New testament contradictions.

by Anti-Christ 48 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  BurnTheShips

  Let me add one more thing. From Justin Martyr's First Apology, written c. 150 AD:

  And hear what part of earth He was to be born in, as another prophet, Micah, foretold. He spoke thus: “And thou, Bethlehem, the land of Judah, art not the least among the princes of Judah; for out of thee shall come forth a Governor, who shall feed My people.” 1833 1833 Mic. v. 2.
  Now there is a village in the land of the Jews, thirty-five stadia from Jerusalem, in which Jesus Christ was born, as you can ascertain also from the registers of the taxing made under Cyrenius, your first procurator in Judæa.

  http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.viii.ii.xxxiv.html

  This work was addressed to Antoninus Pius, Marcus Aurelius, and Lucius Verus. As imperial authorities, they could easily ascertain that Cyrenius (Quirinius) was in charge of the taxing. It is also the case (according to Tacitus) that provinces were appointed not only a governor, but an equestrian procurator, independently, and the two were not always the best of friends.
• 

  BurnTheShips

  What about the other problem with the verses? I you don't remember I will quote the two verses for you.

  There is no problem. After Jesus was born, they likely tarried in Bethlehem for a while, until after going to the Temple, then they returned to Nazareth, which was their home at the time. Some period of time transpired between that event and the visit of the magi and Herod's baby killing. Read the link there was probably a 15 month time between the two. By then, they had moved back to Bethlehem. This also explains why Herod wanted all the boys younger than 2 killed. After the visit from the Magi, they left for Egypt,but likely did not want to go back to Bethlehem because of what had transpired there and so they returned to Nazareth. According to the chronology in the link below, they were probably only in Egypt for a couple of months.

  http://www.versebyverse.org/doctrine/birthofchrist.html

  1. Joseph and Mary journeyed to Bethlehem for the "census" (registration) at the very close of the Jewish civil year (an apt time for a registration of peoples to occur) in late Summer, 3BC, Lk.2:1.
  2. Jesus was born in a stable in the early evening hours (just as the Jewish calendar advanced to 1 Tishri) of September 11, 3BC.
  3. He was circumcised on September 19, 3BC, Lk.2:21
  4. He was dedicated in the Temple on October 21, 3BC.
  5. Luke says, "they returned to Galilee, to their own city of Nazareth", Lk.2:39. This means that they did not go to Egypt after the birth of Christ. After all, they had only gone to Bethlehem for the "census", not to move there. So, the family returned to Nazareth in the latter part of October (during that time, they located a house to live in).
  6. Then for some reason (they probably thought that a better place to raise the Messiah would be in Jerusalem’s back yard) they decided to move to Bethlehem. This could have been in the Spring or Summer of 2BC. They set up house there, Mt.2:11.
  7. Then on December 25, 2BC, when the planet Jupiter came to its stationary point in mid-Virgo and was in meridian over Bethlehem, the Magi arrived in Bethlehem bearing gifts meant for a king.
  8. Joseph and Mary fled to Egypt, having been forewarned by an angel in late December, 2BC.
  9. Herod killed the male children "in Bethlehem and in all its environs, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had ascertained from the magi", Mt.2:16. This matter of killing two-year-old children can now make good sense. If Jesus was born in September, 3BC, the slaying of infants was about 15 months after His birth. If the conception period were also considered, it comes to 24 months exactly.
  10. Joseph and Mary returned from Egypt, having been told that Herod was dead (Herod died in January, 1BC) and took up residence in Nazareth, Mt.2:19-23.
  11. In the spring of 11AD, Jesus visited Jerusalem with His parents and observed Passover, Lk.2:41-42.
  12. Jesus began His public ministry just after He reached the age of 31, in October or November, 29AD. This satisfies the statement in Lk.3:23 "And when He began His ministry, Jesus Himself was about thirty years of age…".
• 

  Anti-Christ

  You missed the point BTS. In Matthew it is written that they stay in Nazareth (Galilee) because Joseph is afraid of Herod's son Archelaus but in Luke it is written that they go to Jerusalem (Judea) year after year. So which is it? They stayed in Galilee until the end of the reign of Archelaus or they go to Jerusalem year after year?
• 

  Anti-Christ

  An other thing. Why is it that the only place there is an account of the massacre of babies is in Matthew? I think something like that would be reported elsewhere.
• 

  Anti-Christ

  The chronology you use is off on a lot of things.
• 

  BurnTheShips

  You missed the point BTS. In Matthew it is written that they stay in Nazareth (Galilee) because Joseph is afraid of Herod's son Archelaus but in Luke it is written that they go to Jerusalem (Judea) year after year. So which is it? They stayed in Galilee until the end of the reign of Archelaus or they go to Jerusalem year after year?

  Ah. I understand. There is no contradiction in the statement above. They lived in Nazareth of Galilee, but they still visited Jerusalem for the yearly festival. I suppose it would be wasy to be lost in the crowds of the faithful pilgrims. I don't think the one precludes the other in this case. Its a false dilemma.

  http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/grk.cgi?number=402&version=kjv
• 

  BurnTheShips

  An other thing. Why is it that the only place there is an account of the massacre of babies is in Matthew? I think something like that would be reported elsewhere.

