Atheist believe in aliens but not God?

by StopTheTears 68 Replies latest jw friends

  • Giordano

    But if you want to believe in aliens and not in God thats okay with me, just not very rational LOL!

    Actually that statement is not very rational. An atheist does not believe in god because there is no hard evidence for god's existence. It doesn't follow then that they 'believe' in Aliens. Alien belief is not an alternative.

    Rejection of the god belief is not an either or proposition. On the other hand since god believers have believed in thousands of different gods as well as angels and demons they are far more susceptible to believing in Aliens. And many do.

    Apparently the Catholic Church is out in front of the welcoming line should Alien contact be made. Now thats funny. Ok...... amusing? Hell what do they know that we don't?

  • KateWild

    300 million years ago the oxygen level was above 30% allowing the evolution of dragonflies as big as seagulls.-cofty

    I find that a strech to believe, I am assuming your source is more reliable than a google PhD, I say this because I do not think carbon dating of fossils goes back that far. But you are a fossil king and I will assume this is correct.

    This is not evidence to me. We are still talking insects here, insects are not Aliens. I am talking about homo-sapien in nature like a dragonfly humanoid, with linguistic and communication skills and having a high enough IQ to develop and support infastructures, such as housing, travel, education etc.

    Could such an alien have evolved on a far far away planet with 30% oxygen. Yes it is possible, but not very probable. But maybe they are reaponsible for the crop cirlces?

    Kate xx

  • adamah

    Kate said-

    My theory is what we can see now, the evidence of the make up of gases in the atmosphere cannot support life in any of the panets we have reached. By alein life we are not talking about micro-organisms either....Without getting into semantics, I think it is possible that intellengent life forms exist millions of light years away. But when we study our own solar system there are no ideal conditons that have been discovered. Temperatures are too hostile too cold or too hot, oxygen and nitrogen levels are too low, and a whole host of poisonous gases are prevelent in space. Then there is lack of gravity, which I do not comprehend so I cannot disscuss. Thats physics.

    Here's a video on the subject of astrobiology, where scientists are finding such per-conceptions as not necessarily true:

    (Click on the green button (watch the program now) on the right side of the page)

    Or, here's a direct link to the video:


  • KateWild

    I have read, the article from the scientific pyschic website. Lots of it chemistry that I can remember learning, good to recap on. The name of the website a bit dodgy for me, I don't think fortune tellers are credible.

    As well as dragonflies, biology, the article talked about gravitational pull developing and the Earth organised itself into layers, physics and geology. All these sciences I am weak in. But the point of the Earth organising itself, is a strong indicator an intelligent being was somehow involved in this. I personally cannot get my head around the physics, and how gravity works. As my IQ is too low to grasp this, I am going to fill the gaps in with God for now.

    But cantleave can you answer me this..................

    Physical chemistry, this is where I am stuck. Shrodingers wave equation.................I accept atoms vibrate, I don't understand why, but I accept there is a formula that explains it to those with a high enough IQ. I am in awe of this concept, the structure, beauty, and above all the intellect behind it all. Shrodinger merely discovered why and how atoms vibrate, to do that takes great intelligence. So how could it have evolved on another planet, and then produced an alien?

    I am agreeing with you all that it is possible, but for me the evidence is sketchy, it's more probable that God did it, or if you will a highly intelligent being. So I don't grasp why the evidence is more compeling that aliens exist and God cannot. If you are patient I am willing to learn.

    Kate xx

  • adamah

    Kate said-

    I am agreeing with you all that it is possible, but for me the evidence is sketchy, it's more probable that God did it, or if you will a highly intelligent being. So I don't grasp why the evidence is more compeling that aliens exist and God cannot. If you are patient I am willing to learn.

    You are willing to accept a being that defies ALL known laws of thermodynamics (since per the Bible, has ALWAYS been and will ALWAYS just be), and who cannot change (hence was unable to benefit from step-wise generational change of building up to his current state, as would be found in evolution)? This omnipotent being never had a creator, but just "was"?

