THOUGHT EXPERIMENT: What if the Governing Body ... ?

by 00DAD 30 Replies latest jw friends

  • leavingwt

    But the GB members MUST know these things and yet still they won't admit to their error! Why?

    I know that many here disagree with me, but I accept Ray Franz's opinion on this topic. Moreover, his opinion coincided with what I saw at Brooklyn Bethel. Those guys are victims of victims. They truly believe that they are doing God's work.

  • ABibleStudent

    Leavingwt - I know that many here disagree with me, but I accept Ray Franz's opinion on this topic. Moreover, his opinion coincided with what I saw at Brooklyn Bethel. Those guys are victims of victims. They truly believe that are doing God's work.

    Besides that they were/are victims, I wonder if they have gotten so caught up in the details of running the organization against all the perceived persecutions/challanges that they have not taken time to reflect on whether they truly are following the teachings of Jesus Christ. The GB have psychological blinders because they were raised JW. Sadly, thought reform, fear, self-interested greed and power, and envy can be very self-perpetuating.

    Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,


  • Mad Sweeney
    Mad Sweeney

    I am currently re-reading CoC, Leaving, and have just finished the chapter on the Malawi v. Mexico situation. A question that keeps popping into my mind is this:

    Assuming they all are still true believers in the overall doctrine and rightness of the Borg, and assuming there are a good number of non-unanimous votes in the GB meetings there is a chance that at least one of the members is on the side of the losing vote more often than the others. If such a guy exists, does HE believe the GB - as a body - is directed by holy spirit? Or does he think HE is and the rest of the guys are full of crap?

    I know how I would feel being in a group whose decisions often ran counter to my vote. I wonder whether there is a brother or two there who personally doubts the group based on something personal like being on the losing end of too many voting decisions.

    I guess my view is that there could very well be a doubter among them but for no doctrinal reason whatsoever. He may be an idealist who votes his conscience all the time while the others - even if they agree with his stance on an issue - err on the side of organizational pragmatism, making him look like an outlier on many occasions.

    If a guy like that exists on the body he is bound to start doubting SOMEthing, either his qualifications for membership on the GB or the qualifications of his peers.

  • leavingwt

    Mad Sweeney: The concept of 'The Organization' is larger than life. So much, that he guys sitting in that GB room don't even think about the fact taht they ARE the organization. Even if they have strong objections to a SPECIFIC item, they are still captive to: (1) it's God's Organization and (2) Where else would I go? The GB are not immune to the sophisticated Thought Reform that exists within the organization. Imagine the fear that Ray Franz and any other person would have of being DF'd from Bethel? As outsiders, it all seems so simple to us -- it's not true, not important, etc. To them, it's their very way of life, their culture, their livelihood, their largest investment. It's not the glasses they wear to see the world, it's their very EYES.

    Hence, REFORM which will lead to them abandoning the idea that they alone are God's Organization is NEVER going to happen.

  • cult classic
    cult classic

    WatchTower (and any faithful JW for that matter) are experts at setting up false expectations and then blaming the victim for the disappointment that naturally follows.

  • Mad Sweeney
    Mad Sweeney

    I dig ya.

    I have no hope for organizational reform but I'm always looking for an angle by which there might be a rebel or two in HQ. I think a guy who doesn't get his way often enough is ripe for disgruntlement no matter how much of a true believer he is. If the rest of the body isn't clever enough to throw the oddball in their midst a bone now and then, they are in danger of creating a monster.

    It seems like most people who leave the Borg voluntarily finally crack because they've been pissed off one too many times. We all harbored piles of crap on our cognitive dissonance shelves but we "waited on Jehovah" until we just couldn't take it anymore. If a GB member is captive to the same "It's God's Organization" and "Where else will I go?" concepts as the rest of us are/were, why couldn't it be possible for a similar outcome for one or more of them, as well?

    Here's hoping!

  • Quendi

    I saw the effects that cognitive dissonance can have first hand when I reconnected with an old friend last Sunday. We argued about the validity of the organization's claims to be spirit-directed and God's exclusive channel. For me, it was interesting to see how the asking of simple questions could spark such internal conflict.

    I asked, "If the decision to disfellowship a person is merely confirmation of a decision Jehovah himself has already made, why does that person then have the right to appeal it? How can a person appeal a decision that God himself has made?"

    Another one: "How can the organization claim it is the 'faithful and discreet slave' when it was still teaching the false doctrine that Christ had returned invisibly in 1874? Or that God's Kingdom would destroy all the Gentile nations in October 1914?"

    My friend could only fall back on the worn-out mantras of the WTS. These were imperfect men being used by God so mistakes could happen. JWs are the only ones proclaiming the Kingdom good news. Look at our growth and worldwide unity. But his facial expressions showed that he was disturbed by not only the questions, but also by his clearly unsatisfactory answers. In the end he said that I must believe that God had no organization and the claims of the Governing Body to be the spokesman for the 'slave' were untrue. My reply in the affirmative upset him even more.


  • sabastious

    Great post!

    The Governing Body and the Writing Department of the Jehovah's Witnesses have had to become experts in defending a house of cards.


  • leavingwt

    I have no hope for organizational reform but I'm always looking for an angle by which there might be a rebel or two in HQ.

    I'm wearing my Pessimist Hat, so please bear with me.

    Ray Franz was that guy. Guess what? MOST active JWs don't know anything about him, nor are they aware of the fact that he wrote a book. I was at Bethel for almost seven years and the only memory I have of Ray being mentioned is someone saying that he was "Freddy's nephew, an apostate and the author of Commentary on James". <------ Two out of three are accurate, but I still didn't know that he wrote a book or that a new rule was created, just to DF him.

    Information Control will effectively neuter any rebel with a cause. Once a idea/book/website/thought is labelled 'Apostate', the faithful sheep KNOW what to do.

  • Mad Sweeney
    Mad Sweeney

    I'm enjoying your pessimistic view so keep it coming. You're helping me flesh out my own ideas on this subject.

    So do you think if there is such a guy as I describe - one who rarely gets his way - that he will never get angry/frustrated enough to just resign and walk away? Either because he's too much the company man or because he's been too sheltered within the Borg to have any hope for a life on the outside?

    If that's the case, what is this guy's future? Slowly sink into bitterness and insanity?

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