Early Civilizations and Bible Chronology...Part 2

by xelder 29 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • xelder
    xelder

    Lars,

    I post the following in all sincerety.

    I have sincerely tried to search for God for 50 years. I have "groped for him to really find him". I have done so from an intellectual search, and from simplicity. I have prayed to Jehovah, prayed to Jesus, asked him to take over my life, to be used in any way he chooses. I have asked from the dark, dreary, basement of emotional lows when I begged to not have to wake up and face the following day. GOD DOES NOT TALK TO ME. HE DOESN'T GIVE A RAT'S ASS. (emphasis not yelling)

    You "have more direct contact with the Holy Spirit"? It is not my place to doubt you, I respect you. But I don't get it if you are right.

    Either I have a horrible heart and God "saves whomever he chooses"-Romans

    Or, God is partial, in spite of Peter's claim otherwise as he began to convert Gentiles.

    I'm glad that you have a confident spiritual place to be. God loves the "smart" ones and the simple right? But, as in the caves discussed, even though science admits an error factor in their calculations. They are quick to point out errors and dispute them and admit a range of dates. As for me, I see much less honesty when discussing issues with religuos people. And ultimately, the throw in the "well God tells me" line. It doesn't help the discussion advance. It's the same as the blindfolded GB sitting around on Wednesday morning throwing darts at a doctrinal dartboard.

    Again, this is just me. I do respect your views and thanks for the comments. You sound like a great friend.

  • Knowsnothing
    Knowsnothing

    AnnOMaly, does the Bible really allow for a middle way? What of the lineage of Jesus all the way to Adam?

  • EntirelyPossible
    EntirelyPossible

    Think of the flood story like a gummy penis and scientific dating like MY penis. Mine, like dating, may shrink and grow depending on circumstances and knowledge, but wre know for sure it isn't a gummy penis.

  • AnnOMaly
    AnnOMaly

    AnnOMaly, does the Bible really allow for a middle way?

    As far as the Flood story goes, yes, I think so.

    What of the lineage of Jesus all the way to Adam?

    It's a pickle, it surely is. I haven't sorted it all out in my head yet to be able to pontificate like I do on other subjects

  • designs
    designs

    Was God's seed a Dicot or a Monocot.

  • Goshawk
    Goshawk
    Was God's seed a Dicot or a Monocot.

    I think some would have you believe it is a tricot. ;-)

  • Larsinger58
    Larsinger58

    I hear what you folks are saying. I try to see both sides. But when the critical evidence is considered, like archaeology, that is, proof of "written history" the evidence of "written history" doesn't date back farther then when the Bible says it does. That's what make me question all this pseudo-science, claiming man was on all fours for millions of years and then suddenly right at 3000 BC civilizations are building great cities and exploring astronomy and writing and everything else. So something is wrong.

    Then we have a chance to use C14 which is not reliable past c. 1600 BC. But post 1600 BC when we make critical comparisons of excellent samples now in place for destructive levels, we find critical Biblical accuracy.

    So I just have decided not to be dogmatic about science and its dating methods prior to the Exodus or the time of the MBA fall of Jericho. I don't know, I'm not a scientist. All I can say is that this contradicts the Bible's timeline which limits the life of man to less than 6000 years at this time, something we can't probe with C14.

    In the meantime, scientists don't know what happened in the ancient past or what effects the water canopy had on the elements. So that's always a factor in these presumptions. Who knows if the speed of light was always what it is now? We don't.

    In the meantime, while this might challenge those who want to believe the Bible, the elect have more direc5t evidence of God now through holy spirit and the individual appearance of the "sign of the son of man" of which the WTS is clearly quite aware of. The second coming messiah is one chosen from the elect, which the Bible describes as the prodigal son, Lazarus, and an imperfect man, proven by the WAVE OFFERING at Pentecost being one with leaven. So there is no choice. Further 1947 requires the messiah to appear in 1992. We don't need to figure out the lies of ancient governments about their kings or other events to establish wihen to expect the second coming.

