Do not lie with a male as with a female - What does the bible REALLY teach? (page 5)

sseveninches

Saying that we shouldn't act on these desires is the same line of reasoning that watchtower uses for not only homosexuality, but also masturbation. It makes absolutely no sense. So I'm supposed to live a celibate life and not enjoy the pleasure of loving someone while everyone else around me does?

unstopableravens

seven inches , if you want to live under the lordship of christ than yes,if you chose not be with a women, a person who surrenders there life to christ lives to do gods will, which does not includ fornication,adultary ,extortion etc... im just telling you the truth about god and his word, i dont make the standard they are gods. but i will repeat god does not hate the person he hates the sin, but yes the bible descirbes it as un natural. i dont know what its like to have feelings like that, so i cant say i know how you feel,but what i do know is i have had strong desires, porn ,smoking etc.. and god has helped me alot. but i love ppl of all backgrounds, and i do not agree at all with ppl as westboro.

irondork

unstopableravens: ... and yes i believe they also can in some cases be so radically changed that those desires are in a sense dead. not functioning.

With all respect, your statement is the result of having recycled things you have heard others say, likely an elder... or a Watchtower, without doing an ounce of research on the subject, whatsoever. There are many who promote that philosophy. Most of those people you will find at the forefront of anti-gay organizations like ex-gay ministries and religious entities who seem to think all authority for judging has been granted to them. Everyone else just seems to enjoy parroting those talking heads.

Unless you find yourself quite content to simply repeat what you have heard, as if with authority, I encourage you to read TORN, by Justin Lee (recently released). He eloquently examines the ex-gay theories and record, exposing them for what they really are. You will find they have about as much credibility as the governing body of the Watchtower corporation.

unstopableravens

iron, sorry buddy but why would i repeat something from the wt? does that sound like me, im just giving you what the bible says, if the wt say something close, than thats them, sorry but me and wt no thanks

Finkelstein

So I'm supposed to live a celibate life and not enjoy the pleasure of loving someone while everyone else around me does?

In the vain self assuming attempt to place the power of god into their own hands ( Power and Judgmentalism ) religious leaders

such as from the JWS, homosexuality is an inherent sin directly from Adam, just like mental retardation and blindness is.

The only direction this religion therefore is going to profess is that you have to impede your genetically prone desires and wait

for the return of Christ and his new world order, where all bodily imperfections are finally removed from mankind.

If that entails you to be celibate and single all your life then so be it, consider this a test of your faith toward god !

Unfortunately because of this dogmatic doctrine, many gay JWS have proceeded to want a relationship with people of their own

predisposition eventually making them undesirable cast offs from their own family members, accumulating some to actually

commit suicide.

But like the other indirect deaths that this organization has caused in its history by its established doctrines, they apathetically

look the other way, washing themselves off of any of their own socialized entailing involvement.

irondork

unstopableravens: ... and yes i believe they also can in some cases be so radically changed that those desires are in a sense dead. not functioning.

Sorry. A statement like that just sounded a lot like a religion I used to bow down to. I shouldn't have been so quick to reattach you to it.

Nevertheless, you will not find the notion of one's sexual orientation, hetero OR homo, becoming "in a sense, dead" or "not functioning" due to lack of sexual activity, prayer, percieved unnaturalness or wishful thinking of the larger culture.

It's just not in there.

unstopableravens

the point i was making is that when a person is born again gods spirit will not allow them to practice sin 1 john 3;9,10 and and for me personally my desire has changed i now hate porn which at one point i loved , so is the temptation there yes it is, so i believe god is powerful and strong, and i understand i was a hardcore jdub too ,my scars are deep so i understand.

J. Hofer

porn again christians...

unstopableravens

j hofer now you want be a christain huh? lol

mrsjones5

Unstop,

" In answer to your question, no I do not believe that once a person is saved he lives a life on earth without sin. The Bible doesn't teach any such doctrine and in fact it teaches the very opposite. One of the primary passages dealing with the believer's (that is, those who are saved) attitude and position on sin is 1 John. This epistle was written to first century Christians and addresses the concepts of sin, believers and nonbelievers. Verses 6 and 7 state "If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and do not know the truth: but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanseth us from all sin." The above passage shows that those who are believers will not be in habitual sin - with the idea of walking in the darkness having a connotation of intentional, repetitive disobedience.

However, John follows these verses with "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." Here, the apostle says that Christians who claim to be sin free are deceiving themselves and he calls into question their very salvation for making such a claim! You see, the idea of being born again means that we should be transformed day by day into the image of Christ. Although we should strive for perfection (Matt. 5:48), it doesn't mean that we'll be perfect. When we're born again we receive a new, godly nature (Eph. 4:24), but our old nature also still exists. Paul talks about this in Romans chapter 7 when he says "For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not... For I joyfully concur with God in the inner man, but I see a different law in the members of my body waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members." (vss. 18,21) Here we can see how even Paul struggled with sins in his own life, but he knew he was saved and he would be victorious one day.

This is why Paul makes such big deal about God's grace in the book of Romans. He writes "But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him." (Rom. 5:8-9) He also says "Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have obtained our introduction by faith into this grace in which we stand." (vss. 1-2) Paul knows that he cannot stop sinning, but he rejoices in the fact that God will forgive him of his sins through grace. Grace means that we can be forgiven.

So, since Christians are saved, does that mean that they can sin whenever they want? No, it doesn't. Paul makes it clear that Christians don't have a free ride either. Right after he wrote the verses mentioned above, he said "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase? May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?" John also shows that sin shouldn't be taken lightly, but needs to be confessed by the Christian "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (1John 1:9) As I said at the beginning of this letter, Christians should strive for perfection, even though they know they won't attain it. Jesus sums this up best when He said "If you love me, you will keep my commandments." (John 14:15)"

Do not lie with a male as with a female - What does the bible REALLY teach?

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