Can Someone Please Explain....

by Cold Steel 26 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • yknot
    yknot

    I love watching Kreskin....... (guilty pleasure)

    back to JWs) ....... The 'Bible Teach" publication tries to lead the study into desiring baptism by chapter 18. Most JWs in my area use the half a chapter per week model. This way they can dragout the study time for 18 months. Zeal for getting another dunked is pretty low unless the study conductor is looking to get herself/himself an experience slot at the assembly or convention. ......

    I suggest you download the 'Bible Teach' from the above link and give it a read-over to see if you have any desire or see potential for lively, thought provoking discussion.

    FYI.... 'slave' is still a very oft used term but now it is accompanied more and more with ....'and it's governing body'

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    Thanks for the replies.

    I can't imagine them wanting to drag the lessons out, but it's their dime.

    In some religions, people are allowed to baptize their own sons and daughters. Mostly, this comes from groups who believe in the general, overall priesthood of believers doctrine. Thus, any church member can dunk someone and that's that. In the JW faith, who does the baptizing? Does it go to a certain officer in the church or can anyone do it? (I don't think females are allowed to baptize.) And when someone is baptized, do they have to agree to be obedient to the church's leadership? And let's say I've been baptized into another church, say a non-denominational faith. Do I have to be re-baptized or does the baptism I have work?

    The doctrines of the JW church are, to say the least, a bit unorthodox here and there. Another question I had was, if the church was not created or restored, where was it in the years between Christ's resurrection and the present? In other words, where was the church in 1475? Or in 634? Were there any members of the church of Christ then in existence? Either the church survived from its earliest days to the present or it ceased to be and then was reconstituted, reorganized or restored. What do they believe?

  • JWoods
    JWoods
    The doctrines of the JW church are, to say the least, a bit unorthodox here and there. Another question I had was, if the church was not created or restored, where was it in the years between Christ's resurrection and the present? In other words, where was the church in 1475? Or in 634? Were there any members of the church of Christ then in existence? Either the church survived from its earliest days to the present or it ceased to be and then was reconstituted, reorganized or restored. What do they believe?

    The standard answer (which makes absolutely NO SENSE, of course) is that there have always been just a tiny few "true Christians" on earth since the days of the Apostles. Most nominal Christians are and were "apostate" because they believed in things which the current JW think dissapproves.

    Of course, this does not explain much --- for example, can they name even ONE such true Christian historical group? NO. There is also the embarrasing truth that much of the JW doctrinal body came lock, stock, and barrel from the Seventh Day Adventists (and of course, the SDA are "apostate").

    So, go figure. It is pretty much - do exactly what the Watchtower Society says to do NOW, and FORGET what they used to tell you to do.

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    Well, I'd always hoped there would be active JWs on this board. Instead, it appears most everyone is critical.

    The largest problem the JW have is that if tiny numbers of true Christians always had existed, they would have all had to believe as the current JW leadership believes. At the time the Bible students got together, I'm not aware of anyone believing what the current Watchtower people teach. Jesus being Michael the Archangel, for example. Very peculiar belief and there's no traditional support for that doctrine, so if the "few" Christians were holding to it, they were keeping it close to the vest.

    The most intriging thing is the assumption of power and authority. It seems that the roots of the church go back to Joseph F. Rutherford (whom I had heard was a judge). Recent references to him seem to drop it. He is said to have changed many of the teachings of Charles T. Russell and really developed the church along the lines of his own theology and (apparently) with no divine appointment. I've visited the Witnesses' website and though they have an entire section on the future, there is no "Church History" section. The Wikipedia article on the church states that in 1925, Rutherford "dismissed the Watch Tower's Editorial Committee, giving him full control of the organisation and of material published in the magazine." Then, in 1938, "he introduced a "theocratic" or "God-ruled" organisational system, under which, all appointments in congregations worldwide are made from the Brooklyn headquarters." The notion that God would manifest himself through a publishing company is interesting in and of itself, but how can God rule any organization without divine decree? Had Rutherford claimed to be a prophet, we wouldn't be having this discussion because I would fully understand his claims, just as I understand Muhammad, Joseph Smith, William Foy, Ellen White and Herbert W. Armstrong (who I used to loved watching, even though I didn't believe what he taught). I always thought he had integrity. (He'd hold up a pamphlet and say, "You can't buy this pamphlet! You don't have enough money...but we're going to give it to you!" A preacher who didn't ask for money? That was a swtich!)

    So back to Rutherford, how can one have a theocracy without having a pipeline between the Almighty and the governing body? Rutherford claimed no revelation (and recall that inspiration is revelation!) He never healed the sick as far as I know, never caused the blind to see, never raised the dead. There were no "signs" that followed him. Yet just weeks ago a JW stood on my door and talked to me briefly about the evils of "manmade" religions. Then she handed me a Watchtower.

    Yet, correct me if I'm wrong, no one within the church ever seems to see the rub. If God appointed the leadership of the church, how, exactly, did he do that? And when the leaders of the church tell you you shouldn't criticize them because they're God's servants...er...slaves...whatever, how is one supposed to arrive at this bizarre conclusion? I find it utterly fascinating. The only answer I've ever heard from them is that the authority of their church is reflected in their perfect doctrine. No other church has such flawless doctrine. Well, all churches think they have good doctrine. I don't know of any who believe they have false doctrines, though I'm sure there might be some.

    Since I'm not familiar with the organization today, I don't know anything about it. Does it have any well known (among the church) apologists, famous writers, beloved authors or the such? Are the leaders revered by name? In other words, if someone was going to stand up in church and quote a church authority living today, whom would that person quote? And are there any websites where believers hang out?

    Thanks, again!

  • mouthy
    mouthy

    You want to know how they KNOW they are Jahs Faithful

    LET ME TELL YOU.In Brooklyn Bethel sits 10 or 14( I dont really know now)
    very old men, who are suffering from Dementia,they have get togethers,( board meetings)
    And once in a while they drift off into a nap! When they awake,they have NEW LIGHT
    for all the printers to print ( on a great big printing press I helped pay for)
    Then they con silly fools like me to feel guilty if we dont work for all the sins
    we committed so they tell all "gotta go selling mags"Now you can do it on a donation
    ( government caught them out in that one) So now you know....

    To all of you at Brooklyn that read this site... Back to your naps
    before the birds come to pluck out your eyes.... Oh sorry!!! they dont bother with blind eyes.

  • JWoods
    JWoods
    Well, I'd always hoped there would be active JWs on this board. Instead, it appears most everyone is critical.

    There is a very simple reason for this: The Watchtower stictly prohibits any active witness in their good standing to even look at a board such as this, let alone post on it. The penalty is to be disfellowshipped.

    We have occasionally here some pro-Watchtower trolling, but I have never seen one that actually rang totally true as a real active witness.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    Cold Steel,

    Jesus appointed his apostles and that was it, there were also his disciples that, along with the apostles, made up the core of the 1st generation church in Jerusalem, but after his death he only appointed Paul via Paul's vision on the way to Antioch.

    There was no central authority per say, not how we woudl view it nowasays, but we know from ACTS that the apostles were lead by James and Peter but that they differed to the WHOLE of the congregation for resolving major issues ( like the issue of Paul preaching to the Gentiles).

    There were elders by vertue of their age not special designation, Jesus made it clear that there was only ONE MASTER and that was Jesus and that ALL were brothers EQUALLY under him.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit