Does anyone have experience with de-programming a bible student

by His Excellency 7 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  His Excellency

  I have recently converted a bible student and He had just started out as an unpublisher publisher. However since knowing TTATT I have been looking for a subtle means to deconvert him without any problem coming out of it.

  This man had grown to have a strong fondness for the organisation and He is also in the process of indoctrinating his other two children, As his Bible study conductor, He put so much trust in me and believes everything I say.

  I am sure I can succeed in exposing the Watchtower?, But Has anyone tried it ?, Any Suggestion will be appreciated
• 

  jgnat

  Watch Steve Hassan's YouTube video for starts. If he put so much trust in you, could you mention that you are beginning to have doubts? Let him chew on that for a while. You mean unbaptized publisher, right?
• 

  villagegirl

  Recently is probably the key word here. He trusts you. He believes what you say.

  I know the concern you have. I converted many people over the 30 years I studied with people.

  But by the time I woke up they were already firmly entrenched for over a decade or more.

  When I made my messy and painful exit there was no such thing as anyone else to talk to or contact.

  It was pre-internet in the early 90's. Now as for this man - you know him inside-out

  and try to THINK - What "hooked" him ? In many cases it is the insular, feeling

  you are "joining a family" who will always love you.

  In my case my own family never made me feel as safe as I felt, in belonging" IN the Beginning

  That is where he is at now. This honeymoon soon dissolves to the reality of how people,

  escepially women are treated. MEN have a lot of perks remember. They get to be know-it-alls ,

  spiritual bullies, and they dress up like executives and insite fear in women and children.

  You will need to think carefully about how to replace his new found "social life". His new found

  feeling of acceptance. Its like trying to tell a young man in love the woman is not who he thinks she is.

  You need to provide a new hope, and new social life among really safe people, not just smash it all

  with a sledge hammer. The advantage of Crisis of Conscience is that it is written in the same soothing

  low key language that the WT uses and it gently unravels the doctrines,

  as does, Christian Freedom by Franz

  The trouble with many other books/videos is they have an axe to grind.

  You have to find the language that seduced him in the first place,

  and only you as a former believer can be a judge of that. The issues with

  the governing body claiming to be the 'sole channel of communication'

  is really a shocking thing when you realize they are replacing Christ as Mediator.

  Be careful of the various advice you may hear here.

  Think this through, pray it through and proceed carefully,

  don't just sit him down in front of a tape.

  This was personal. It is still personal.
• 

  His Excellency

  bump
• 

  likeabird

  I deprogrammed one of my students.

  They were very zealous/enthusiastic over what they were learning, coming to meetings, prestudying, etc, etc. They were not ready for baptism at the time I learnt TTATT, but I'm pretty sure they would have gone all the way.

  I did it the semi-direct way. They trusted me and I decided to trust them, because I knew if what I told them got back to the congregation, then I would be in big trouble.

  I turned up for our study (made sure I went alone). I showed my discomfort (it was hard to start talking) and explained that I had to speak to them, but that what I was going to tell them could create some extremely big problems for myself if certain people were to know about it. In that way I introduced the notion of disfellowshipping and to bring it home I explained that if their child (already a young adult) accepted this religion (as my study was always hoping they would) and then rejected it, they would no longer be permitted to speak to them. This opened their eyes as I could see their surprise and also they could also understand the risk I was taking in speaking to them.

  I explained that I was going to present them with some information that it was only fair for them to know about before they made any big decisions. They would remain free in their choices but there were some serious things they needed to consider in making those choices. I used a recent article that had been published in the WT on the Bible's authenticity. It was one of those secondary articles we often skip over, but its' being recent made it a perfect excuse to use it as the basis for the study that day. It was full of so-called "evidence" for the Bible's authenticity and chronology. We studied it paragraph by paragraph. I got them to read each paragraph and then asked them what the facts were in each. Very soon they saw how the WT was stringing us along with their so-called facts, and I just made sure they were picking up on it all.

  Having seen the unreliability of the chronology (thanks WT for the wonderful article) I then asked them to consider some other historic dates for different events in the Bible which together we then looked up on the internet (Wikipedia probably) to check what was happening in the world at those times (for the flood) and also the dates for Babylon (as we had recently studied this together before I'd woken up and I wanted to apologize for not checking the facts first).

  I then asked them what the point was in checking these things. I explained that if your going to make a life decision on something, don't you want to be sure of the facts first. I used my example as they knew I had given up many, many things in life to pioneer and serve "God". I said that if you are to sacrifice so much don't you think you need to check the facts first. Having already checked the above things together I suggested that it was possible I had given up my education, among other things, for nothing (knowing that education was very important for them).

  At the end I reexplained why I felt the necessity of speaking to them even though I was taking a great personal risk in doing so. I left it open for them to decide what they wanted to do and also to do draw their own conclusions. I only showed them the facts, never stating the WT was wrong, always emphasizing the importance of checking things and that there can be serious consequences if we don't.

  Unfortunately I never saw them after that, but they never came to another meeting while I was still attending and I have good reasons to believe that they still haven't gone back.

  After that I tried studying the same WT article with my other studies. One was unable to see through the borg reasoning, and being pressed for time on that occasion it was impossible to go further. While they enjoyed studying, they were too wrapped up in other things to take things further (unlike the above study) so since then I have kept contact with them. We call each other up regularly just to catch up. I may get round to explaining things further, if necessary, but I'm not sure they would know how to be discreet if they bumped into local dubs.

  In any case, while all my studies really enjoyed their studies and some were progressing, I made sure none of them continued their study, always covered for them when dubs who knew them asked how they were, and as far as possible, have also kept in touch with them.
• 

  Dagney

  I was successful in turning one who is now inactive.

  Do you know his soft spots? Children, blood issue, world conditions? For example: Children, no higher education, no outside activities, child baptism encouraged and poor retention rate as a result due to kids not making their own informed decision. Reversals in blood..."are you willing to risk the life of your child if a safe blood transfusion could save them? (refer to Boston/Newtown). World conditions getting worse? Not really...

  Good luck!
• 

  rebel8

  What is an unpublisher publisher?
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  twice shy

  I am deprogramming my children and a couple of family members. Flipping the switch and letting them see the dreadful downside of the coin is a real eye opener. Asking tons of what if questions is really helping them think. Biblically and casually breaking down the birthday, christmas, and a few other WTBT$ doctrines is a real eye opener.

  They get to see how unloving and uncaring the organiztion really is. How it judges, divides families, robs them of a healthy well-balnced life and will bleed them dry to their bare minimums if the person allows them too.

  ********************MEN have a lot of perks remember. They get to be know-it-alls ,

  spiritual bullies, and they dress up like executives and insite fear in women and children.

  Who would have ever thunk the Elders were big ole bullies in disguise.