This is a perfect example of how the cult mind-control fear, hate…etc works in the JW mind.
Sorry this is going to be a long post. These are emails from the 2 days worth of conversations, so it's going to be long.
This was a message I got from my cousin’s mom…This was the first email I got.
i was recently informed of your fathers recent visit to his mother and the volatile conversation he had with her and the apostate things he said about jehovah's organization. I did not talk to your grandmother and hear from her personally but through and reliable friend whom i trust explicitly that talked with her. Your mother, it seems ,is in agreement with your father. I am assuming that you and james are also since you are very close to them and you are also inactive. I am therefore going to defriend you and if or when you become active in jehovah's service, let me know..
Don’t you just love how she just assumed everything? Didn’t ask me if it’s true or not…but a reliable friend said "..." so she is assuming we feel the same way….I should clarify, I have been very careful NOT to say anything to any of my JW friends and family about thinking the WTBT$ is full of BS…Up to this point whenever I have talked to them, I still speak the JW lingo so as not to tip them off…So I have given NO indication of my feelings, everyone of the JW has assumed I’m bunched in with my parents.
This is email 2 I got from my cousin….
I guess the apostate thing is going around again. What the heck is going on??? Not so much your name that came up but more of your dads. My mom filled me in on some things she had heard and said she wrote you a letter and defriended you, but i was like, "did you even bother asking what was up?" So i am officially checking in with you, as a friend, your cousin and a concerned fellow sister in the faith, like you asked.
I have been very concerned about john and some posts he has made lately, more like comments on things he has shared. Not overly bad but definitely not something i would expect from a baptized christian. Nothing apostate by any means. And he IM'd Steve a while back about being disassociated or something along that line....we were both wondering what that is all about. You obviously know where we would stand on certain things if he did diassociate himself.
Anyway, write me back when you can and fill me in please.
Lots of love...
So not as in your face judgment as her mom’s email…but you can see how judgmental she is to my husband and she has already made up her mind if John did DA himself…. This was my reply to her….
Well...in case you would like to see what your mother said to me..here it is.
“….” I copied and pasted her mom’s email to me so she could see it, I cut it out to save your eyes…
I've been having a really bad time these couple of weeks and I'm just not even going to reply to her (Mom) or deal with her, because she has already made her decision. Because she has already made up her mind and NO MATTER what I say….I’m still the evil person and the lies are going to be believed no matter what because of the fear. I just don't have the strength anymore to deal with this BS. But please feel free to share this message with her.
You of all people know what happened when my family found out I'm inactive. INACTIVE because of a health problem that prevents me from meetings and service.....I would have thought you and your family OF ALL PEOPLE WOULD UNDERSTAND AND NOT BE JUDGEMENTAL!!!!!!!!! (the funny thing is, her family aren’t the best JW’s because of health problems too and they have complained to me about how the “friends” don’t care and there is no love.)
I've come to realize this rumor/gossip mill spreads poisonous lies that people believe at the drop of a hat. I know the conversation my dad had with his mother and he never once said anything apostate to her or against the organization (this is true)...so who is spreading these venomous lies? Sally?(my Grandma) Laura?(She is another family member) These are the only two I can think of...you of all people know how Sally has treated me and my family.
As far as John posting things that are questionable....don't point your finger at us, because I've seen Steve post things that a Christian’s shouldn't do. But you know what? I didn't judge him on what he does!!!!! And the only reason I’m bring it up now, is because you are demeaning my husband….Does not the bible say…Luke 6:42 “How can you say to your brother, ‘brother, allow me to extract the straw that is in your eye,’ while you yourself are not looking at the rafter in that eye of yours? HYPOCRITE!!!! First extract the rafter from your own eye, and then you will see clearly how to extract the straw that is in your brother’s eye.” Do I need to say more?
I think I do! Romans 1:28, 30 “And just as they did not approve of holding God in accurate knowledge, God gave them up to a disapproved mental state to do the things not fitting…BACKBITTERS, haters of god, INSOLENT, HAUGHTY, SELF-ASSUMING, INVENTORS OF INJURIOUS THINGS”
And to clarify, John and I have NOT, NOT, NOT, NOT disassociated ourselves. We are NOT, NOT, NOT, NOT disfellowshipped. Do I need to scream at the top of my lungs, at the top of the highest mountain for people to listen to me?
