Halal versus Kosher food - who knew it was so complex?

by james_woods 13 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  james_woods

  Somebody who lived in the middle east posted this on my Ferrari board - I had no idea that these dietary laws went into such detail:

  The slaughter must be ritually done (in a religiously based ritual fashion) For Halal that means the name of Allah has to be invoked individually on each animal to be slaughtered where for Kosher, it is sufficient to recite the name of God or grace once for the day for all slaughters.
  
  Islam considers the entire cattle or sheep as Halal if duly slaughtered but Jews use only the fore-quarter as Kosher and consider the hind-quarter as non-Kosher.
  
  Meat of rabbit, shell fish, wild hens, goose, and duck are considered permissible in the eyes of the Islamic Law but they are prohibited in Kashrut or Kosher law.
  
  Islam prohibits all intoxicating alcohols, liquors, wines, and drugs. However, Kashrut considers all wines Kosher.
  
  Mixing dairy and meat is prohibited in kosher foods, but is not an issue in halal.
  
  Gelatin is considered Kosher (regardless of its origin, even from non-Kosher animals). If the Gelatin is of non-Halal (e.g. swine) origin, then Muslims consider it as Haram or banned.
  
  In cheese making, the end-product is regarded as Haram if enzymes from non-Halal sources are utilised.
  
  According to Kashrut, enzymes are considered mere secretion and thereby all cheeses are Kosher, irrespective of the sources of the enzymes, even though they may be from non-Kosher animals.
  
  Kosher and halal foods are similar in that both prohibit the use of pork, pork products and blood in food.
  
  So... you can get a Halal chicken pesto pizza with cheese but it would not be Kosher. To be kosher, you can only have a vegetarian pizza with cheese or a chicken (but not sausage) pizza with no cheese.
  
  _________

  Then, somebody else posted that to be strictly Kosher, you would have to have two kitchens - one for dairy products, another for meats. And that you cannot eat dairy products after eating meat products for four hours. I believe they said that you can eat meat after dairy food immediately, but not both at the same time.

  _________

  Wow - how do these people have time to do anything (including praying five times a day or going to synagogue) after going to so much trouble about food?
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  Leolaia

  All I know is that the KFC chicken I ate in a restaurant in the boonies in Malaysia (where a wild tiger was on the prowl) was 100% halal.
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  james_woods

  The guy who posted it said the first thing he wanted when he got back to the states was a 1/4 lb. Bacon Cheeseburger calculated to break both these laws.

  What I thought when I saw it was how mindlessly similar the two sides are, and yet so intractable about meaningless details.

  It is absolutely as ridiculous to read as ancient Egyptian sun/emperor worship.

  And, let me just add - this made me realize that peace in the middle east is an absolute illusion between peoples so religiously stubborn.
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  Band on the Run

  I lived with many orthdox Jesus people in Manhattan. They won't eat marshmallows b/c of the gelatin, which I was told is very unkosher. Now I have to check a rabbinic site.

  I wonder whether these dietary laws existed in the earlier cultures and the Islamic and Jewish codes just enshrined them. Do you go to sleep one night and learn that what is clean, is now unclean. Everyone comments that these laws were integral to public safety in the climates they lived.
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  minimus

  I had halal bacon on pizza. It was weird.
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  james_woods

  Everyone comments that these laws were integral to public safety in the climates they lived.

  That was always the Watchtower word on the subject - but they only used it in reference to pigs versus sheep or cattle.

  I never believed this even at the time - (is pork really that much more likely to cause disease? - in modern times, even with refrigeration, isn't it almost always bad beef that causes salmonella outbreaks?) - and, how the heck is a duck so much more dangerous than a chicken, or why would shellfish be more dangerous than a red snapper?

  It is pretty obvious to me that this was an ancient version of hyper-controlling law by religious dictators - and that it was constantly modified just like the JWs modify their rules by "new light."
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  Band on the Run

  Gelatin from unclean sources is definitely not Kosher. There are gelatin substitutes available today so there prob. is some business making marshmallows that are kosher. The gelatin rules are very complicated. Wikipedia cites some modern scholars but the orthodox view is forbidden.

  I only knew about pork from the Witnesses. When I started college, I was exposed to all these elaborate rules. I recall knife cuts are important. Dishes are cleaned in sand for Passover. The most informed, sophisticated people would obey these rules in an exacting manner. My roommate was Jewish through her mother's line. Her father was Latino so she was raised Catholic. When she hit university, it was her first exposure to Judaism really. She overcompensated for her lack of upbringing. It drew the ire of Jewish raised students. We were roommates and close friends. She was never under any illusion that I was not Christian but Jewish. Well, WWIII started when I brought in frozen shrimp cocktail as recommended by a fashion magazine for young women. There were constant skirmishes about food. There were many rooms available that were set aside as kosher.

  It is not flattering to me but there were still Christian and Jewish law firms. On its face, you would be a token in the other religion's firm and get away with more stuff. I refused to feel awkward about food anymore. It was sad to me that we were all discussing religion as a major factor in a law career. Newer firms are different but the trad'l ones are still dominated by religious culture.
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  Leolaia

  When I went to college, I worked in the office that did roommate assignments and an orthodox woman who marked "kosher" in her dietary preferences was assigned to a Korean woman who similarly chose "kosher" because, as she said, she looked up the word in her Korean-English dictionary and it was defined as "good, proper". Needless to say, the Jewish student was very upset; "I can't use my kitchen at all," she said.
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  Robdar

  According to Kashrut, enzymes are considered mere secretion and thereby all cheeses are Kosher, irrespective of the sources of the enzymes, even though they may be from non-Kosher animals.

  It is my understanding that this used to be true; however, most Orthodox and some conservative Jews do not consider cheese to be kosher unless it comes from a kosher animal and contains kashrut certification.

  Then, somebody else posted that to be strictly Kosher, you would have to have two kitchens - one for dairy products, another for meats. And that you cannot eat dairy products after eating meat products for four hours. I believe they said that you can eat meat after dairy food immediately, but not both at the same time.

  It depends upon the region you are from. Usually Jews will not eat meat and cheese without waiting anywhere from 1 to 3 hours. And yes, to be strictly Kosher, you do have to have two kitchens--one for dairy and another for meat.

  I am happy to be a reform Jew and so the dietary rules do not apply to me. Although I don't eat pork, I stopped eating it years before my conversion.
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  Robdar

  BTW, Judaism is not a Bible based religion. It is a religion based on the rules and regulations set forth by rabbis.