Elder stakeouts! Anyone done one / been a victim of one?

by sir82 28 Replies latest jw friends

  • neverendingjourney
    neverendingjourney
    The elders' manual says the "strong circumstantial evidence, such as evidence that the accused spent all night in the house of someone of the opposite sex who is not his wife or a family member" (paraphrase) can be used as evidence in a judicial case.

    This just shows how antiquated the Watchtower's thinking is. I have spent the night at single women's homes a few times without having sex, yet I could be disfellowshipped on this kind of "proof." In fact, I've even slept in the same bed with women without it ending up in sex.

    Their whole thinking assumes that people are sex-craved maniacs waiting for the opportunity to act out on their secret lascivious desires. As a JW man you're not allowed to be alone with a woman for fear of it leading to sex.

    After leaving the JWs, I was really surprised to find out that the real world doesn't operate this way. A good friend of mine who lived with his girlfriend had a male roommate living with them as well. It's now common to have male/female roommate situations that are completely platonic, yet the WT feels that a male sleeping in the same house as a female who's not related to him is strong enough circumstantial evidence to "prove" fornication. They're living in the 1920s. Young people today would laugh at the idea that a single man and a single woman spending the night under the same roof is evidence of them having sex. That's just not reality.

  • cameo-d
    cameo-d
    They're living in the 1920s. Young people today would laugh at the idea that a single man and a single woman spending the night under the same roof is evidence of them having sex. That's just not reality.

    Don't they use some scripture about "avoiding the appearance of evil" to justify that?

  • asilentone
    asilentone

    cameo, what is the scripture that talks about "avoiding the appearance of evil"?

  • jamiebowers
    jamiebowers

    How fucking pathetic is this story? A grown man couldn't go out on a date with a grown woman because some group of men said he couldn't. And then this grown man has to get someone to sit in front of his former wife's house to prove to them that guys visited her overnight. Read this story and tell me this ain't no fucked up cult...

    Young people today would laugh at the idea that a single man and a single woman spending the night under the same roof is evidence of them having sex. That's just not reality.

    These stories are exactly the reason why I refused to hang around to see if my crazy jw husband would choose to commit adultery or murder after I filed for divorce due to physical abuse and death threats. Can you imagine a battered, terrorized woman staking out her crazy husband who was threatening to kill her? I moved into a rooming house where four men lived upstairs, and I lived downstairs with the female owner of the house. I suppose that was enough to disfellowship me, and later I moved into an apartment with two of the guys from the rooming house. I wasn't sleeping with either one of them, but after I got df'd I started going with and eventually married one of the guys.

  • Gregor
    Gregor

    I once went to a big party out in the valley (Los Angeles area). I was sixteen ('61) Rock and Roll was the rage, Fats, Chuck Berry, Elvis, dancing "The Twist" the "Watusi" the "Monkey" etc. During the party a buddy told me that there were several older brothers outside the house and grounds watching from the dark. We went outside around the house and sure enough there were guys in the bushes looking in every window. Even though I had done nothing wrong (except getting a little wood while slow dancing with a chubby little redheaded sister) I felt really bad, like I had been at a sex orgy or something.

    As an elder we once investigated and ultimately disfellowshipped a nice widowed sister because a nosy JW neighbor reported a man leaving her house very early in the morning.

    What a nasty business!

  • yknot
    yknot

    Not me personally......at least to my knowledge.

    But there have been several stalkings (mostly teenagers) in my KH where the Tweedle Elder-Dee and Elder-Dum got caught and confronted. It caused a great loss of respect and lowered morale to the point where most wondered what was the point of being good when it had already been decided that they were bad...... if you are gonna lose privileges, be labeled, and grounded.....better make it damn worth it!

    This is when the youth started attending worldly parties out on private ranchlands, instead of being stalked at Sonic or DQ and condemned for associating with worldly (read-a worldly kid stopped by the JW table/ cars and chatted)

  • Bonnie_Clyde
    Bonnie_Clyde
    I know of one case where a divorced brother wanted to date a sister but the elders said he couldn't because he was still "scripturally" married due to his former wife (not a JW) not having remarried. The brother knew that she was sleeping around but couldn't prove it, so he and an elder staked her house out for a few nights until they saw a guy go in with her about 10 or 11pm and then leave the next morning. That was his proof. He was then considered "free to remarry" and was given permission to date the sister he liked.

    How pathetic is this story? A grown man couldn't go out on a date with a grown woman because some group of men said he couldn't. And then this grown man has to get someone to sit in front of his former wife's house to prove to them that guys visited her overnight.

    That story is very similar to my son's. His ex-wife admitted to her affair, he tape recorded it, played it to the elders, but they said that wasn't enough evidence--because she denied the affair when talking to the elders. So another elder talked my son into going with him to stake out her house. They got the evidence, but it turned out it wasn't necessary because the ex-wife finally confessed.

    Five years later our son finally found the right girl--she was also divorced. The elders wouldn't take her word that she was scripturally free ro remarry. They had to get a signed letter from her parents that they knew for a fact that her ex-husband was living with another woman.

    Thankfully, our son and daughter-in-law are out of the "truth" now, and these events helped them along.

  • carla
    carla

    I have heard these stories before on the boards and I hope you all continue to post your stories to validate the insanity of the wt. I also remember a story of a married man who moved in with another woman but the wife could not divorce because there was no 'proof' he was living in sin or having sex with the woman. (what did they need? used condoms with dna testing?) If memory serves, he was never df'd for this. Maybe he was a favorite of the elders or related?

    These stories just make me sick, literally turns my stomach. The average jw will never believe these stories. Mine doesn't.

  • Mickey mouse
    Mickey mouse
    A lot of elders love that cloak and dagger shit. It's tons more fun to sit in a car all night pretending to be Jim Rockford than it is to go out in service on Saturday morning.

    That made me LOL! Some elders love this stuff because it's the only "importance" they have in life.

    I've heard of elder stakeouts going on and can think of one or two people who were d/f on the basis of evidence of a stakeout.

  • Mary
    Mary
    jamiebowers said: These stories are exactly the reason why I refused to hang around to see if my crazy jw husband would choose to commit adultery or murder after I filed for divorce due to physical abuse and death threats. Can you imagine a battered, terrorized woman staking out her crazy husband who was threatening to kill her? I moved into a rooming house where four men lived upstairs, and I lived downstairs with the female owner of the house. I suppose that was enough to disfellowship me.."

    Gee----you mean your ex-Dub hubby was never DF'd for beating you? How unusual that the elder body wouldn't do anything about that!! Unfortunately, your story is all-too familiar....

    I've never had the elders stalk me but I know a friend of mine was. He and his then-wife had stopped going to the meetings for a couple of years. His wife had slept with his best friend when they were still going to the Hall, but my friend decided to forgive her and try and make the marriage work. It didn't. He was absolutely miserable being married to her so they split up. One night, he was taking some of her stuff over to her brothers' house when he noticed that the car that had been sitting out front of his house, started following him. They followed him all the way to his brother-in-law's house. He dropped the stuff off, then went directely up to their car, hammered on the window, they rolled the window down and sure enough, there was an elder and an MS sitting there. My friend yelled "What the f*ck are you doing?" They didn't say anything so my friend said "If I ever see you sitting outside my house or following me again, I'll have you both charged with stalking and you can tell the rest of elders that too."

    They took off like a bat out of hell and never stalked him again.

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