How Can One Understand Prophecy Today?

by MDS 42 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  larc

  mds,

  Your misapplication of the scriptures in Mark and Luke shows the shallow, sloppy uninspired work that you do and the evil words that it leads you to speak. All these scriptures had to do with harmful groups, where Jesus stated specic behavioral examples of their immorality. Since you know nothing about our behavior and can not cite behavioral examples, this simply means that your words are nothing but crude, uneducated slander, and a not so artful dodge on your part to avoid answering simple questions.

  bjc,

  I read your last post. You seem like a nice, thoughtful and loving person. God bless you.
• 

  RedhorseWoman

  Oh, my! I've been skimming these "epistles" for the last several days. MDS....you are losing it....big time. If you are seeking converts....followers....worshipers....whatever....this is NOT the way to do it.

  To those who are worshipping MDS (and, yes, BJC, JR, et all, you are worshipping him).....BE VERY CAUTIOUS IF HE OFFERS YOU KOOLAID!!!!
• 

  MDS

  It is written,

  Israel is going to reject "truth," just as you are doing...just as Israel rejected Jesus, the Messiah. No difference.

  John 15:22:

  "If I had not come and spoken to them, they would have no sin; but now they have no excuse for their sin."

  MDS

  "Behold it, you scorners, and wonder at it, ...YOU WILL BY NO MEANS BELIEVE even if anyone relates it to you in detail." -- Acts 13:41

  Edited by - MDS on 3 February 2001 22:45:6
• 

  Frenchy

  bjc
  Why won't MDS answer the questions I posed to him?
  You say you have been at this for ten years. I've been at it for well over forty. This is no game to me. MDS does not debate he preaches. He cannot answer what I have asked because then his true nature would be revealed. All he can do is ask more questions of me and refuse to answer mine. Is this fair?

  -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
• 

  Frenchy

  bjc
  Why won't MDS answer the questions I posed to him?
  You say you have been at this for ten years. I've been at it for well over forty. This is no game to me. MDS does not debate he preaches. He cannot answer what I have asked because then his true nature would be revealed. All he can do is ask more questions of me and refuse to answer mine. Is this fair?

  I just checked the other thread to see if MDS had replied there and like I expected, he did not. I showed where this 'second time' thing of his had other possible explanations. The explanations I presented have yet to be disputed by MDS or by anyone else here. Why is it that you can't see THAT? So when your leader is shown up all he does is start another thread and ignore the criticism. Didn't you get enough of that with the WTS?
  MDS could not refute my possibilites because they are real and consistent with what the Bible says.
  It's the same thing with his scapegoat thing. I can easily answer the question he posed but then he will jump on something else and his followers will jump right with him. This is not reasonable. The truth is reasonable.

  Edited by - Frenchy on 3 February 2001 23:28:7
• 

  larc

  mds,

  What does Israel have to do with anything? I'm not part of old Israel, our your hypothesized new Israel. I am not rejecting "truth" when it comes to you. I am rejecting falsehood and hate.

  I like that scripture in John, and to make a modern day analogy. Now that Larc, Frenchy, Wendy, and Ianao have spoken to you, you have no excuse for sin.
• 

  bjc2012

  Frenchy,

  I have been out of the organization for ten years. Had I remained, I would be marking fifty years as a JW this summer. So, no I am not a 'newbee.'

  As far as MDS answering your questions, I've never known him to avoid answering anybody. Under the thread dealing with prophesy having more than one fulfillment, as I read your post, I felt that some of the question you posed were due to your having misread some of his statements. He may have taken that as your not being serious, I don't know.

  Your statement about the possiblilty of there being Israelites living in Egypt before Jerusalem fell, I should have addressed in my post, but I forgot to do so. I agree that there were some living there but if you notice if you read Jeremiah 44: 24-30, Jeremiah told them that because they were busy carrying out vows to the 'queen of the heavens' that they would suffer the same fate as those who had recently disobeyed Jehovah about coming into Egypt. Verse 27 says: "Here I am keeping alert toward them for calamity and not for good; and all the men of Judah that are in the land of Egypt will certaily come to their finish by the sword and by the famine, until they cease to be." Verse 28 speaks about a few escaping the sword and returning to Judah but there is nothing said that would indicate that they would do this with Jehovah's help. In fact, they would escape the sword so that there would be witnesses to show whether 'Jehovah's word or their word comes true.' In verses 29 and 30, Jehovah gives them a sign saying; "Here I am giving Pharaoh Hophra, the king of Egypt, into the hand of his enemies..." So everyone in Egypt would now be under the control of Babylon. They would not escape captivity to Babylon.

  These ones, who escaped the sword in Egypt, would certainly be able to tell the captive Israelites that when Jehovah says don't go into Egypt, He means just that! He always leaves witnesses to His word coming true.

