I have a question, please re Matthew 24:45

by N.drew 15 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • N.drew

    One of the most interesting aspect of Bible i have found is pronouns.

    All I know about foreign language I get off the internet.

    So my question, for them who know, is the "who" at Matthew 24:45,

    does it imply "which one?" or does it tilt toward "describe".

    In other words does it mean, identify, or does it mean, getting a profile.

    In English we can say "who" is that person in the crowd?

    And we can say "who" is he, after identifing him apart from the crowd.

    Are you all going to ignore me again and again and again?

    Cry me a river.

    What's it mean,?pretty please!

    Is it simple or complex? Don't guess. I need to know, please. Thank you.


  • N.drew

    Cry me an ocean.

    You do know that you can say you don't know.

    It is allowed.

  • tec

    Who is the faithful and discreet slave/wise servant?

    The passage answers its own question in the following sentence:

    The ones in charge of the other servants in the master's house, giving them food at the proper time. Applied with Christ's words to Peter - 'feeding His sheep'.

    Anyone can say that it is them (church leaders, priests, elders, etc...)... but they of course should beware of being the slave who has begun to beat the other servants - instead of serving.



  • N.drew

    Right, I mean, what is the essence of the word "who?".

    I can say "I am". Does anyone know if anyone else has attributed that scripture to themselves?

    Thank you tec!

  • Greybeard

    Jesus spoke using parables all of the time as we all know. Matthew 24:45 is talking about a type of slave not a specific slave revealed 1900 years later. What ever the case, the Bible students were not "wise" or "discreet" according to the Watchtower itself. If a JW were to believe most of what they taught back then they would be disfellowshipped. What did the "food at the proper time" they served really amount to? False prophecies and tongue lashing their brothers with hateful speech. Has anything changed? They continue to put forth hate speech and condemn all who do not swallow every last drop of their "food at the proper time". The words of Gods messengers come true as Isaiah 44:26 tells us speaking of YHWH, "... the One making the word of his servant come true, and the One that carries out completely the counsel of his own messengers." How can this group claim to be Gods messengers? It is truly laughable!

  • N.drew

    Isn't the "faithful and discreet" the Holy Spirit?

    Doesn't the verse at 48 knock you off track?

    Maybe it is because this came true;

    Jehovah's Day will come as a thief.

    So to me "who" means "taking in knowledge of the True God and the one sent forth"

    And at verse 48 "that" means that it is who led astray from "taking in knowledge..."

    The anti-christ, or more literally the ones saying not you Jesus, US. US be god.

    I know, mores the pity. Big SIGH.

    Thanks Greybeard!

  • Greybeard

    These are "types" of Christians and the wheat grow with the weeds. You have those who are "faithful and discreet" and you have those who say, "my master is delaying" and beat their fellows slaves. The Watchtower started beating it's fellow slaves soon after 1914. Likewise they have focused beatings on fellow slaves after every failed prediction. Now we are feeling the beating because of the generation change. If the GB really believed it's own teachings they would have stuck with the generation teaching down to the end just like Russell stuck with 1914. The truth is, the 1914 generation is not dead yet. They changed the understanding in essence saying "our master is delaying" and have proceeded to beat their fellow slaves again! They don't believe their own teachings and do not stand by them!

  • Quarterback

    I always thought that verse to be a good question. "Who really is the 'faithful and discreet slave?"

    I'm still looking...got a bit distracted...back on course.

  • AGuest

    The answer to the "who" of the question can be found in the following scriptures/verses, dear N.drew (peace to you!):

    As to the "faithful and discreet" slave -

    “So now let Phar´aoh look for a man discreet and wise and set him over the land of Egypt. Let Phar´aoh act and appoint overseers over the land, and he must take up one fifth of the land of Egypt during the seven years of plenty. And let them collect all the foodstuffs of these coming good years, and let them pile up grain under Phar´aoh’s hand as foodstuffs in the cities, and they must safeguard it. And the foodstuffs must serve as a supply for the land for the seven famine years, which will develop in the land of Egypt, in order that the land may not be cut off by the famine.” Well, the thing proved to be good in the eyes of Phar´aoh and of all his servants. So Phar´aoh said to his servants: “Can another man be found like this one in whom the spirit of God is?” A fter that Phar´aoh said to Joseph: “Since God has caused you to know all this, there is no one as discreet and wise as you are. You will personally be over my house, and all my people will obey you implicitly." Genesis 41: 33 -40

