unreasonable nit-picking by witnesses!

Richie

How many of you have had experiences where elders and others in the congregation presented and even pushed their own viewpoints on matters which should be left to each person's own conscience.
We are all aware of the frowns and negative opinions on the way we sometimes dressed; one elder commented on my tie as it was too bright - I once bought a pretty ornament which had a pyramid shape, afterwards a sister said that I should not have this in my house (she did not know precisely why...but sort of felt it was wrong!). We got a few frowns when we had a wind chime, but at least there we did some research on and told the individual to mind his own business.
How many of you know the "demon inspired" Proctor & Gamble sign, which prompted many witnesses to abstain from purchasing any P & G products. How silly! A painting in our house shows a tiny church in the background surrounded by a homely tiny village (similar to a Thomas Kinkade drawing) and sure enough, they also had something to say about that. Many years ago I recall how one district overseer literally scolded those elders who wore mustaches by saying "why do you all wear mustaches? you certainly do not set a fine example by your scruffiness" - At the time I was a newly baptized brother and that incident made me think real hard and wonder why he had the nerve to force his opinion on others like that. In fact, even other brothers did not agree with this DO as some of them recognized already at that time that this was purely a personal opinion and should not have been imposed upon any at all.
Another incident happened closer to home; my son-in-law was about to become an elder and before he was to be appointed, the CO critized him for having a SUV (he was driving a company car) and using a cellular mobile phone in the car. The CO reasoned that these things may be a stumbling block for others, whereas my SIL defended himself by saying that he had to carry the phone with him because of the type of business he was involved in. (Incidentally, a week or so later, another car rear-ended his SUV accidentally, so he got himself another car, a "modest" van) I still cannot believe the audacity of elders and even the R&F how they continue to take over your conscience where they should mind their own business!

Richie :*)

Reborn2002

Amen.

My personal experience was this. At the time I was reading at the Book Study and carrying the mics, I was taken to the back room and told that my sideburns were too long. Mind you, they came to the middle of my ear. I was told that it was too "fashionable" and "worldly-oriented" and if I did not trim them up I would be removed from priviledges. Laughably, at the same time other brothers in the same congregation of a different race has sideburns longer than mine, but it was regarded as acceptable.

I told the Elder where to stick it.

The true Kingdom of God is located in your heart, not an organization of hypocrites.

www.geocities.com/latinloverchicago/Jason1.html for my new webpage and info!! Im trying to live now!!

Richie

Ohh yes, another thing: sisters were not allowed to wear slacks under any circumstances. One of the reasons they quoted at the time: in worldly churches it was not customary to do so either.
However, today I believe it may have been changed (I hope); just imagine anyone observing the sisters going from door to door in -20 degree weather and not wearing slacks for protection....would the "unbeliever" ever imitate such behavior? No, they would call them crazy rather than courageous and let alone be ever interested becoming believers themselves!

Richie :*)

oscartheduck

Personally, I was presenting evidence that there should be no private counsel for elders/ministerial servants. I was writing away to the society quite happily, amused that I was presenting scriptures such as the example where (I forget the names now...) was it Paul coencelling one of the Disciples from the "platform"? I forget now...been a while...

Anyway, I was still a good witness, though, and approachedd the Presiding Overseer with a question about prayer and its effectiveness.

He gave me a home visit and essentially ignored my questions, enforcing his belief that I was doubting God, not the society.

QUOTE - "How many of you have had experiences where elders and others in the congregation presented and even pushed their own viewpoints on matters which should be left to each person's own conscience."

Just a thought about this quote...how many times has a "Questions from Readers" said "this matter is not covered by scripture, but we can see from this obscure reasoning that it is a VILE practice and a PERVERSE one and WOULD BE AN ABOMINATION if we wrote the bible" (or words to that effect...)

============================
The Watchtower, April 15, 1928, p. 126 "As every one knows, there are mistakes in the Bible "

LB

My old hall had lots of personal opinions treated as THE LAW. First it was handguns, no one would be allowed any privledges if they had a handgun. Next was hunting. Once my wife was taken in back because she wore boots under her long dress. She told them 'we live in mud' but that didn't matter.

