Sayings of Everlasting Life heard "Nowhere Else" but in JW Organization?

by InterestedOne 27 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  boyzone

  Hi again IO.

  What you're asking for is inside information. The knowledge in those books are for fully indoctrinated JW's only, hence thats why you're termed "not ready".

  In other words, you question too much. Once you are showing yourself totally compliant to all the information your currently fed, (termed "appreciative") and are regular at the meetings, then - and only then will you be trusted with the inside information.

  A JW's relationship is indeed like a parent-child one.

  "God has not arranged for that Word to speak independently or to shine forth life-giving truths by itself. His word says "light is sown for the righteous". It is through his organization that God provides this light that the proverb says is the teaching or law of the mother. If we are to walk in the light of truth we must recognise not only Jehovah God as our Father but his organization as our mother." May 1st 1957 WT pg 274

  WTWizard mentioned something that must be difficult for individual JW's: even if they can show that a WT doctrine is unsound Biblically, they have to go along with it and wait for the organization to fix it.

  This is true.

  "Are we assigned as individuals to bring forth the food for the spiritual table? No? Then let us not try tot ake over the slave's duties. We should eat and digest and assimilate what is set before us, without shying away from parts of the food because it may not suit the fancy of our mental taste........We should meekly go along with the Lord's theocratic organization and wait for further clarification, rather than balk at the first mention of a thought unpalatable to us and proceed to quibble and mouth our criticisms and opinions as though they were worth more than the slave's provision of spiritual food. Theocratic ones will appreciate the Lord's visible organization and not be so foolish as to pit against Jehovah's channel their own human reasoning and sentiment and personal feelings........After being nourished to our present spiritual strength and maturity, do we suddenly become smarter than our former provider and forsake the enlightening guidance of the organization that mothered us?" WT Feb 1 1952
• 

  Ding

  InterestedOne,

  If you want to know the truth about the Watchtower organization from the inside, get ahold of a book called Crisis of Conscience by Raymond Franz.

  You may be able to get it through your library system.

  If you can't find it anywhere, let us know and someone can tell you how to get a copy.

  If this book had been in existence at the time I started studying with JWs, my involvement with them would have ended abruptly.

  Ray was a member of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses until his conscience started to bother him about a number of things.

  One of Ray's main issues was that the Watchtower organization claims so much authority for itself that it actually supplants Jesus Christ within the religion.

  He also documents a large number of false prophecies the Watchtower made about the end of "this system of things" and the battle of Armageddon.

  You can find out a lot about these by looking at various threads on this forum.

  If you mention the Ray's name or the book title to JWs you know, they will inform you that he was an apostate, which to them makes him on a par with Judas.

  However, you are entitled to examine everything about a religion before deciding whether or not to join it.

  If they have the truth, they should be willing to discuss anything with you.

  If not, what are they hiding?
• 

  wannabefree

  InterestedOne ... I wish I would have questioned when I began my study 25 years ago, there is so much information readily available now, educate yourself and be careful not to get sucked in

  GrandmaJones ... (assuming you are using a windows operatins system) put your pointer on the picture, press the right button on your mouse (right click), choose from the menu "Save Picture As ...", click save (take note of where you are saving it to, the default should be the "My Pictures" folder, or you can select a location before clicking on save)
• 

  Cold Steel

  Assuming the author is specifically referring to the JW organization, I am not sure why he/she cites John 6:68 to support the claim that "nowhere else" can a person hear the sayings of everlasting life. John 6:68 says the following: "Simon Peter answered him: 'Lord, whom shall we go away to? You have sayings of everlasting life;" Peter is speaking to the person, Jesus, whereas the WT author is referring to the JW organization.

  This is the elusive foundational justification -- the reason the "slave" claims authority. There are no callings...no ordinations. They are sent, but the only reason they know that is through the process of elimination. No one else is right, so we must be Jehovah's organization. No other church teaches "the truth," so it only stands to reason that we are providentially selected and ordained.

  If I'm wrong, please correct me. How else does the slave claim authority?

  The only problem was that the churches of Christ use the same reasoning. "Where the Bible speaks, we speak; where the Bible is silent, we are silent." Through a tenacious study of the Bible, they reasonsed that they could "restore" ancient Christianity. But even so, their doctrines are wholly different than the WBTS.

  Ever since William Miller, adventist split-offs like the Seventh Day Adventists, Worldwide Church of God, and the JWs continue with their ideas, ever adjusting their views to conincide with events. The Witnesses do have more adjustments than the others. "New light," I think they call it.

  Like I said, let me know if I'm wrong.
• 

  Watchtowers Witnesses

  All it took was a couple meetings and I felt like something weird was going on.

