How To Get People Out

by OneFootIn 23 Replies latest jw friends

  • OneFootIn

    Has anyone had any success in getting anyone else out? How do you even go about doing this without getting DF'd for apostasy?

    Is there any way of using the principles we learned about preaching in reverse to get people out?

    One Foot In

  • sacolton

    I haven't found a way.

  • jgnat

    I satisfy myself by planting seeds. People have to be ready to leave themselves before they will listen. I particularly like to strike up conversations with new studies (before baptism), the lonely, the widows, the elderly, the "bad association", and the ignored.

    With new studies, I compliment them on their independence, intelligence, and their ability to make up their own minds.

    To the "bad association", I mention how I would like to be anywhere else but at the meeting.

    For ANY witness, I talk about themselves; their interests and hobbies. When not in witness mode, they real, genuine, interesting people.

    For the pioneer sisters desperate to mark their time and to collect gossip, I keep my conversation blessedly short.

  • Awakened07

    Hi, welcome to the forum.

    It's hard. It has to come from within themselves. There's too much fear going on in their head; fear of losing their eternal future life, fear of apostates, fear of Satan, fear of losing their friends and family that is in.... fear.

    This means that even if they are subjected to factual, truthful statements and findings that expose the WBTS, they will push it away; almost literally put their fingers in their ears and sing la-la-la-la.

    I think I opened up to the possibility that they were wrong because everyday life made me have to skip a few meetings, and I eventually managed to look at things 'from the outside'. Only short glimpses at first, but it was eventually enough to make me finally curious enough to do some research.

    That said, I vividly remember an illustration a CO gave in an assembly talk; this was so horrible that even though I was still in at the time, it made me see things differently. So it can be done. Then again, I was never a 'super-witness'. So I guess I already had the distance needed to be able to actually think for myself about the content of the illustration.

    - If at all possible, I think it takes time. You can't just show them something out of the blue and expect them to leave instantly, no matter how factual and true that something is. But... people are different.

    Some here have some experience in this, but I'm not sure how successful they've been.

  • OneFootIn

    So you still go to meetings? Even though you know all the stuff that's not right with it? How do you manage to do that? I'd find it really tough to sit there and listen to all their talk regularly and not crack up! I haven't been to a meeting in months and very very few JWs have any contact with me though I've not been "disciplined" or done anything I shouldn't have. Deep-rooted friendships, eh?

    I've been having nightmares lately, about the ministry mostly. And I've been feeling guilty about a woman I used to study with. More than anyone else, i want to tell her the truth about things (UN, blood, etc) so that she can make a free decision to leave if that's what she wants. If she gets baptized before she knows about these things, it'll be too late and she'll be in the same trap as the rest of us. :( As it is, she's having to make big sacrifices and is now studying with a sister who really will put pressure on her to conform.

    It's so frustrating that there are all these JW books and sequences of "logic" to make converts and very little help anywhere in trying to get people to open their minds and leave it.

  • undercover

    Some have had success in helping people out of the control of the WTS. Usually it's with a spouse or family member or very close friend.

    It's been my experience that unless one is already questioning or having doubts, you're not going to get far. Dubs are so indoctrinated so as to defend their faith and to block out anything negative about the WTS that it's like beating your head agasint the wall when trying to get them to see the facts.

    BTW, Welcome. And you know you're going to hell for the blasphemy in your avatar...

  • Awakened07
    It's so frustrating that there are all these JW books and sequences of "logic" to make converts and very little help anywhere in trying to get people to open their minds and leave it.

    I guess it's easier to close an open mind, than it is to open a closed mind. There are books on combating cult mind control (which are not written about JWs, but fits), and there are books like Crisis of Conscience, but when their minds are already closed, they won't touch those books in the first place.

  • jgnat
    So you still go to meetings? Even though you know all the stuff that's not right with it? How do you manage to do that?

    I'm married to a Witness, so I am exposed to the madness on occassion. I don't go that often. But I just came back from two days at the DC, so maybe Witnesses and their association is fresh on my mind. How do I cope? I zone out. I have a blank notebook for my personal thoughts. I fiercly maintain my individuality. I had to walk away from one enthusiastic sister who was raving about the upcoming drama, which I already knew was going to sicken me. In some ways it's easier, because I was never a Witness. I've always been an outsider, and there is no pull. The "trigger words" have no effect on me.

    In your situation, since you are "out" with no desire to return, I suggest if any JW talks to you at all, to invite them to go for coffee with you if they are ever interested in why you left. That way, you save your breath for those who are ready to hear.

    As for your former study, how about sending her a note briefly explaining that you've decided to no longer follow the Witnesses, and if she is interested in knowing why, to get in touch.

  • megs

    There are a lot of good points being made... You can plant the seeds, but whether or not they take root depends on if the person is open to it. A lifetime of being indoctrinated by fear takes a long time to overcome. If you are trying to get someone out, I would suggest learning as much as you can about the "religion's" history (I use that term loosely because I personally think it's a cult) and mind-control. Steven Hassan has written a few really informative books on mind control and you can clearly see the JW parallels. Also, as I'm sure everyone here will tell you, read Crisis of Conscience by Raymond Franz, essential reading! It may not help you get them out, but you'll understand things a lot more clearly.

  • V

    People get themselves out, when they give permission to themselves to give up the false hopes of the WT. That's really the hook, the promise of everlasting life, justice, resurrection, etc.

    Before that release a person becomes aware of the numerous fallacies of JW belief, the sorted history, the botched interpretations, and the clumsy PR skills of the Governing Body. But even with all knowledge, many JWs stay faithful for one very reason...

    "Where else would we go?"

    For the same reason battered women stay with their abusers...

    I believe it is important to motivate JWs with damning knowledge about their religion, but without attacking their ego. JWs are a proud lot, they have the Truth after all! That's why the exit has to be a "self" discovery.

    I have been producing the Watchtower Comments videos with the help of the best in the ex-JW community. Each video proves it's point using only WT quotes, and is available on YouTube, the perfect watch-in-the-privacy-of-your-own-home-initial-twinge-of-guilt-soon-replaced-by-the-aha-moment media.

    See all videos here:

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