    "May YOU have undeserved kindness and peace from “The One who is and who was and who is coming,” and from the seven spirits that are before his throne, and from [Jesus] Christ, “the Faithful Witness,”... Revelation 1:4, 5

    As to the "Householder" -

    “Hear another illustration: There was a man, a householder, who planted a vineyard* and put a fence around it and dug a winepress in it and erected a tower, and let it out to cultivators, and traveled abroad. When the season of the fruits came around, he dispatched his slaves to the cultivators to get his fruits. However, the cultivators took his slaves, and one they beat up, another they killed, another they stoned. Again he dispatched other slaves, more than the first, but they did the same to these. Lastly he dispatched his son to them, saying, ‘They will respect my son.’ On seeing the son the cultivators said among themselves, ‘This is the heir; come, let us kill him and get his inheritance!’ So they took him and threw him out of the vineyard and killed him. Therefore, when the owner of the vineyard comes, what will he do to those cultivators?” Matthew 21:33-40

    “I am the true vine, and my Father is the cultivator. Every branch in me not bearing fruit he takes away, and every one bearing fruit he cleans, that it may bear more fruit." John 15:1, 2

    “The kingdom of the heavens has become like a man, a king, that made a marriage feast for his son. And he sent forth his slaves to call those invited to the marriage feast, but they were unwilling to come. Again he sent forth other slaves, saying, ‘Tell those invited: “Look! I have prepared my dinner, my bulls and fattened animals are slaughtered, and all things are ready. Come to the marriage feast. But unconcerned they went off, one to his own field, another to his commercial business;but the rest, laying hold of his slaves, treated them insolently and killed them. But the king grew wrathful, and sent his armies and destroyed those murderers and burned their city. T hen he said to his slaves, ‘The marriage feast indeed is ready, but those invited were not worthy. Therefore go to the roads leading out of the city, and anyone YOU find invite to the marriage feast.’ Accordingly those slaves went out to the roads and gathered together all they found, both wicked and good; and the room for the wedding ceremonies was filled with those reclining at the table. When the king* came in to inspect the guests he caught sight there of a man not clothed with a marriage garment. So he said to him, ‘Fellow, how did you get in here not having on a marriage garment?’ He was rendered speechless. Then the king said to his servants, ‘Bind him hand and foot and throw him out into the darkness outside. There is where [his] weeping and the gnashing of [his] teeth will be.’ Matthew 22:2-13

    *The KING inspects, not the SON for whom the "man/king" had the feast prepared...

    Christ, the Holy One of Israel, is the "discreet" servant... "Joseph"... that "Pharaoh" (the Most Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies)... places over ALL of His "belongings" (Matthew 28:19)... to give them their "food" at the proper time ("I have many things to tell you... but you are unable to bear them, yet"). In turn, "overseers" were also appointed to COLLECT and SAFEGUARD the "foodstuffs". However, only JOSEPH could "distribute" it (decide who gets it). Thus, he would determine the allotment... as well as to whom and when it would be distributed. It was and is only by HIS "order"... than those of the household are "fed." He is the only One appointed over ALL of the Master's "belongings."

    The Most Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies... is the "Householder", the "owner" of the "belongings"... all of which He enstrusted to His Faithful and Discreet servant, Christ, His Son.

    The "evil slave"... are those who the Faithful and Discreet Slave... the SON... assign to carry out the "distribution"... to make sure those of the "household" RECEIVE the "food" he has designated for them. They are those who "shut up the kingdom of the heavens"... who "beat" their fellow slaves... because they believe the Householder to be delaying.

    I hope this helps, dear one, and again, peace to you!

    YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,


  • minimus


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