Do you really want to know what the real conversation was with my dad and his mom? He finally stood up to her and came down on her, using the bible, because of her treatment to me. And he asked her if she thought the bible was truly God's word, because she was the one NOT following the bible counsel at Matt 18 to settle matters when it came to me......and she was royally pissed off at him....
I'm so frustrated and tired of this GARBAGE!!!!! Yes I am very angry because John and I are getting accused of something we are not....And I have lost my WHOLE family on venomous lies, gossip and rumors.
It's sad, I'm to the point now I don't even care. People can just believe whatever they want, even if it's not the truth. I'm done! Delete me or do whatever you and your family want to do! Seriously! I've been doing some posts since last week about my head hitting the corner of the wall and getting a concussion and having a hard time and you nor your family has asked how I'm doing, I haven't gotten any emails from you to see how I am and THIS CRAP is what I come on here for? No Thank you! As far as I'm concerned you and your family are shallow and your love is shallow, I hear nothing from you for months and as soon as the word "apostate" is thrown out, you jump all over it. WHERE IS THE LOVE? All I see is fear, hate and judgment and those three things do not equal a TRUE follower of Christ! How do I know? "You obviously know where we would stand on certain things if he did diassociate himself.".....You already HATE and have JUDGED him and you don't even know for sure...you and your family have already metaphorically stoned us to death, without even giving us a fair trial. I also know this because your mom and Ryan have unfriend us without even giving us a chance, that my dear sister is HATE and FEAR!
I'M DONE! I don't need this headache or harassment!
Believe me or not, but I don’t hate you or your family. I actually pity you and I will be praying to Jehovah for his help to remove the judgmental attitudes, fear and hate from your hearts!
Christian Love!
Yes I know I hit below the belt and was very mean to her, but I know how JW’s think and being blunt and completely clear is the only way they will listen…plus I know where this is heading so I’m not holding back. I’ve held back for 29 years and for once in my life I am taking a stand..
This was her email back to me…
Wow.....i dont even know what to say. I wrote to see if any of this is true, because you never know. I wasnt being accusatory, more of inquiring and if you say its a lie and your not disassociated or disfellowshipped or apostate, then i believe you.
I actually did write you when i heard about your concussion but neglected to hit the send button again and erased my message. It was quite lenghty and I wasnt in a position to retype it at the time. (You could have at least said “hope your okay”)I was hoping to check in on you this week where i am back to my old schedule. I apologize if you feel i havent been as diligent in our relationship as you would have liked. I try make little comments here and there when you post things to let you know i am still involved and care.....i guess you are looking for more? (I do need to interject…I have not received any word from her since Jan…no comments on Facebook, no txt…nothing! So yes I would like more…Plus I hear nothing from her since Jan and this is what she emails me about..BS!!!!).
As far as john goes, you have admitted before he is involved in some off color games and you were working on it with him as he didnt have as good of a spiritual upbringing as you did. Based on what he wrote to steve and comenting on drunk sobrioty tests, little boys moms that go to heaven and saying "hell" in a post this past week, i was a bit concerned but in no way being accusatory at all. I was INQUIRING! (The games John was playing was two yrs ago and guess what they don’t bother me now that I realize the WT has to control over us. And the sobriety test was funny…it was a joke and she’s bring it up? And John said something was “funny as hell”…wow is all I have to say)
This is obviously a sensitive situation and if me asking is going to, which by the way you requested on your post to ask before judging, dredges up a bunch of negative feelings.....i guess i am at a loss of how to proceed??? Just to be clear, there was no judging in my part.....you have judged that i made a conclusion based on my mothers letter which i did tell her was pretty harsh and should have checked with you first as these are "rumors". I dont like being called back biting and a hypocrite when that was the furthest thing from my mind. (LIE, LIE, LIE)
With that being said i am not going to address the rebutal comments about steve because i see and know what he posts and if you have been offended by anything please let me know....i cant think of what it could be and have been racking my brain. Instead of taking the rafter out of our own eyes, i would rather be proactive and cut off the limb that is stumbling my brother, which is the loving thing to do instead of making excuses for bad behavior. (Oh god please do this…I want to see it!!!!! "Loving" my ASS!!!!! What I was referring to was her husband has been playing gambling games on Facebook…I really don’t care, but since she is being petty, why can’t I be petty back to her.)
I will have to think in this one and if i decide to defriend it is not because of the rumors. It would be because you obviously think poorly of me and why would you want to he friends with someone like that anywatly
This was my last and final email to her…..
