by Terry 40 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Another interesting feature of the Douglas Walsh case was that Franz admitted he was responsible for checking the accuracy of the NWT (the sections that had been done up until then.) However when asked to translate a single verse from the Bible into Hebrew HE COULD NOT DO IT!!
Doesn't that just inspire confidence.
George
Hi Terry
This scripture is talking about the bible being inspired and for people to be trained by it..
15 and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
You are putting a different spin on my words. I didn't say the scripture could be wrong or the teachings in the scriptures. Only OUR understanding of it. It is US that bring IMPERFECTION to the bible not the other way round. We are the ones needing correcting from error (the greek word epanorthosis simply means to set straight) yes this does mean morally in line with the scripture, training in righteousness. But you do not really explain what "morality" is covered. The bible didn't just talk on sexual morality. The bible covers all aspects of setting things straight so "the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work."
My original point still stands We use the bible in all aspects of our lifes including our understanding of the bible So we use the bible to correct set straight any wrong understandings humans may put on it. It is our moral error that lead us to put false understandings on the bible more in line with our own inclinations than the bibles words.
You are putting a different spin on my words. I didn't say the scripture could be wrong or the teachings in the scriptures. Only OUR understanding of it. It is US that bring IMPERFECTION to the bible not the other way round. We are the ones needing correcting from error (the greek word epanorthosis simply means to set straight) yes this does mean morally in line with the scripture, training in righteousness. But you do not really explain what "morality" is covered. The bible didn't just talk on sexual morality. The bible covers all aspects of setting things straight so "the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work."
Well, let's test that out, shall we?
The New Testament started out how? People telling stories. People=imperfect (corrupt, biased, partisan).
Those stories were passed around.
Eventually, the oral tradition of who Jesus was and what was said was written down. By who? Men! Men are imperfect, corrupt and biased as well as partisan.
Have you ever made coffee using one of those drip-thru-filter coffeemakers?
What happens if you use the finest triple filtered water and the most expensive fresh ground beans and yet FILTER IT THROUGH SOMEBODY'S UNDERWEAR WITH A SKID MARK ON IT?
Would you drink it?
That's our bible, my friend!
Doesn't matter how "inspired" the original message was. The "filter" is man and what a difference that makes!
I see it as mattering not whether the bible can be trusted or the arguments put forward in apology on this.
What matters is the attitude of those on the stand in this trial. The absolute rule that you are obligated to believe and follow their particular understanding because it is backed by a chosen scripture is ludicrous.
Equaly so is the reality that if you dont you get disfellowshipped and shunned.
The apology is also made that we as men are imperfect and that this somehow excuses any wrong teachings and the harm done.
Perhaps if all the WT soc had was a couple of minor errors in understanding that may be well and good. But i hope 'debater' stays around long enough to really look honestly into the hundreds and hundreds of other gross errors and misconceptions of this religion rather than just quoting bible verses cut and pasted from the CD in an attempt to battle the 'apostates'.
oz
Coincidence ! I'm just reading this transcript in Ray Franz's 'In Search of Christian Freedom' ...I couldnt believe the audacity ....
Loz x
Very excellent piece of research. Thank you Terry. Plan to share the same with some of JW friends whose email I still keep from earlier old days.
Dejour theology and the threat of compliance, it was a toxic mix.
I never knew about this transcript. At first I felt stupid for not looking more deeply into WTBTS BUT no Internet in 1978. And I thought I was learning what the Bible said and not some clergy. Boy oh boy was I tricked. And I don't even think those who studied with me knew the tricks used on them.
Wow!
And the trial would have been praised as a great victory for christian freedoms. with the wtbts heros of the day.
But the truth of the matters hidden until shared on the internet.!.
What a FRAUD....
