Mormons, the origin of man. (video)

by free2beme 31 Replies latest jw friends

  • kerj2leev

    PBS Frontline did a documentary on the LDS, which was very interesting.

    What we are talking about here are the teachings of the mainstream church. Can you imagine the wackiness that is found in some of the off shoots....yikes!

  • zeroday
    "Hence, the doctrine of a plurality of Gods is as prominent in the Bible as any other doctrine. It is all over the face of the Bible . . . Paul says there are Gods many and Lords many . . . but to us there is but one God--that is pertaining to us; and he is in all and through all" (History of the Church, Vol. 6, page 474). "In the beginning, the head of the Gods called a council of the Gods; and they came together and concocted a plan to create the world and people it."

    (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 5).

    "God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted Man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens...I say, if you were to see him to-day, you would see him like a man in form -- like yourselves, in all the person, image, and very form as a is necessary that we should understand the character and being of God, and how he came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity, I will refute that idea, and will take away and do away the veil, so that you may see....and that he was once a man like us; yea, that God himself the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth the same as Jesus Christ himself did."

    (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 3).

    There are Men on the moon who dress like Quakers and live to be nearly 1000 years old.

    The Young Woman's Journal, Vol. 3, pages 263-264

    "I told the brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding by its precepts, than by any other book."

    (History of the Church, Vol. 4, page 461)
    "God is in the still small voice. In all these affidavits, indictments, it is all of the devil--all corruption. Come on! ye prosecutors! ye false swearers! All hell, boil over! Ye burning mountains, roll down your lava! for I will come out on the top at last. I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet . . . "

    (History of the Church, Vol. 6, p. 408-409).
    ". . .I prophesy in the name of the Lord God of Israel, unless the United States redress the wrongs committed upon the Saints in the state of Missouri and punish the crimes committed by her officers that in a few years the government will be utterly overthrown and wasted, and there will not be so much as a potsherd left . . . "

    (History of the Church, Vol. 5, p. 394.)

    Just a few words from the Prophet Joseph Smith...

  • Quandry

    It is the opinion of Orson Pratt an no one else. He is entitled to his opinion, but not entitled to speak for the Church. The Church has never given a statement regarding this issue. It is pure speculation.

    If he does not speak for the church, why are quotes from his thoughts in the book used by students who wish to become LDS? I once had a Bible student who was studying with the LDS at the same time. She showed me her book. His name was prominent as were quotes from him.

    So, Susan, how is he not entitled to speak for the church?

  • Qcmbr

    I don't wish to end up playing apologist but here's the context of all this:

    1/ LDS consider all of mankind to be descended from a spiritual family that preceded Adam's mortal creation. Just as Jesus preceded his physical birth (making the assumption that most christians are trinitarians) so did we. Thus references to God being our Father can often be read more literally for the LDS than simply to denote a disciple relationship.
    2/ Since we derive from a family then family is eternal and family is the core of every religious practise and performance - everything revolves around the continuance of the Eternal family (not simply the 'selfish gene' but also the 'selfish spirit'.) This explains why marriage for eternity is important.
    3/ This life is merely the beginning and ending of mortality - it is not the beginning nor ending of existence. What is done here in mortality has a divine purpose in that we learn pain and loss - something impossible before or after since it requires imperfection (a body that can suffer and die.) God had to learn it the same way we did. So did Jesus.
    4/ God is an interchangeable title for Father and so while we have one God in heaven there are also many gods in heaven. Just as we recognise our Father so He must recognise His Father (just as Jesus recognises his Father and yet can also play the role of 'God'.) Simply put there is an infinite regression of Gods (LDS offer no explanation of this paradox beyond a recognition that 'our' God was once mortal upon some planet somewhere and He had His own God) This leads to the concept that we can also go on to 'grow up' and become like our Father ergo we get to be gods and create worlds for our future spiritual children.
    5/ What we do at each phase of our life determines whether we can progress to be like God - Lucifer, part of our family in heaven (and indeed Jesus's brother and our brother) rebelled before mortal earthly life and so never received mortality and so can never progress onward. Those who followed Jesus and rejected Lucifer came here to experience a physical existence, here on earth we get to accept the atonement or reject it. If we reject it we again stop our progression and get resurrected but no more. Those who accept the atonement can have eternal families of their own and can organise spiritual families the final stage in our progression.