You weren't judgmental? HAHAHAHAHAHA, I will admit your msg wasn't as in your face judgmental as your mom's msg, but Susie hon, you still were very much judgmental. I've been a JW going on 30 years now and I KNOW how to spot judgment because I've been around it my whole life. Don't try to back peddle now and claim to be all innocent.
And yes this is a sensitive subject for me, you clearly don't understand how this makes a person feel when they or their parents have done nothing wrong and get accused of being apostates.....Susie, some of what you have said is apostasy, I'm going to the elders, and now you lose the majority of your friends who won't even talk to you or give you a chance to defend yourself, and you lose Steve, your mom and dad and ALL of you friends.......how does that make you feel? You've said nothing apostate or have given any indication, but yet to have someone or a group of people now call you one....YES it hurts you deep! So yes I am sensitive to this right now...and you know what, so would you!!!!!!!! So don't sit there and try and lay a guilt trip on me and attacking me personally....that is what you have done...again I've been a JW for almost 30 years and I also know the guilt trips JW do. I'm not allowing anyone anymore to be judgmental or guilt me.
As far as what offended you that John did, did you even watch the "sobriety test? I'm thinking you didn't because you would have seen it was a JOKE!!!! and MOCK!!!! test. Again judgmental without even seeing it. John had a lot of his JW friends say how funny it was...so clearly it wasn't that bad!!!!
Him saying HELL....well damn it to hell I guess I'm going to have to talk to him.
As far as what Steve goes...it's some of the games he plays...but you know what...I don't care!!!!! I'm not judging him....
After this is when I deleted her as a friend because I was done…this was her “I have to say the last word” rant…
I agree, you have been around judgemental your whole life, because you obviously have no idea what true love and concern looks like. ( Is that what you call it?) From the moment we were in touch with one another, I felt a closeness with you,that at the time I was going through some hard things and you understood and where there to listen and I in return. I see YOU have defriended me, and that makes me very sad to be honest. I was hoping this whole thing would blow over. You said people didn't give you a chance to defend yourself, well why in world would I ever even write you in the first placce?!?!?!?! (Ah…because you are trying to find out if I really am an apostate so you can shun me…DUH!) You specifially asked if anyone had any questions about this situation to contact you, and that is what I did, I NEVER ONCE if you reread my message accused you. (She is forgetting that back in Jan, the last time I talked to her was just when my Grandma shunned me because I was inactive, and her husband and HER, said, “well if you are df’ed or Da yourselves…we love you but you know we can’t talk anymore” And that was just when I said I was inactive. I guess she forgot about that little bit of judgment.)
I hope this is brought before the elders, not so that you are disfellowshipped or removed from the congregation, but so someone can get down to the bottom of this and thwart the vicious lies, (Oh yes because we all know how loving and caring the elders are) because if this is Satan trying to rip a family and a congregation apart, then Jehovah will find the truth...and then I hope you find some peace of mind. (HAHAHAHA oh yes Jehovah will find the truth…oh there is that evil Satan again trying to break up families).
I feel playing Solitaire Blitz, Bingo, and Words with Friends is a far cry from violent war and sorcery games. (HAHAHA, oh really? What about the slot games he’s been playing also…War and sorcery games…John hasn’t played any of those in over a year..) Granted I have not played the games John has "liked" on his site (I don’t even know what the hell she is referring to here. The only game John has liked is Monster Hunter…it’s a hunting game!), I just see the logo and can see it is not appropriate. You have even said so yourself! maybe you should reread that message thread.(Again this was when I was under mind frelling. It doesn’t bother me now) I never said I was offended, I don't offend easily,(oh cry me a river you hypocrite!) but was concerned, yes. You obviously still have quite a few witness friends, so it doesn't sound like you've lot everyone. (Really, just wait until the rumor spreads to them…then see how fast they leave my facebook..they will spread like cockroaches….That reason is so stupid!)
When things have calmed down and you want to reopen a friendship, then I will let you to be the one to reach out. Until then, I feel a deep and unnecessary loss. (Really? I’m not…you never showed any real concern for me. As soon as you find out I’m an evil “apostate” you would throw me under the bus! You are going to wait for me to reach out and start our friendship again? Susie hon, we can never be close friends while you are still in a mind controlled cult!...It’s not you, it’s them!).
I know I was harsh at some points…but I just can’t stomach the fake love, and concern anymore….I wanted to share this because it's a good example of the JW mentality. I knew what the outcome was going to be with me "calling her out" on things, but I think most of us who are awake to things can show this to others to help them.
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