    It's trivial for clever men to create such omnipotent beings as characters, which is exactly what they DID, calling them Gods. EVERY culture has created their own version, where if you lived in India you'd like worship a God with an elephant head; if in Japan, you'd be a Shintoist who worships their pantheon, etc. Do you believe in all of these OTHER Gods, too?

    Then congratulations, since you're already an atheist of someone else's God. Now you just need to figure out that your God is no more real than Zeus or Ahuru Mazda (or any of the other MILLIONS of Gods that people have believed in, from the dawn of man's consciousness).


  • Comatose

    Many planets have been identified that can support life. They have temperatures and atmospheres that can sustain or support life.

    Alien life could exist on a planet where we would die instantly. Intelligent life could exist there. A planet wouldn't have to be exactly like earth to support intelligent life.

    Adam is spot on in his assessment of humans utter disregard for the life on earth. If we discovered "alien" beings that were just like a dolphin, with the same intelligence as a dolphin (a lot), can you imagine humans wouled capture some and stick them in little aquariums? Or kill them for shark bait? Nope. But here on earth they are just animals and don't matter.

  • NoStonecutters

    Bart Belteshassur,

    No Stonecutters- Fallen Angels can't perpetuate atheism, Lucifer is the god of this world according to God is he not? At least God accepts that he is not the only one, even if his followers do not.

    The concept of Lucifer being the god of this world was not an admission of polytheism. Lucifer can be nothing more than a god of the dead. The Church Fathers even warned that the fallen angels posed as gods, the vast pantheon of Greco-Roman gods, for example. Occultist Pike's old prediction is coming true. Evolution was created by the minds of alchemists and occultists. Darwin was a Freemason. They were obviously fed this lie by the demonic entities that surrounded them. The Book of Enoch describes fallen angels giving men false knowledge, technology, and weapons of war. There is certainly nothing new under the sun.

    And let's not forget that the theory of evolution was the culmination of a century of occult "enlightenment science". Isaac Newton was an occultist too! Newton was believed to have acquired his "knowledge" from spiritual entities too. The Ancient Aliens show on History Channel suggests this as well. Empiricism is more superstitous than any religion. It's amazing how naviely people believe that modern science is objective.

  • Island Man
    Island Man

    It is contradictory for any Atheist to profess a belief in the existence of alien life while denying the existence of God. If you believe that aliens may exist, then you certainly must concede that one of those aliens may be God.

    There is a huge difference between believing in the existence of natural mortal aliens and belief in the existence of a supernatural immortal God. Your fallacy is in comparing the natural to the supernatural. It is true that there is no evidence of life on other planets. But the very fact that natural life exists on this planet makes the idea of natural life existing on some other distant, as yet unexplored planet, a logically viable idea to the open-minded. In other words, we have precedence for the existence of life on planets by virtue of the existence of life on Earth. In a universe filled with countless galaxies, stars and planets, there is absolutely no sound scientific or logical reason to doubt the possibility that there are other planets out there that can sustain life and do contain life. The sheer vastness of the universe makes it a statistical likelihood. In the absense of evidence, however, we simply cannot state it as fact.

    So we have tangible, verifiable precedence for belief in natural planet dwelling life on the one hand while there is no verifiable tangible precedence for belief in complex, eternal, supernatural, universe-creating life on the other hand. When examined carefully, it's not very hard to see that the two beliefs are not as comparable as you seem to think or would have us think. Yes they share the similarity of lack of evidence. But one belief has a vastly greater amount of credence due to there being a verifiable precendence.

    I am an atheist. Do I believe in the existence of alien life on other planets? I have an open mind about it. I think it is possible and even likely. But in the absense of evidence I will not assert it to be the case. I can only say that the idea is certainly not incredible and is very much within the realm of possibility. For me the question is not do I believe in the existence of alien life. Rather, do I think that belief in the existence of alien life is reasonable. And my answer is yes. I can't say the same for belief in a complex, supernatural person with no beginning. There is no verifiable precedence for such a belief.

