What did Jesus mean by "this generation"?

by Doug Mason 37 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  wannabe

  Doug Mason!

  Take a look at Revelation 17:11 where John speaks of an Eighth King that goes off into destruction! Isn't it logical to conclude from that, in that this eighth king goes off into destruction that this King in question is the last ruling Governmental Authorioty to brace this earth? From that, can we not conclude that it is the generation of this last ruling World king, that will not pass away? Even more than that! Can we not also conclude that it his generation that will have to be cut short as well? So, you see it is possible to know what Jesus was talking about when he said: "This generation will not pass away until all things are fulfilled?" More than any of that though, the harvest season was to begin during the conclusion of the system of things; or end of the age, when the Christ actually takes kingdom power. That would begin during the time of this Worlds greatest period of trouble, and that time period was to be cut short to save the lives of God's Chosen ones; if not cut short they would all be killed. Take a look at Daniel 7:8 and you will see just where this Eighth King springs from. He's one little horn in among the Ten Horns. Notice in Daniel it tells you that three of the Ten are pulled out by the roots to make room for this one little horn. Take three from Ten! What have you? You have SEVEN don't you? That was where this eighth king was to spring from! John said, he was of the SEVEN! That is seven of theTen Horns! So, it's possible to figure out a lot of things in the Bible, if we look very carefully at everything stated! Wannabe
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  flipper

  What did Jesus mean by " this generation " ? Pretty simplistic. Everybody makes it more complicated than it is. He meant HIS generation of Jews he was around. You know, the ones who died in THIS GENERATION in 70 C.E. or were taken prisoner by the Roman armies. Definition of a " generation " in the dictionary is 30 years or so, period. Jesus foretold the destruction of Jerusalem in 33 C.E. - it took place in 70 C.E. - within THAT generation. There is NO extended application. That WAS the application. History bears that out
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  JosephMalik

  Pretty simplistic. Everybody makes it more complicated than it is.

  Flipper,

  Not so fast. This generation is the same as the times of the Gentiles in Luke. They are as much a part of this sign as this generation. We do not have one without the other. And they the Gentiles have been around much longer than the first century, have enslaved the faith in the past, were battled with constantly,were doing it at the time of our Lord, and are still around doing it today. The faith as we know it would no longer be continued by the Jews after our Lord died but by Christians, the new Jerusalem into which all were now invited and which while not so obvious to Jews at the time took its place before God allowing faithful ones to enter as a bride. They are in the Jerusalem that would be surrounded by their enemies and in jeopardy just before our Lord returns and our Lord restores it to its rightful place. None of this happened in 70CE. That was just another war that did not bring an end to Judaism or even threaten the extinction of holy ones at the time and our Lord told them about it outside of this prophecy. So it was covered in other texts. That event in 70CE is not part of any sign that would foretell the presence of Christ and anyone fleeing to the mountains at the time like some did to Masada did not fare well did they? Bad advice? No, just bad interpretation of what our Lord was really saying to us.

  Joseph
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  Mythbuster

  Silly rabbits, it evidently means whatever the watchtower says it means.
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  Doug Mason

  Wannabee,

  If I am able to correctly untangle what you are trying to say, I believe I can see the words and sentiments of CTR as he argued that Christ's parousia had taken place in 1874, that they were living in the Last Harvest Period of 40 years, during which there would be an unprecedented Time of Trouble, and which would usher in an unprecedented time of peace in 1914 under the auspices of the Zionists, with the church having been glorified some years earlier.

  Go back to your basic fundamentals and reason whether they are soundly based. Prove that Revelation had a fulfillment beyond the seven churches that the epistle was written to. Each group who wrote their Scriptures was writing to their own people in their own time, using their own methods of communication. The writers of Revelation had to use symbolism that hid messages from their Roman overlords. Prove that Daniel was not written 400 years after the Babylonian Exile, to explain their own Jewish oppression (200 years before the Christian Era).

  The writers of the "New Testament" tried to make sense of the person they had encountered, whom they had expected was going to free them from the tyranny of Roman oppression. When he was killed by the Romans, they combed desparately through their Hebrew Scriptures seeking an explanation and over time they used their Jewish writings to rationalise their Great Disappointment. These writers were therefore steeped in the Jewish tradition, using Jewish midrashic thinking, and they produced a Jewish document, the Christian Greek Scriptures. So read it all through Jewish eyes. Then you might have a different view of the expression "Last Days".

  As they worked through their position, they realised that God is God not only of the Jews, but that in his sight there is no such thing as a Jew or a Greek, a Hebrew or a Gentile, a male or a female. They realised that God forgives anyone on the basis that they have faith in him, and since this is a gift, it is available to any person of any faith. If I may extrapolate, this means the Hindu, Muslim and Aborigine. To think otherwise is to have a small and petulant god.

  These are my basic fundamentals. Salvation is not earned through correct eschatology, chronology, dating systems, doctrinal precision, nor apocalyptic reasoning. These things are used by people to lord it over others and to control them. Jesus is said to have come to make us free.

  Doug
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  wannabe

  Frankiespeakin!

  It doesn't matter they were unlettered and ordinary men. That doesn't bother the Holy Spirit in the least. That Holy Spirit can teach you, education or not! We're talking about God's Power here! Do you really believe Jehovah is limited? That he can't teach you, merely because you don't possess a College degree? Or university education? Guess again my man! Wannabe
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  JediPisces

  The Generation may also have been relating to the "AGE" or in some scriptures "AEON" As Jesus says, "I will be with you even until the end of the age" Which is the end of the age we are in now, the age of Pisces. A new age happens every 2150 years.

  Some speculate that 2012 will be the new age of Aquarius.

  Look about 2 minutes in of this video:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc-mrJf45Hg
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  Doug Mason

  I know that all posters here are very familiar with Matthew 24, so there is no need to reproduce it in full here.
  
  I suggest that you do print it out (or copy it into a word processing program) and then mark out which words you believe refer to the destruction of the Temple and to the end of the Jewish Age, and then mark out which words refer to some future event.
  
  Then look to see if the reasoning flows consistently or jumps back and forth, depending on preconceptions. By that, I mean was Jesus (or the writers of “Matthew”) mistaken about the imminence of a physical Coming? Were they equating the future downfall of the Jewish “Age” (which is the subject of the original question) with this future Coming? (One must note the repeated references to the false Christs who were thick on the ground at that time.) Were they equating the downfall of the temple with Jesus' Coming?
  
  It is my belief, and we must each be fully convinced in our own minds and I fully allow others to have their views, that the context of this “great distress” relates solely to the destruction of the temple at Jerusalem. And for me, Jesus’ reference to his immediate “generation” confirms that view.
  
  Mt 24:1 attention to its buildings. Mt 24:2 “Do you see all these things?” … every one will be thrown down.” Mt 24:3 … sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”
  
  Mt 24:4 … “Watch out” … Mt 24:6 You will hear … Mt 24:9 “Then you will be handed over … Mt 24:10 At that time … Mt 24:13 stands firm to the end will be saved. Mt 24:14 … kingdom will be preached … then the end will come. Mt 24:15 “you see standing in the holy place … Mt 24:16 those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. … Mt 24:19 dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! z …
  
  Mt 24:21 “For then there will be great distress, … Mt 24:23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. …
  
  Mt 24:29 “Immediately after the distress of those days “ ‘the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’ Mt 24:30 “At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky … Mt 24:34 this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. Doug