by Perry 57 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
I forgot to answer your primary question. The only thing a cult background has given me is, perhaps, the ability to detect BS a bit more easily than conventionally raised people.
Apostates -- all together now -- "THANK YOU, WATCHTOWER BIBLE AND TRACT SOCIETY."
I would contribute handsomely to a study of CT brain scans of atheists compared to the other 99% of the population. I would bet a small fortune the brains of atheists are different. How atheists can be so utterly dishonest is beyond description.
I just quoted the definition from a dictionary and it is still claimed that atheists are something other than what I and the dictionaries state!!!
For most people, this level of cognitive dissonance would be impossible without first having spent years in a cult.
Perry, I think you missed my point.
I don't believe in your god because he has not in any way been visible in the world's affairs in my lifetime, and in several lifetimes. Or anyones lifetime. Your old scrolls that you rely on are superstitious artifacts, not eyewitness accounts miraculously preserved. Sorry..... And I say that because, while you would try to sell scientific fact as evidence of gods existence, your primary source remains the bible. The facts you use are minus personality.
Nobody's god, even (especially?) your's, is anywhere. Not around, period. No evidence. Period. Where is she?
How I got here? My parents had sex. Beyond that, I don't suffer from cogntive dissonance. God hasn't revealed himself to anyone. If he has revealed himself to you, do you have an audio or video recording?
Science reveals a lot, and there are a lot of constants, but personality is not among them. Facts aside, there is no personality in any of the stats you or anyone else use.
Lets accept a fact, I can only ascribe existence where personality lives. There might be power that we all observe, but no personality exists behind it. Thus, in the absence of personality, in the absence of communication by said personality (who supposedly is omnipotent, save for her inability to speak) there can be no worship given to a specific deity, whose sole existence can only be propped up by its believers and adherants.
In the absence of personality, you are left with facts to manipulate to your biblical world view. Spout scriptures all you want, you still have proven absolutely nothing.
And I dispute what you wanted to discuss during this thread. If you want to change direction, feel free. But the title of your thread here, and the statement I quoted from you earlier about how atheists suffer from cognitive dissonance are indisputable, and certainly what I responded to. So I don't take that your change of direction here is very pertinent. Pick a topic and stay on topic.
If you want to talk about your view of cognitive dissonance in atheists, then lets talk about that, in view of any definition you want. If you want to talk about how atheists are in your view, mis-interpreting scientific data, thats fine to. Just pick one.
Other then that, what did you want to talk about?
Perry: "I would contribute handsomely to a study of CT brain scans of atheists compared to the other 99% of the population. I would bet a small fortune the brains of atheists are different. How atheists can be so utterly dishonest is beyond description."
If our brains are different, then why should we be blamed for being atheists? Where exactly on the DNA strand is the "belief in God" or "nonbelief in God" gene? And when I was in the cult and "believed," would my brain scan have shown a different reading than it does now? If you pay me handsomely, I'll submit to a brain scan right now. How much is "handsomely"?
Remember my BS detector in my previous post? The indicator is pinging ..... loudly.
Still like your parrot, though. (Although, because I'm a cognitive-dissonant, dishonest atheist, I must be wrong.) What's his/her name?
Maybe the problem Perry is you've yet to realize the words and writings in the bible were by mens own perceptual imaginations
imaginations that people like yourself are still supporting after thousands of years of human progress..
There wasn't a word in the bible that wasn't written by a man, by his own thoughts by his own knowledge of the world that HE lived in..
Interesting is it not that the bible states that man was made in gods own image.
Maybe men were wishing they could be a god with all the power of a god, could you imagine that, I could.
There sure were a lot of gods back in those ancient times as you know , just pick one.
. ..... Hey how come there are only handful now, where did they all go ?
Now, for a moment let's forget about the overlapping dino/human footprints in 70 million year old rock that destroys the atheist/evolution world-view.
Bzzzt! Thanks for playing! We have lovely parting gifts, including a year long subscription to this: http://doctore.blog.is/users/b4/doctore/img/el-gran-poco.jpg
I'll even overlook the fact that in atheism it is impossible to know right from wrong.
Percentage of atheists in the general population: 15 (Sorry, Sparky, that's the real number.)
Percentage of atheists in the prison population: .2 (That's POINT two. As in a fraction of a percent. Perhaps someone can 'splain fractions to you.)
Is there anything you're not wrong about?
I don't bother arguing evolution with creationists – it’s like arguing calculus with Special Olympians. But it is fun to point that their tiny brains and giggle. http://www.davehitt.com/blog2/little-rubber-brains/
I'd just like to point out that Perry has used the typical creationist fallback approach. He has started with wild claims about dinosaur footprints and misrepresenting atheism. When called on this, he falls back to constants from the laws of physics. He has not tackled the objections to his original post, none of which is at all relevant to the question posed in the topic.
I'd just like to point out that Perry has used the typical creationist fallback approach. He has started with wild claims about dinosaur footprints and misrepresenting atheism. When called on this, he falls back to constants from the laws of physics. He has not tackled the objections to his original post, none of which is at all relevant to the question posed in the topic.
Exactly Gladring.
Perry, I don't mean to be piling on, but let me give you a sketch of this thread:
You started with a claim that atheists suffer from cognitive dissonance, and that this came as a result of being in a cult. (see post #1)
After several replies, you told us about your day, your new business, and your meeting of an old friend who served in the military. (which while mildly interesting, had nothing to do with the topic. Yesterday, I watched the NCAA tournament)
You then talked about something totally different from your original post (see post #1) by bringing up statistical figures and making certain statements about Science and how it supports creationism.
You then alluded to a dictionary definition of what an atheist is (I will take them as you put it: #1: the doctrine or belief that there is no God #2: disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings.) No problem here. I don't believe in the existence of a supreme being.
Then you said something that I must call you out on. This is one of the most arrogant things I have read from you in quite some time:
When I evangelize JW's, I have to first help them to understand what they actually believe. Most do not know that Jesus is not their Mediator. However, they can make this connection when it is pointed out that they are outside of the New Covenant and that Jesus is the mediator of the N.C.
Likewise, many atheists don't actually know what they believe. When an atheist posits the conclusion "there is no God" ; by definition he must assume that he knows all things so that he can say that he looked everywhere and has logical reason for his conclusion. However, if he could do this, then he would in actuality become the very thing that he asserts doesn't exist. Either way the atheist would be wrong.
Wow. This is just like a JW. So lets see, you are qualified in some way to help me understand what I actually believe? No thank you. You are not only not qualified, your views are not based in reality. You have a personal belief that consumes you, that is clear, and that is all.
You imply I don't know what I believe simply because I don't accept your god. How many times will atheists or agnostics tell you the same thing, that we do not know. YOU ARE THE ONE MAKING THIS ASSUMPTION THAT WE DO KNOW. Atheists don't claim special knowledge at all. This is your effort to reframe and win an argument. You are 100% wrong in what you say, and besides that, I view this as deliberate intellectual dishonesty on your part. In other words, it is my strong impression that you are purposely stating falsehoods to win an argument.
Your efforts are very clear to me. You have a very superstitious (and fundamentalist) based view of Jesus and the bible, which is that if you say it enough, Jesus will draw them to him as he has you.
This might surprise you, but I am mildly sympathetic to the existence of a higher power. But as your world view is clearly based on Christian fundamentalism, there isn't anything anyone can say to you about an honest appraisal of your beliefs, or the possibilities of other types of gods and higher powers exisiting. You are so deep in your own comfort (my word for your faith) that you reject well over 6 billion other peoples beliefs. Sure is nice of your god to make himself so plain to the rest of the world.
I only engage you in this way so that others who read this will at least have something to think about. I sure hope that others who conclude that they must worship Jesus, or worship at all, do so for reasons other then what you posit. Jesus would want it that way.
As an example of what I mean about you reframing the question and definitions Perry, you are doing the same thing that JW's do with the Trinity.
JW's teach one small, narrow definition of the Trinity, convince people that this is how all religions view the Trinity, and then get them to reject it, so they can worship YHWH.
You take the dictionary defintions of atheism (which even with your examples, precisely allow for what all the atheists have said in response to you) add your own narrow view and assumptions of how all atheists think, convince others that this is how all atheists view things, and get people to reject it so they can worship your god.
You are doing exactly what JW's do to win an argument. Sorry to say, to those that have been there, we recognize it. You don't have any evidence, and certainly no logic with you. To succeed with whatever you are trying to do, your only chance to win is to take control of the conversation and the questions, and not allow for any other possibilities or contrasting points of view. How sad.