  Possibly, but Bethlehem was a small place. It amounted to only a handful of children: Modern writers reduce the number considerably, since Bethlehem was a rather small town. Knabenbauer brings it down to fifteen or twenty (Evang. S. Matt., I, 104), Bisping to ten or twelve (Evang. S. Matt.), Kellner to about six (Christus and seine Apostel, Freiburg, 1908); cf. "Anzeiger kath. Geistlichk. Deutschl.", 15 Febr., 1909, p. 32. This cruel deed of Herod is not mentioned by the Jewish historian Flavius Josephus, although he relates quite a number of atrocities committed by the king during the last years of his reign. The number of these children was so small that this crime appeared insignificant amongst the other misdeeds of Herod. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07419a.htm Burn
• 

  Anti-Christ

  Ah. I understand. There is no contradiction in the statement above. They lived in Nazareth of Galilee, but they still visited Jerusalem for the yearly festival. I don't think the one precludes the other in this case.

  So when Matthew says "afraid to go to Judea" it really means that they simply don't live in Judea but they still go to Judea.

  The number of these children was so small that this crime appeared insignificant amongst the other misdeeds of Herod .

  Matthew 2: 16 Then Herod, when he saw that he was deceived by the wise men, was exceedingly angry; and he sent forth and put to death all the male children who were in Bethlehem and in all its districts, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had determined from the wise men. 17 Then was fulfilled what was spoken by Jeremiah the prophet, saying:
  18 “ A voice was heard in Ramah, Lamentation, weeping, and great mourning,
  Rachel weeping for her children,
  Refusing to be comforted,
  Because they are no more.” [ c ] Sounds like it was lot more then just fifteen or twenty
• 

  BurnTheShips

  Sounds like it was lot more then just fifteen or twenty

  That is how the prophecy was applied by Matthew, and being that it was in context with the coming of the Messiah, it need not have been so huge to have a fulfillment in Bethlehem. Rachel of Genesis died at Ramah, while on her way to Bethlehem. Both Ramah and Bethlehem are associated with the death of Rachel. Matthew uses Jeremiah's depiction of Rachel weeping at Ramah and then applies it to the massacre of the innocents at Bethlehem.

  EDIT. The original application of the prophecy you cite in Matthew is when Babylon sacked Jerusalem and deported the Jews, through Ramah. (Jeremiah 40:1)

  Burn
• 

  Anti-Christ

  Here's a link to a lot of NT contradictions

  New Testament Contradictions

  That is how the prophecy was applied by Matthew, and being that it was in context with the coming of the Messiah, it need not have been so huge to have a fulfillment in Bethlehem. Rachel of Genesis died at Ramah, while on her way to Bethlehem. Both Ramah and Bethlehem are associated with the death of Rachel. Matthew uses Jeremiah's depiction of Rachel weeping at Ramah and then applies it to the massacre of the innocents at Bethlehem.

  In Paul Carlson's New testament contradictions he mentions how Matthew does this on several occasions, one particular time were we can see that Matthew does not understand Hebreu very well.

  THE TRUTH BEHIND THE PROPHECIES - MATTHEW'S BIG BLUNDER

  Since the prophecies mentioned above do not, in their original context, refer to Jesus, why did Matthew include them in his gospel? There are two possibilities:

  1. The church says that the words had a hidden future context as well as the original context, ie, God was keeping very important secrets from His chosen people.

  2. Matthew, in his zeal to prove that Jesus was the Messiah, searched the Old Testament for passages (sometimes just phrases) that could be construed as messianic prophecies and then created or modified events in Jesus' life to fulfill those "prophecies."

  Fortunately for those who really want to know the truth, Matthew made a colossal blunder later in his gospel which leaves no doubt at all as to which of the above possibilities is true. His blunder involves what is known as Jesus' triumphant entry into Jerusalem riding on a donkey (if you believe Mark, Luke or John) or riding on two donkeys (if you believe Matthew). In Matthew 21:1-7, two animals are mentioned in three of the verses, so this cannot be explained away as a copying error. And Matthew has Jesus riding on both animals at the same time, for verse 7 literally says, "on them he sat."

  Why does Matthew have Jesus riding on two donkeys at the same time? Because he misread Zechariah 9:9 which reads in part, "mounted on a donkey, and on a colt, the foal of a donkey."

  Anyone familiar with Old Testament Hebrew would know that the word translated "and" in this passage does not indicate another animal but is used in the sense of "even" (which is used in many translations) for emphasis. The Old Testament often uses parallel phrases which refer to the same thing for emphasis, but Matthew was evidently not familiar with this usage. Although the result is rather humorous, it is also very revealing. It demonstrates conclusively that Matthew created events in Jesus' life to fulfill Old Testament prophecies, even if it meant creating an absurd event. Matthew's gospel is full of fulfilled prophecies. Working the way Matthew did, and believing as the church does in "future contexts," any phrase in the Bible could be turned into a fulfilled prophecy!