Hypothetical Question for Christians

by Sad emo 25 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Sad emo

  Thanks for the info on Francis de Sales, Narkissos. I've had similar wrestlings with the predestination question, a hangover from my RC days - I didn't get myself into as bad a state as he did thankfully! Now my ideas on heaven, hell and salvation have changed so I don't think I have so much issue any more.

  I found the work 'On Loving God' by Bernard of Clairvaux very helpful - this is possibly the work which set me on the path of exploring why I worship/love God.

  http://www.ccel.org/ccel/bernard/loving_god.toc.html

  From ch.1

  'You want me to tell you why God is to be loved and how much. I answer, the reason for loving God is God Himself; and the measure of love due to Him is immeasurable love.'

  From ch.VII:

  'On a lower plane of action, it is the reluctant, not the eager, whom we urge by promises of reward. Who would think of paying a man to do what he was yearning to do already? For instance no one would hire a hungry man to eat, or a thirsty man to drink, or a mother to nurse her own child. Who would think of bribing a farmer to dress his own vineyard, or to dig about his orchard, or to rebuild his house? So, all the more, one who loves God truly asks no other recompense than God Himself; for if he should demand anything else it would be the prize that he loved and not God.'

  The later chapters describe four degrees of loving God - for selfish reasons, loving out of thankfulness, loving God - just because He is God and finally complete denial of self to dwell in God's love (Bernard said only the martyrs were likely to get this far before death).
• 

  outofthebox

  OnTheWayOut,

  Ha ha ha. The mormons is the right answer! Amazingly they look like the Jehovah Witness I know. Check this site: http://eternaverdad.ning.com/photo

  ootb
• 

  Deputy Dog

  Sad emo

  This is a purely hypothetical scenario but needs some deep soul-searching to answer methinks!

  I thought you wanted to do some "deep soul-searching".

  I asked a hypothetical question ie it wasn't intended to nullify anything at all which both you and I know to be true of God's nature:

  I agree, it has little to do with God's nature. I believe it has much more to do with mans nature and total depravity.

  As it stands, you seem unable to address the question without nitpicking and making sweeping judgements about my faith, attitudes and motives - which from a fellow Christian I find truly saddening.

  Was that the purpose for this statement?

  Perhaps you could use some extra warmth for that cold, cynical heart of yours.

  What did you expect from someone with a "cold, cynical heart? That's the problem I don't know if you are serious or not. Which is it?

  Not a little game at all Deputy - it is actually a very serious and big question I'm asking.

  When ever I discuss a "very serious and big question" try not to take my comments as personal as they seem, I'm simply trying to provoke thought about sin and total depravity. Remember, I'm the one that deserves hell, OK.

  So, If you want to do some "deep soul-searching"it may hurt a little. Are you up for it or not? I am.

  I'm still trying to figure out why you added this comment: " ...what if you really didn't deserve Hell but God sent you anyway?" Who doesn't deserve hell?
• 

  garyneal

  Sad emo,

  I've pondered that recently. One of the reasons why I felt the JW's are dangerous is because of their views on blood transfusions. They truly believe that to recieve blood to save your life can cause you to lose it and quote Jesus where He says, "He who finds his life for my sake shall lose it...."

  So what is my daughter needs an emergency blood transfusion to save her life? If it were up to my JW wife, she may die. If the Watchtower is indeed correct, I've literally found myself thinking that I would lay down my life (physical and everlasting) to ensure that she gets the blood transfusion to save hers. My wife just said, "So you think you know more than God?" Pitiful.

  I came to the same conclusion that if I ended up in Hell, I would still witness for God. Even though I am by then eternally seperated from Him.

  I'll start a new thread concerning the blood issue later on.

  Gary
• 

  MissingLink

  How do you think you'd feel towards Him/what would you say.

  I'd kick him in the nuts for being such an evil bastard, and tell him he's the one who deserves hell for all of his atrocities. (if he existed, which of course he doesn't)
• 

  Perry

  You've lived a good, sincere Christian life and put full faith in Christ's sacrifice etc.

  And God says "You're hellbound"

  Of course this is connected to the underlying concern/fear of every child of Adam. The idea that God is in total control is repulsive and assaults man's vanity. Religious people seek some sort of control over their ultimate destiny....under God of course. Others simply dismiss God's authority altogether.

  I can tell you that after I accepted Christ, the Lord impressed upon me the fact that I did not own myself anymore. It was devastating to me psychologically. I was very offended. I died.

  Of course the only alternative is to construct convenient illusions where we imagine control.... be it political, religious, moral, over death, etc. Rather than take God's word as a guarantee, people foolishly would much rather place their trust in themselves or other people ... no matter what their track record.

  Personally, I've gotten used to God being the boss, even if it is still repulsive to my flesh. But, it works. God has proved to me that "good and acceptable and perfect will". His is better than mine. It is one thing to accept Christ's offer of pardon, it is another to say without fear... do with me what you will.