT leave the org for her. Since he isn't really 'in it' now. He has the thought that he can go to meetings, make a show of being 'in', and still live a wordly life. This will become harder to do when he becomes an adult, as he will be expected to make more of a presence in the hall or leave. Since his family is 'in', which way do you think he'll lean? ESPECIALLY if your daughter sticks with him now - he'll reason she can fake it just as well as he could....

What to do about it? Wish I knew. Best bet is to try and arrange things to create a confrontation - force the issue early. No idea how to do that, though.

Xander F
(Unseen Apostate Directorate of North America - Ohio order)
A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
--George Santayana

Restrictive vs Permissive

Share this