can spirituality replace religion?

by make yourself 61 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Terry
    Terry

    PLAYBOY: Has no religion, in your estimation, ever offered anything of constructive value to human life?

    AYN RAND: No—in the sense of blind belief, belief unsupported by, or contrary to, the facts of reality and the conclusions of reason.

    Faith, as such, is extremely detrimental to human life: it is the negation of reason. But you must remember that religion is an early form of philosophy,

    that the first attempts to explain the universe, to give a coherent frame of reference to man’s life and a code of moral values, were made by religion,

    before men graduated or developed enough to have philosophy. And, as philosophies, some religions have very valuable moral points. They may have

    a good influence or proper principles to inculcate, but in a very contradictory context and, on a very—how should I say it?—dangerous or malevolent

    base: on the ground of faith.

    “ Playboy’s Interview with Ayn Rand,” March 1964.

  • mindmelda
    mindmelda

    Yes, Terry, what you're referring to is called magical thinking.

    The trouble is, humans are innately magical thinkers, at least until they reach an age where higher cognition develops sufficiently to dispel such ideas with better information but even that takes education. That starts happening around 2 or 3 years old, if I recall early childhood development.

    I worked in preschool education for years...believe me, it's a stage of human development to be a magical thinker. That's why kids love magical stories even more than adults.

    Babies do that all the time. Baby kicks legs, the mobile above the crib moves...baby starts to think maybe the pretty thing is moving and playing music because he kicks his legs...so when the baby wants to see and hear the mobile, he kicks...and sometimes, mom sees that as a signal that the baby wants her to wind up the mobile, so hey. presto, I made it move by kicking my legs, thinks baby.

    That explains a lot of non-thinking stuff, as you say, being reactionary. But, it's also rather unavoidable unless you can explain to someone how the wind up motor on the mobile works, and maybe even have them do it themselves to make sure that's how it works. That's what we have parents who explain things to us and education for...simply observance and reaction to the world around us isn't always enough to figure things out, but it the BEGINNING of cognition.

    It's where chimps are kind of stuck in their cognition skills, since they develop to about where a three year old does and then stop.

    But, without something to replace that, we may continue to think the world is magical, at least to some extent. Adults with no access to more information or where no information is available will continue to think magically where something more factual hasn't been demonstrated or taught.

    Fine for fictional purposes for entertainment, but not quite as useful for other aspects of life.

    But, it's been postulated by evolutionary psychologists that at an earlier stage of hominid development we were magical or childlike thinkers all of our lives, and to some extent, we still are, that part of us doesn't disappear entirely. Hence religion and other supernatural beliefs, fiction and fantasy, creativity, all that stuff.

    The Stone Age wasn't that long ago in evolutionary terms...in some important ways, we still have Stone Age brains, even though we live in a technologically advanced world.

  • Terry
    Terry

    humans are innately magical thinkers

    I would not agree.

    I would say the following instead: At a certain point in our human development we are naive, inexperienced and gullible. If we form our opinions

    and values at that stage without later changing them----we are permanently MAGIC THINKERS.

    Nothing INNATE required!

    To a primitive society technology is indistinguishable from Miracles. (Arthur C. Clarke)

    Unsophisticated minds employ unsophisticated heuristics. Garbage in=Garbage Out.

    Most of us (unless we develop a taste for the unsophisticated weirdness of magic thinking) grow up and adapt our views to include actual data,

    science and disproof.

    Magic thinking is merely a stage in development and not a "default".

  • VoidEater
    VoidEater

    Religion = memorialized beliefs.

    Spirituality = attention to synthesized experience.

    Spirituality allows access to a greater spectrum of the organism.

    Religion, like all belief, is an approximation after the fact.

  • misocup
    misocup

    John 4:23-24

    23 “But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers. 24 “God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”

    I take this to mean a sort of communion (not in the Catholic sense) with human spirit and God who is spirit.

    Luke 17 (KJV)
    And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

    I take this to mean that when you have this "communion" with God, you do so "without observation", invisibly and in secret.

    Matt. 6:6 - But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

    Remember Jesus condemned the Pharisees for praying in public so as to be notice by others as being pious.

    Matt. 6:5 - And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

    So when someone says they are spiritual. I take it to mean they have an inner belief in a higher power, but do not subscribe to any particular dogma or church.

  • Etude
    Etude

    Think it's not innate? I thought someone would have picked up on the "G" Spot thing I wrote about earlier. Well, no big deal. But, check this out.

    The Neurology of the Spiritual Experience

    and click on the picture.

    Etude.

  • misocup
    misocup

    The Neurology of the Spiritual Experience

    I heard of this a while ago. I compare it to manual electronic stimulation of a muscle. Just because they've discovered the mechanism, doesn't mean they've discovered why we have that mechanism, or what stimulates it naturally.

  • misocup
    misocup

    It really all comes down to personal experience.

    If you are really wondering if there are invisible beings, entities, whatever, go seek them out. Yes it's scary, but it's worth it to find out for yourself.

  • VoidEater
    VoidEater

    "It really all comes down to personal experience."

    Yes, literally. Belief is in the mind, like any thought, it is secondary. Experience is primal.

  • Etude
    Etude

    Let's not forget that if one can say that “belief is in the mind” that a good argument can be made for feelings and everything else to also be in our mind. In fact, unless one is dualist, all that we are is in our brain/body, including spirituality. I know of someone back in the 70's in New York who believed she could fly out of a 3-story window while under the influence of LSD. That was not a universal experience linked to LSD. But, the “G” spot appears to be universal even if we can't yet determine all that it does and what purpose it serves other than cause or channel those feelings that we associate with “otherness” and a sense of awe at the grandness of the universe. On a more personal level, one of my JW room mates ended up committing two suicide attempts because he was seeing monsters and hearing voices. Aside from his mind being compromised, I know the JW really screw up his head to the point that he could no longer stand the guilt and tried to off himself. It's that very pathology of the brain that has led to discoveries like the so-called “G” Spot and how alternate pathways in the brain can be created to replace lost functions.

    The helmet I referred to in my previous post has been used to duplicate the same or similar sensations in many an individual. Really, it's a poor man's version of what has been done in the lab many times with more sophisticated equipment. So, I believe we all have the same thing in common to one degree or another. Personally, I don't wonder if there are invisible beings. That definition, by its very nature makes it impossible for one to know if the proof is a sighting. But for me, the existence of receptors and generators in the brain like the “G” spot explain why some people insist that there are aliens out there experimenting on cattle and taking people to their ships in order to create some sort of hybrid babies. That also explains out-of-body experiences, etc, etc. This suggests to me that not only there may be a specific “seat” for “spirituality” in the brain but also for the source of mysticism and a general tendency to want to explain the unexplainable in terms of something extraterrestrial or even heavenly. I'm basing my comments on the work of Vilayanur S. Ramachandran, a behavioral neurologist that made several important discoveries while at U.C. San Diego.

    Etude.

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