  • GromitSK

    I must confess to being a bit puzzled about the issue here. To me, it looks like this:

    Aliens: I assume what is meant here is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe. Since we have proof of life here, whether we think it was 'created' by a deity or not, and it seems there is evidence of planets elsewhere with conditions which may support life, or at least stars which could produce such planets, it appears to me that the probability of life elsewhere can be estimated.

    So - we know it's possible, because we exist, therefore there must be a probability it also exists somewhere else, and given the size of the universe the probability seems 'high' to me. It doesn't seem unreasonable to me, on this basis to be of the opinion that aliens probably exist. Call it a belief if you like. Whether they have visited earth is a different question entirely.

    God: it seems to me that much of the evidence to support the existence of a god is interpretable in ways that don't imply a god too. So belief in god seems to me to be much more debatable.

    I don't see that belief in god and belief aliens are comparable, or that atheism and acceptance of life elsewhere in the universe are incompatible.

  • KateWild

    comatose-I read your link and found it very interesting, and was quite impressed until I realised it was not an authentic NASA website. I found an article on the real NASA website about the Kepler data which tells a slighty different story. Sorry I can't do links. Cambridge, MA -

    All stars begin their lives in groups. Most stars, including our Sun, are born in small, benign groups that quickly fall apart. Others form in huge, dense swarms that survive for billions of years as stellar clusters. Within such rich and dense clusters, stars jostle for room with thousands of neighbors while strong radiation and harsh stellar winds scour interstellar space, stripping planet-forming materials from nearby stars.

    It would thus seem an unlikely place to find alien worlds. Yet 3,000 light-years from Earth, in the star cluster NGC 6811, astronomers have found two planets smaller than Neptune orbiting Sun-like stars. The discovery, published in the journal Nature, shows that planets can develop even in crowded clusters jam-packed with stars.

    "Old clusters represent a stellar environment much different than the birthplace of the Sun and other planet-hosting field stars," says lead author Soren Meibom of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics (CfA). "And we thought maybe planets couldn't easily form and survive in the stressful environments of dense clusters, in part because for a long time we couldn't find them."

    The two new alien worlds appeared in data from NASA's Kepler spacecraft. Kepler hunts for planets that transit, or cross in front of, their host stars. During a transit, the star dims by an amount that depends on the size of the planet, allowing the size to be determined. Kepler-66b and Kepler-67b are both less than three times the size of Earth, or about three-fourths the size of Neptune (mini-Neptunes).

    Of the more than 850 known planets beyond our solar system, only four - all similar to or greater than Jupiter in mass - were found in clusters. Kepler-66b and -67b are the smallest planets to be found in a star cluster, and the first cluster planets seen to transit their host stars, which enables the measurement of their sizes.

    Meibom and his colleagues have measured the age of NGC 6811 to be one billion years. Kepler-66b and Kepler-67b therefore join a small group of planets with precisely determined ages, distances, and sizes.

    Considering the number of stars observed by Kepler in NGC 6811, the detection of two such planets implies that the frequency and properties of planets in open clusters are consistent with those of planets around field stars (stars not within a cluster or association) in the Milky Way galaxy.

    "These planets are cosmic extremophiles," says Meibom. "Finding them shows that small planets can form and survive for at least a billion years, even in a chaotic and hostile environment."

    Headquartered in Cambridge, Mass., the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics (CfA) is a joint collaboration between the Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory and the Harvard College Observatory. CfA scientists, organized into six research divisions, study the origin, evolution and ultimate fate of the universe.

    Meibom says that planets survive, but no where he indicates that life can form, or be created in these planets which are much smaller than earth.

    comatose, I have never heard of the Kepler data before so thank you for introducing me to this study. IMO I feel this Astrophysicists article is more reliable than the link on your post, I feel he backs up my belief that Aliens on other planets are possible, just not probable.

    I do think the OP question is reasonable, the gaps in science can be filled with God and Aliens. The point being we don't have all the evidence to prove either, we are speculating on both.

    This is an interesting thread for me.

    Thanks everyone Kate xx

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