    I just happen to be THAT PERSON who was chosen to embody the identity of the Christ at the second coming. The Bible gives details of my past struggles, including leaving God and thus becoming a DEAD MESSIAH for a while. All the while the "eagles" the elect are watching and when they see the "sign of the son of man" which is a dead black child, then they "beat themselves in lamentation." So the entire context of the second coming revolves around a dead messiah at some level. It's rigtht there. "Where the CARCASS is, there the eagles will be gathered together."

    So the elect, who followed my entire life, also witnessed my spiritual demise and mourned over me. How could someone so devout leave God? It was the confusion of the gay-transgender issue for me. I couldn't be whole-souled without believing who I was was real, and that meant accepting my female identitity. So I left the truth to try to resolve this and end my misery. Of course, that was after I tried to commit suicide I was so miserable at one point.

    In the end, I realized I loved the Bible and being in God's favor more than being unhappy living an immoral life. It took a lot, but I did conquer my sexual addictions. I came back to Jehovah. I moved to a place where no one knew me, Duarte, California. I had been reinstated 3 years earlier but was inactive. I couldn't function in the congregation where everyone knew my past and knew I was gay. I dreaded going to the rest room thinking some young boy would come in there at the same time and how some would be concerned about that. I had a new fresh start now. But during the Summer of 1992, Jehovah started revealing things to me in the Scriptures and it was clear the WTS was not teaching the truth in some matters. I became one of the anointed eventually and then ended up being inspired to point out some false teachings the WTS was maintaining, but in the process of the writing under inspiration, the next thing I knew, the GB was getting "disfellowshipped." This fulfilled the prophecy that the "man of lawlessness" must first be revealed before the second coming. The letter was written on November 10th. It ended another symbolic 1290 days. The second coming, which was when Christ in heaven became one with me, occurred 45 days later on December 25, 1992, 3.5 days late as prophesied by the "two witnesses" who had to be killed by the UN, the beast out of the abyss. Of course, the WTS was part of the UN at that time, joining officially in early 1992! So the actions of the WTS was the same as the actions of the UN. The original planned date for the 2nd coming was the solstice, Dec. 21. UN agents/Freemasons interfered with this using their occult alchemy (i.e. inhaled drugs to prevent sleep). This killed the two witnesses for 3.5 days. That is, their preaching had to halt about the 2nd coming on Dec. 21. But they were not buried, meaning they were still active at some level in regards to the second coming occurring 3.5 days later, which it did. Of course, it is interesting that then president Fred Franz died the very next day. Executed by Jehovah for his helping the UN interrupt the 2nd coming on the 21st? I believe so.

    Anyway, finally after becoming the messiah, Jehovah could hardly play behind the shadows so I got to meet and have an interview with Jehovah himself. It was real. Of course, being the messiah, maybe I needed this direct contact to dismiss the propaganda that Satan has come up with, like this expanded chronology or geology some claim does not support the Flood.

    People will be persuaded by this propaganda of Satan. It is so powerful it might even fool the elect, but they have direct evidence of God now, through both holy spirit and the appearance of the "sign of the son of man" which appears shortly after the State of Israel is set up. You only have to read the Bible.

    So now where are we? We are where the Bible says that Christ will COME AS A THIEF IN THE NIGHT, to those not watching! Didn't I? People are looking for the return of Christ and I arrived nearly 20 years ago!

    My position is that I have to admit who I am when I'm directly asked. But in the meantime, I point out in the Bible the manner and dating of the second coming. Christ returns in the flesh, in an imperfect body to fulfill the 2nd wave offering with leaven. You can see in Revelation the messiah is born from a woman fleeing from Satan, meaning Christ's bride, meaning one of her members, meaning an imperfect man. That infant is caught up to heaven to combine with the Christ, Michael the archangel. In this way, the messiah enters the flesh again as the "son of man." Christ must come through someone, another person, a descendant of Adam, to be the "son of man." He didn't just come down to earth the first time. He came through Mary. This time, he enters through me. It's just that simple. And completely Biblical.