  Trust your instincts. The Jehovah's Witnesses are NOT a harmless group with “strange” beliefs. To an outsider like yourself they may in fact seem harmless but to someone born into the cult like your friend it’s much more serious. Edit: (You didn't say if your friend was born into the religion, I just assumed. Tell me if my guess was right.) My family has been torn apart by this religion. During your “study” you have the freedom to bring up questions, but someone inside the group does not have that same freedom. In fact if they openly question the logic of Watchtower doctrine they would be threatened with being kicked out and shunned by their entire family and so called “friends”.

  Do you know about the timecards yet?

  So far, this has been one of the most bizarre and eye-opening experiences of my life. Their use of language is really blowing my mind, and I am learning what to watch out for in other areas of life such as in political propaganda, speeches, advertising, etc. The use of vagueries and manipulation of emotion is so outstanding to me that sometimes when I return home from meetings, I feel like I need to take a shower to wash it off. It's like there's a haze over everything. So weird.

  Very good observation. All I can say is read as much as you can about them. Jwfacts.com is great resource. Freeminds.org has more of what I would call “inside information” that might not make much sense to an outsider. Read the personal experiences on this site as well. Has your relationship with your friend changed since you’ve started going to meetings?
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  InterestedOne

  She was not born into it. She was baptized in 2003. I have been asking her what happened, i.e. how do you go from being interested in the Bible, to believing you can only hear the sayings of everlasting life from a specific group? She hasn't told me the answer. She only told me that she was going through a rough time coming out of an abusive relationship. A friend who was a DA who still believed the doctrine but felt he couldn't live up to it, pulled out the Bible, started "teaching" her, and eventually turned her over to a "sister." She had never looked into the Bible before and thought she was really studying it because of all the impressive maps, archaeology photos, "scholarly" quotes, etc. It's obvious to me that she was being indoctrinated with carefully selected information and wording, but she is convinced that studying with JW's is equivalent to studying the Bible. She uses them synonymously all the time which gives me the creeps. When I asked her what happened once she started "studying," she just said "as my love for Jehovah grew, I naturally wanted to start preaching."

  One of my main questions is this: what basis does the WT Society have for claiming to have a monopoly on the sayings of everlasting life? I'm assuming they use John 6:68 because they believe they have information from Jesus beyond the Bible, i.e. no-one can know the sayings of everlasting life without consulting the WT Society, but how do they convince their followers of such a thing? They must have some kind of "logic" that convinces people. Can someone please enlighten me on how they find a way to make it seem plausible? I think Cold Steel gave a possible explanation - process of elimination - all other Bible-based groups have flaws in their doctrine. However, the WT Society admits they are not perfect either, so what's the difference between them and any other people sincerely attempting to understand/apply the Bible? Is the Society accusing everyone else of being insincere? Is the WT Society's -sincerity- the reason why Jesus supposedly approved them over everyone else in 1918-19? Jesus' choice, assuming he was even making one, couldn't have been based on their doctrine because they admit it was flawed at the time. So what do they say his choice was based on?
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  myelaine

  dear InterestedOne...

  I think the WTBTS believes that their earthly class and their heavenly class would be the truth that would make all the difference in the answer to their question, "where would we go"...

  others don't have that inside information and therefore they do not have the real sayings and the real truth about everlasting life.

  love michelle
• 

  factfinder

  Hi InterestedOne! Welcome!

  The posts here have been great!

  I can't believe that 1943 WT article. So Jesus was setting the actual requirements for everyone, hours, rvs and studies? Did Jesus personally go to Bethel and give these directives to the GB? I guess he must have! And I guess he kept changing his mind on these requirements as the years went on?

  If only I had all of this information back in 1976 when I first began studying with the witnesses.

  Yes, JWs believe only they have the truth. Only they have "the Faithful and Discreet Slave". Only they make Jehovah's name known worldwide. Only they preach the "good news of God's kingdom" worldwide in fulfillment of Matt. 24:14. Only they have the massive publishing/printing and teaching organization that can carry out Jesus' commands. No-one else is doing this, they MUST be the true religion then.

  And don't forget too, interestedone, Jehovah's Witnesses believe and teach that Satan controls all sources of information EXCEPT for the WTS which is directed by God's Holy Spirit. The media, including the internet, and THIS website are all under the control of Satan.

  I am surprised they withheld books from you. When I started attending at the KH I was asked if I was going to come regularly. I said I guess so and was given a copy of Our Kingdom Service. Back then most books contained listings of other books available so I obtained all that I could that was available.

  But what scriptures do they provide to prove they have the authority that they claim to have? Good question! They just show Matt.24:45-47 about the F&DS and Matt.24:14 and 28:19, 20 and point out that only THEY are the ones doing this work so that proves they are the F&DS !