    This is story that underpins LDS theology, understanding that explains baptism for the dead (mortal acceptance of the atonement is signified by baptism - all people must accept the atonement to progress, the physically dead but spiritually alive await to progress in a spiritual prison until the 'hearts of the children are turned to their father' and the work gets done. This is the whole purpose of the thousand year millenium - to redeem the dead), it explains why fidelity and marriage are prized so highly, it also explains why mormons often need MPVs - kids are an essential part of families.

    As for why is the BOM a partial copy of the KJ bible that is fairly simple. Unlike secular translations that re-translate ancient texts into the language of the translator(s) - i.e. each translator reads things and writes things different to the next translator despite the same source material - God had already said (to Joseph) that the bible as translated by KJs translators had been inspired and they had been guided to translate it as correctly as the source material would allow. Thus only where any revelation differed significantly in meaning (i.e. at some stage a copyist or translator had made a mistake intentional or otherwise and had thus rendered a new reading) did the english version of the BOM deviate from the KJ version. In effect - to the LDS way of thinking - God was also confirming which parts of the KJ bible were spot on and which bits weren't. If Joseph was smart enough to create the lie of the BOM it would be an odd deviation from his 'artistic brilliance' to half way through abandon his pretence and resort to the silly 'mistake' of copying.

  • inkling
    Jesus and his brother Lucifer?

    I have actually always been quite fond of that myth.

    Wouldn't it be just perfect if all our trouble was caused by a galactic sibling rivilry?


  • reniaa

    Mormon church is richest one in america tithing it members for money.

  • Qcmbr

    I would have thought the Catholics were...

  • Shawn10538

    Does anybody see any similarities between the reactiong of these Mormon apologists and Witnesses? HMMMM. Persecution complex to the max! Poor babies can't take people laughing at their little religion. When something sounds ridiculous, it usually is. Notice how the Mormons (Susan and Q) refer to the makers of the cartoon as "enemies" and accuse them of having an agenda? Of course THEY do not have an agenda, right? Sounds to me like they label their apostates the same way JWs do. Why, oh why be a member of this board and then go out accusing people of being apostates (enemies) when this board is chock full of apostates?

    As I've said many times, the fact that there are practicing Mormons on this site is the absolute pinnacle of a negative reaction to cognitive dissonance. Calling people who disagree with you "enemies' is a dead give away that someone is not being up front.

    Furthermore, if even ONE of the facts on the cartoon were true, that would be enough to justify laughing your ass off ebery time you see Mormons out telling people how wrong they are.

    Indians who were preached to by Christ? Come on. Lamanites never existed, they were made up by Smith. If they existed then we would be teaching about them in public schools. Jews in N. America before Columbus? HA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH...

    If more people were to laugh at crazy doctrines like those of the Mormons, then the world would have fewer religions and be a better place. The fact that people feel obliged to be "respectful of other people's crazy beliefs ' just makes shenanigans and huxters proliferate and prosper.

    When something sounds crazy, it probably is.

  • Shawn10538

    Also notice how fast they take off and run when presented with disconfirming evidence? JUST LIKE WITNESSES and every other cult out there. I think the most revealing part of this thread is how first Susan, (and soon Q) have (will) just fled (will flee) with their hands over their ears saying "lalalalala, I can't hear you!" Maybe it would be better if they would just admit that they are in the church for social reasons and not because it is the "truth.' I mean, the social advantages of being a Mormon are great. Here's just a few:

    Food banks (never have to worry about eating)
    Fun crafts and board games
    strong families (at least until one tries to leave)
    Feeling superior to others due to stringent morals (no sex drugs and only a little bit of rock and roll mixed with just a little bit country)
    Not having too many black people to deal with, (in any cse, they know their history and they know their place in that church)

    I'll let someone else continue...

  • Qcmbr

    Sorry Shawn - I don't get what you are trying to say. I wasn't aware that anyone was running away. If you can't see that making your mind up about how you will treat someone or some group of people based upon watching a cartoon made by someone who really dislikes them and plays loose with the truth is just a bit silly then who really is putting their hands over their ears?

    Now if you mean that, having said my piece, I stop posting on this thread responding to every taunt and you want to play last person who posts is right then so be it. You can dress up hate any which way you want to but it still smells the same - you may wish to hide your venom beneath 'persecution complex' ideas but I'm not going to let you manipulate me into passive acceptance. Read what you wrote and ask yourself if that's a rational, grown up thought process you displayed.

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