Life is so much better these days

[b]Never Squat With Yer Spurs On

Englishman

LB,

I was reprimanded for having a plastic replica of a hand gun mounted on the wall. There again, the UK is paranoid about guns in any shape or form.

Englishman.

Bring on the dancing girls!

Scully

One summer we invited some other JWs to our home for a bar-be-que. While I was setting the table, the 'sister' excused herself on the pretense of having to go to the washroom.

When I heard some rustling in the kitchen, I peeked around the corner and caught the 'sister' rummaging around in my trash can. I jokingly said "Oh Joanne, that's not where the loo is!!" and because I caught her off guard she blurted out that she was 'only' trying to find the wrapper for the hotdogs we were serving, to make sure there were no "by-products" (aka blood) in them.

Bloody hell!! all she had to do was ask!! Made me wonder about what she would be doing in the washroom when she finally did go though.

My JW brother-in-law also once criticized me regarding the use of birth control pills when I was first married. I asked him how on earth he would assume that I was on the Pill. He replied that he wasn't assuming. He had seen the package inside the medicine cabinet in the washroom (he would have had to open the cabinet first!).

Another time, again, shortly after I was married, a newly baptized single brother at the KH approached me and said "Don't you think your dress is rather revealing?" (It was actually a ladies' business suit.) I looked him straight in the eye and said "Why are you looking at my body that way in the first place? Maybe we should go over and have a chat about it with my husband, shall we?" The issue suddenly disappeared.

We also had our home and belongings "inspected" for evidence of being demonized (without our knowledge or consent). Apparently a newly baptized sister had "experience" with these kinds of things, and the elders put her up to it. She didn't find anything though, which is strange because we had Crisis of Conscience sitting right in the open on our book shelf.

Love, Scully

VM44

I have to ask this.....

Why would SUVs and cell-phones be a
stumbling block to others?

outnfree

Why would ANY of these things be a stumbling block to others?!!!
Mostly, they were none of their business!

But, VM44?

I gotta think that the DO was just jealous that he couldn't have a cell phone and SUV. Just a staid old Buick for him! lol

outnfree

When the truth is found to be lies
and all the joy within you dies ... -- Darby Slick, Somebody to Love

Richie

VM44...
Regarding SUV's and cell-phones being a stumbling block, I guess Outnfree summed it up quite truthfully: it is none of their business!
Personally, I never felt comfortable with this CO at the time, as I found that he was too afraid of stumbling witnesses in matters of personal preference and behavior. And by doing so, he overruled the freedom of others by forcing his own preference, thinking that he would be protecting the congregation from the "evil outside world". The CO's always receive guidelines and recommendations from the GB on how to deal with prevailing problems in many congregations because of the current trend. Some CO's are more eager than others in applying the "suggestions" given by the WT and in so doing they oftentimes cross the threshold by regulating the conscience of others on issues of personal choice. Pertaining to SUV's they may reason as follows: It's a sporty and expensive looking car - that would be a little difficult for the "poorer" brothers to accept, also the sporty nature may suggest an indirect rebelliousness by wanting to appear "cool" and be "in" with the world - a cellular phone in the car may give that added luxury where some other witnesses would feel deprived and....could be used extensively during service hours and would distract from actual service time by diverting attention from the more important things - then what about the reaction of the householder when they see a SUV parked nearby - it may stumble them too and so on....I am not joking, but that must be the exact reasoning of some elders and CO's in determining their own preference on matters which should be left on the basis of one's own conscience. This CO may have put too much emphasis on the import of Romans14:21, where in essence "we are not to do anything that could stumble our brothers".
Of course, in this instance as in so many other areas, those in power of "lording it over" would make it a burden for other because they overstep the bounderies of common sense by not letting others decide on the basis of their God-given free will and conscience. Basically, this mode of thinking and behavior has perpetrated the Borg since a long time and we can see how this has affected the rank and file negatively. This attitude of the Society well reflects the self-righteous Pharisees in the past, as they too were biased in their application of the Law that they made it burdensome for the people, insisting that it be observed according to their own concepts and traditions. They completely lost sight of the important matters, namely, justice, mercy, faithfulness, and love of God. And so it goes similarly with the WTBTS today...

Richie :*)

unreasonable nit-picking by witnesses!

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