Transubstantiation?

by leavingwt 64 Replies latest jw friends

  • John_Mann
    John_Mann

    The substance of the bread and wine are transformed. But the physical aspects (accidents) are the same. They remained the same because it was the same with Christ, his body was human, material. But he was God at the same time, but if you saw him you would see a man like any other.

    In the Eucharist three things happen : sacrifice, resurrection and glorification.

    It's a kind of time travel because it's not a different sacrifice but the same one at the Cross. Because that was an eternal act, the eternity in Catholicism it's not an infinite amount of time but a timeless moment. The sacrifice of the Lamb goes eternally to future and past in our spacetime.

    Way before Einstein the Eucharist already have the concept of relative time. Even if one does not believe in this it must have to admit that this was a very sophisticated concept to be created so long ago.

  • eyeuse2badub
    eyeuse2badub

    Wasn't there an "anonymous committee of dedicated christian men" who transubstantiationed the NWT?

    just saying!

    eyeuse2badub

  • shepherdless
    shepherdless
    John Mann - The substance of the bread and wine are transformed. But the physical aspects (accidents) are the same.


    Yes I was brought up as a Catholic as well, and was taught something similar. In simple terms, the bread and wine is said to have been transformed, but the transformation is undetectable. Using fancy words such as "transubstantiation" makes it sound sound more profound and gives the concept an air of credibility.


    Question for John Mann: what is a difference between a "transformation" that is not physically observable, and a transformation that is said to only occur symbolically?

  • Earnest
    Earnest

    Quite what Jesus meant when he said "TAKE, eat. This is my body" (Mat.26:26) I do not know and cannot explain. I am no Aquinas. However, in the passage which shocked his disciples (John 6:60) he not only uses the verb to eat (John 6:50-53) but also the verb to gnaw or chew with a crushing sound (John 6:54,56-58) which would normally apply to meat.

  • John_Mann
    John_Mann
    Question for John Mann: what is a difference between a "transformation" that is not physically observable, and atransformation that is said to only occur symbolically?

    A non physical transformation still is a transformation.

    Deniers of transubstantiation doesn't say a transformation takes place. Symbolically or not.


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