Consequences of speaking out

by Nickolas 42 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Nickolas

  I've been married to the same wonderful woman for 37 years. She's been a Jehovah's Witness for 33 of those years, I am not. I studied with the WBTS for a couple of years beginning late 1974 before deciding it wasn't for me. Over the years whatever faith I had faded, first to agnosticism then to disbelief in a personal god. Conversations we've had over the years about the WTBS have generally ended with me angry and her in tears, so we generally just don't talk about it.

  We often entertain Jehovah's Witnesses in our home and have on several occasions socialized with a group of several couples from my wife's congregation. Members of my wife's family who are also Witnesses often stay over. Up until a year or so ago I consistently asked if one of our dinner guests would like to ask a blessing at our table and the invitation was always taken up. It was a courtesy that quietly ended a year or so ago when my wife's nephew was disfellowshipped and subsequently shunned, which crossed a line in my mind. A courtesy I have not abandoned yet is remaining diplomatically silent whenever the conversation veers into supernatural beliefs. It doesn't happen often, I think out of respect for my status as a non-JW, but I am finding it more and more difficult to hold my tongue when it does. It is also becoming difficult for me not to start a conversation expressing my doubts about the Watchtower organization, its doctrines and its practices. It is just a matter of time before I speak out.

  So, the question to those who have some experience in these matters. What should I expect if I express my views openly to my wife's family and to her WT associates? I'm no shrinking violet, I just like to know what I'm getting into before I open my mouth. Any other coaching that might help me not put my foot in it would also be appreciated.
• 

  leavingwt

  You could lose your wife. The relatives will cut off all association with you. You will become, in their eyes, a Spiritual Danger.
• 

  Magwitch

  You sound like you have been a saint for 33 years. But, when you open your mouth in any kind of opposition to the BORG, you are going to be looked at like the ANTI-CHRIST.
• 

  Lozhasleft

  Hi Nickolas - the bottom line is that you are the head of your household (in the Org's eyes) regardless of not being a JW, so insist that in your home things are done which dont contravene your conscience...dont make it a big drama...just state your case and stick to it. It is preferable to be respected than liked. I would like it if you would even go as far as inviting the DFd person around and making him very welcome. That would be your right.

  Loz x
• 

  undercover

  Since you've never been a JW, your speaking your thoughts and opinions shouldn't be as big a deal as if a former member tried to express opinions/thoughts. But still, any argument you make, any evidence you present, will probably fall on deaf ears. JWs act a pretty good listener but all they're really doing is waiting to convince you that they're right and you're wrong. That's the long and short of it. No matter how nice, how cordial, how fun they are at dinner, in the end, they see you as a "worldly" person doomed to die at Armageddon and the only way you're gonna escape that fate is if you listen to them and become a JW alongside with them.

  I think you should speak your mind, tactfully and respectfully. But instead of bringing it up, let it come to you. Sooner or later, someone will say something about an assembly part, a talk, a magazine, or something. You can expound on the subject by asking questions. And it is your home. You have the right to speak your mind. You shouldn't feel like you have to tippy-toe around their beliefs or feelings. In fact they should be careful to not offend you with their JW talk.

  Whatever you do, try to get just one or two points made in one setting. You're never going to deprogram a JW in one or two settings. You do have a unique oppurtunity to try to drop hints or make a point damning to WT doctrine that many of us could never get away with. Since we were once associated and left, we've looked at in even more sinister terms.

  One thing that will frustrate the bejesus out of you...should you be able to get into a discussion... they will change the subject on you a dozen times before you ever fully cover a single point. Especially if you back them into a corner. They're masters at deflection and redirection. Stick to one subject and don't let em off the hook...unless anger or frustration enues...and then it's time to just drop it.
• 

  Mickey mouse

  If you have never been baptised then that goes in your favour.
• 

  OUTLAW

  Say anything Negative about the WBT$ and your Average JW will turn on you like a Rabid Dog..

  They will be more than happy,to turn your wife and family against you..

  Your not dealing with normal people..

  Jehovah`s Witness`s can be Extremely Ruthless and Cruel..

  ........................... ...OUTLAW
• 

  Billy the Ex-Bethelite

  My suggestion would be to test the waters one at a time. Rather than start a huge debate with a crowd of them, try one subject with just one person.

  Right now the congregation Bible reading just finished with the destruction of Jerusalem. JWs believe that event happened in 607 BCE, but every historical record disagrees with phoney JW historio-numerology. Of course the Bible has no dates. Back then, Jews were terrible with numbers. So, Bible "scholars" have to look to historic records. Strangely, JWs slavishly accept 539 for the fall of Babylon, but they foolishly reject the same historical records account of the destruction of Jerusalem. Instead, they still worship Russellite pyramido-numerology that pointed to the end of the world in 1914 based on a fictional number of 607 for the destruction of Jerusalem.

  Or if someone goes "Genesis creation" on you with the new brochures, you could ask how the millions of species of God's non-evolving animal creations would fit in Noah's ark. And how did kangaroos get from Australia to Turkey right before the flood, and then all the way back to Australia from Turkey after the flood? Why did God create mosquitos? If everything had to be created, who created God? How could an all-knowing, all-powerful, super-incredible God appear out of nowhere if the rather dumb and chaotic physical world absolutely had to have a maker? If the house had to have an intelligent builder, and that intelligent builder had to have a more intelligent creator, wouldn't that intelligent creator need an even more intelligenter creator to make him?

  Anyway, just some suggestions. Good Luck and don't let your blood pressure spike because of other people's desire to remain ignorant followers of some old farts in Brooklyn.
• 

  Alwayshere

  Nickolas, leavingwt and outlaw are right. An Elder told my Daughter-in-law these very words, "You need to leave his (my son) Ass." She never left him, they both left the cult.
• 

  Nickolas

  You could lose your wife. leavingwt, that's what frightens me most, but I was under the impression that there are strict rules for divorce, even in the WTBS. The relatives will cut off all association with you. Ok, so not all bad

  I would like it if you would even go as far as inviting the DFd person around and making him very welcome. That would be your right. Loz, my wife has made it clear she's ok with the df'ed one, her nephew, coming to our house, but she won't allow herself to be in it at the same time, which I cannot agree with.

  You're never going to deprogram a JW in one or two settings. undercover, that implies deprogramming is possible. My wildest dream. Has anyone to your knowledge devised a detailed deprogramming strategy complete with facts and arguments?