  If you've got questions on something that he posted that you want him to answer, that he has not answered already, then just ask them until you get an answer. That's what I do.

  bjc
• 

  mommy

  bjc,
  You mentioned in another thread, that after studying with mds you "saw" he had the answers. This is not good enough for me, many people belive in magic too. I have a couple questions for you.
  Scripturally answer them for me if you will.
  Why do you belief mds is the only one person on this planet that can interpret the bible?
  Why is it he only takes the first part of a verse and drags it over to another book in the bible and then attachs it to 1/2 a verse over there and this all fits?
  Is the bible written in books by different men supposed to all tie together? Kinda like me starting a sentence now and someone I don't even know 100 yrs from now ending it for me.
  Are you frightened of the ending(or way to the ending) spoken of by mds?
  Is there anything in his scriptures that excites you and you are looking forward too?
  Does mds encourage you to question him? Why do you have to ask several times?
  These are just a few questions I ask of you bjc. I hope you have the ability to thinnk on your own and answer them, and face no retribution from mds in doing so:)
  wendy

  Edited by - MOMMY on 4 February 2001 14:23:48
• 

  Frenchy

  I am not a 'newbee.'

  Very good then let us speak as adults. You know very well that MDS takes me seriously by the way he flew off the handle at what I said. Why did he say that he was able to answer my questions if he did not consider them? Why doesn’t he, then. It’s because he’s busy trying to formulate some sort of doublespeak that will take the heat off of him. So let’s not be making up excuses for his failure to respond. He finds time to spew forth more of his nonsense nonetheless, does he not? You people are all fired up to preach your message but as soon as it starts to get a little hot then you ‘forget’ to respond or you start new threads. Let’s try to do so without insulting people like your swami does.
  Now on with our business. This is what YOU said: “If Jehovah carried out His word and He always does, there was no Israelite left in Egypt to return when they were released from Babylon.” Emphasis added. I pointed out to you that there was evidence that there were indeed remnants left over in Egypt.
  Now you say, and I quote: “Verse (Jer 44:) 28 speaks about a few escaping the sword and returning to Judah but there is nothing said that would indicate that they would do this with Jehovah's help.” Didn’t you say that ”there was no Israelite left in Egypt to return?” Now after it is brought to your attention that you made a false statement, you are trying to acknowledge that there were indeed Jews in Egypt without coming out and saying that you were wrong. This is childish. This is WTS tactics. I suppose now you will try to make it appear as if I misunderstood your very plain statement. Well?
  Your words again: “In fact, they would escape the sword so that there would be witnesses to show whether 'Jehovah's word or their word comes true.'” So my question is : Did you know this before you made your erroneous statement?
  Again, a quote from you: “In verses 29 and 30, Jehovah gives them a sign saying; "Here I am giving Pharaoh Hophra, the king of Egypt, into the hand of his enemies..." So everyone in Egypt would now be under the control of Babylon. They would not escape captivity to Babylon.” –End Quote.
  No one said that they would not come under the control of Babylon.” I stated in my post that they would be part of those that would be called in for the repatriation of the land. Now where is your Scriptural reference that shows that every single Jew that was in Egypt was hauled off to Babylon? Where is your Scriptural reference that says that no Jew who was living in the surrounding area during the seventy years of desolation that may have moved into Egypt was instantly killed or hauled off to Jerusalem?
  In short have you found my replies to be without basis? Can you prove that what I said did not happen?
  

  just ask them until you get an answer. That's what I do.

  So he ignores you too until he can fabricate some sort of response. Same thing with the WTS.

  -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
• 

  Jr

  Hi all,
  Frenchy, I asure you MDS is not concerned about your remarks. He is just letting your remarks stir up questioins so that he can teach others. He is not taking your your comments personal. He is more concerned about others that are examining the scriptural content of his messages, regardless of what you say.
  Mommy,
  you said,

  Why do you belief mds is the only one person on this planet that can interpret the bible?

  This is a difficult question for me to answer and I can’t fully answer it in a seating, but I will try to lay a foundation. Being that I also believe MDS as the one spoken at Isa 49:1-6 . First of all, this scripture quotes Jesus as saying,

  "Never the less, I am telling you the truth, It is for your benefit I am going away. For if I do not go away, the helper will by no means come to you; but if I do go my way, I will send him to. And when that one arrives he will give the world convincing evidence concerning sin and concerning righteousness and concerning judgment: in the first place, concerning sin, because they are not exercising faith in me; then concerning righteousness, because I am going to the Father and you will behold me no longer; then concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged.
  “I have many things yet to say to you, but you are not able to bear them at present. However, when that one arrives, the “spirit of the truth”, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak of his own impulse, but what things he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things coming. That one will glorify me, because he will receive from what is mine and will declare it to you. That is why I said he receives from what is mine and declares it to you. “ (John 16:7-15)

  Now, I know we have been taught that this is the “holy spirit”, but is not. Because if it was then the disciples would have come into a full knowledge of the truth after 33C.E., but they didn’t. That is why Paul said,
  “For we have partial knowledge and we prophecy partially; but when that which is complete arrives, that which is partial will be done away with…….For at present we see things in a hazy outline by means of a metal mirror, but then it will be face to face. At present I know partially, but then I shall know accurately even as I am accurately known.” (1 Cor. 13:9-13)

  They did not have full knowledge of the scriptures or the prophecies in the first century. So, the question surfaces, “when did this full knowledge come about”? Even though you can’t understand everything we have learned, you can see that there is someone else that the scriptures is speaking about coming, if you examine it closely. If you can recognize this, then you are on your way to being lead by the spirit to learn more. It is an incremental process.

  I know, anybody can argue these things all day long if they want, but it will get you no where. Think about it! More to come……..

  Jr

  Edited by - Jr on 4 February 2001 17:4:43