    So now we're at the point where something is going to happen and everybody looking at this will have to conclude I must really be the messiah. I don't know what that will be, maybe some miracle in connection with me. Then, of course, like in Noah's day, everyone will want to congratulate me and get saved. But it's too late. When I'm "revealed" to the world, it will be after the door is closed. Remember, everybody in the flood of Noah's day was a believer! Everybody was a believer when it started to rain. So when it starts to rain in our day, everybody willl know I'm the true messiah. But the Bible already points to me. Why didn't you get it based on what the Bible says? The prodigal son. Lazarus the male prostitute? It's all right there. All the details of my life, however, embarrassing. But a DEAD messiah is very much part of the 2nd coming and also the "sign of the son of man" that causes the elect to mourn over the sight of this dead black child. That ME. I couldn't handle being gay and a JW so left my faith. Then I wanted back in. When Jehovah saw me coming back, he made me the messiah, just as the parable of the prodigal son shows. He chose me, forgave all my past sins, over all those who had been faithful. Shocking. But isn't that what the BIBLE explains?

    What is low becomes high. That's me becoming the messiah. What is high becomes low. That's the glorious GB now being apostate.

    So at this point, I'm done! All I can say is that yes, in 1992 I became the Biblical messiah, and I have a personal request in to Jehovah to coordinate the beginning of the millennium with the end of the Mayan age calendar, which is based on the "baktun" which is 144,000 days long.

    What we are watching for is the UN to take over world rule, that must occur before Armageddon. So are we close to that? A global economic disaster might require it. All the elemets are in place. The Bible is true and that's all there is to it. If Armageddon does occur this year, then it will mean the messiah will have had to arrive many years earlier in the flesh. So where is this "Ethiopian eunuch" progidal son Lazarus messiah?

    Here I am. SURPRISE. Sorry I was such a thief in the night, but I had to fulfill that too!

    Gotta run.

    P.S. You can deny the Bible or me all you want to for as long as you can. But one day, you will not be able to deny either the Bible or me. Reality will have caught up with all of us.

    LS

  • designs
    designs

    We should carbon date the schrooms you take.

  • transhuman68
    transhuman68

    I'm just glad Lars is on an island- and there's an ocean between him and me...

  • Flat_Accent
    Flat_Accent

    Lars, im not sure where you got your ideas on dendrochronology, but that dating method can now accurately measure a trees age to 8000+ years.

    Tree-ring studies have been a staple of anthropological investigation in the American Southwest since the early decades of this century and in Europe since World War II. The bristlecone pine chronology of the American Southwest now exceeds 8500 years with the possibility that up to 3000 floating years will be added in the reasonably near future. The European oak and pine chronology, a composite of work done in Germany and Northern Ireland, is now over 11,000 years long.
    Source: http://www.arts.cornell.edu/dendro/ajatext.html

    Considering the flood was only 4000 years ago, these trees have done considerably well to survive for so long - and not to show any evidence of a flood in their rings. But that's another topic.

    Seeing as most JW's dont have qualms with dendrochronology, I thought this small section of an article on corior would be of interest, to show that other dating methods are applied. For example, Ice cores.

    For example, the eruption of Mount Mazama that formed Crater Lake in Oregon had been dated by the mid-1960s by radiocarbon methods to between 6500 and 7000 years ago. A direct count of layers in ice cores from Greenland, in which ash from the eruption was found, gave a date of 4401 B.C., or 6391 years ago, not all that far from the radiocarbon dates, and in fact consistent with findings from tree ring studies that radiocarbon dates tend to be somewhat older than actual dates. Human artifacts have been found under ash from this eruption. A 1979 Scientific American article said: 56

    .... tests showed that tephra layers found at certain archaeological sites came from Mount Mazama.... One of the archaeological sites was Fort Rock Cave.... Under the tephra [were] found sandals made of sagebrush bark, one of which was dated by carbon-14 analysis and found to be some 9000 years old.

    I'd recommend you give the whole article a read.

    Oh and from johnnyc's comment about the water canopy altering dates - although a canopy would give incorrect dates for C-14 methods, there would have been other inconsistencies which we don't see. For example, besides dendrochronology - thermoluminescence dating, fission track dating, amino-acid dating, and uranium/thorium dating confirm C-14 dates for humans at the last ice age (i.e. about 21,000 years ago for the glacial maximum) within 20%. If the canopy had existed up to 4000 years ago this would not have been the case since all of the above, with the possible exception of thermoluminescence dating, are unaffected by the presence or absence of cosmic rays.

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