Zone visit meeting Australasia region 7th march...

by stuckinarut2 21 Replies latest watchtower beliefs


    What was the title of the "Special" talk?? Let me guess,....Hmmm.. "How Shutting The F**ck Up, NOW, brings lasting benefits!"

    Was that close??


  • DesirousOfChange

    It's all about the money.

    ALL contributions made at the Zone Visit -- whether as an Assm Hall or a local Kingdom Hall (that has the big screens) go directly to HQ. The local KH gets NOTHIN'.

    It's strictly an excuse to rake in a few bucks. (Million$ in the US. Don't know how many JDubs in Aussie Branch area).



  • Island Man
    Island Man

    There was one in the Caribbean recently that I attended. The branch visitor was from the Kenya branch. In his talk he went on a long rant against higher education. I have it all recorded.

  • stuckinarut2

    Ok yep, now let me share some stuff:

    The chairman Winston Payne started off boasting about how awesome this presentation tie in is blah blah...

    Then, he said "no recordings are permitted, but feel free to TELL others who may have missed out. But NO notes may be passed on to others either"

    WHY the secrecy? If this is SO SPECIAL then surely everyone should be told right?

    Then there was a painfully boring WT summary by Alan Wood of the Aust branch committee. (so that there was no need for a meeting on Sunday. That's ONE good thing)

    Then Viv (I love my own voice) Mouritz gave some talk about the LDC (local design committee) that replaces the RBC to build halls everywhere.... "Blah blah donate more money etc and time" He spoke of how "change is a good thing...but hard to accept"

    Then Ivan (I think I'm important) Novion gave some talk about something I can't even remember....

    Then a song....

    Then big fanfare for some British brother....(Stephen Hardy). This was it...THE SPECIAL TALK!!! "Let the blessings of Jehovah Overtake you"

    Yay.... But...pfffft....nothing except:

    Experiences about kids turning down higher education scholarships to go pioneering etc...

    Reminders that if you miss meetings or service, you will not be "spiritually" strong...(cult-mindset)

    Experiences of PERSECUTION AND OPPOSITION around the world...

    Experiences of cute kids saying things about the paradise etc..

    Corny attempts at forced humour and anecdotes...

    And.... That's it...seriously....that's it!

    Did I miss anything?

  • Oubliette

    stuck: Did I miss anything?

    Yes, your freedom!

    Thank you. You just inspired a new thread.

  • sparrowdown
    Least you got to be part of the all-important IT crowd that assists with the hook-up - wow, way to go bro😉
  • Listener

    "change is a good thing but hard to accept"

    I wonder why they are having so much trouble selling this new building arrangement? There must be a lot of unhappy brothers.

  • FadeToBlack
    I'm happy that Viv M. is back in Australia. I have no idea what he was doing here in Poland a couple of years ago. I actually told him 'jokingly' that the translated talk was better than his at one of the last CA's I attended.
  • Island Man
    Island Man

    Here's a transcript of the higher education rant portion of the recent branch visit talk given at one of the branches in the Caribbean. The theme of the talk was "Know where you are headed.":

    "Isaiah chapter 2 and verse number 3:

    "And many peoples will go and say: Come. Let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah, to the house of the god of Jacob, and he will instruct us about his ways, and we will walk in his paths. For law will go out of Zion, and the word of Jehovah out of Jerusalem."

    Instructed in God's ways - that's what divine education is all about. And divine education is being fulfilled with millions today being instructed by Jehovah. And the theocratic schools that Jehovah's organization operates today are designed to provide additional education for each one of us. so that we can not only be successful in our service to God, but divine education also makes it possible for us to exist and have a comfortable standard of living even in this wicked system of things. It's amazing that divine education accomplishes both. Secular education does not accomplish both! Secular education will teach you how to make money, how to live, how to whatever, like the rest of the world is doing but it's *not* going to teach you about God.

    Divine education will also teach you how to live and how to enjoy and how to manage whatever it is that you have. But more importantly, it teaches you about Jehovah. Divine education is superior to any education that this world has to offer.
    Really, I was just thinking about this point: Now brother and sister [REDACTED] and sister [REDACTED] and I, have the privilege to be in the 32nd class of the school for branch committee members and their wives, last year September - October. Now hear me as I ask you: Which organization in this world is going to send people our age to school? Who would? - Look at us!... And yet the organization paid our way to school. And we benefited from it. It's true we had some of the 35 and 40 year olds in our class but we tried to keep up [unintelligible] we tried our best. And they didn't have any mercy or pity on us. They didn't say because you're in a certain decade of life that you don't have to read all of these things:

    "No that's only for the 45 year olds, they have to read all of these Watchtowers, all of this part of the Insight, all of this part of All publications, but you don't have to read all that because you're of a certain decade ..."

    No, no, no. We had the same homework assignments, we had as many assignments as anybody else in the class. And the organization *sent* us to school. There's no where else that's going to happen!

    Divine education keeps on teaching us throughout our lives. It shows us how to live now. It is so practical, brothers! They sent me a uh ... the part of an uh ... experience from a professor - retired lecturer at the University of Cape Coast in Ghana in West Africa. And this someone says something like uh:

    "The teaching and training given to the Jehovah's Witnesses is richer than what university education provides."

    And I like what he says here that um:
    "People with divine education..."

    that's my term now: 'divine education' - but he says we:

    "are taught how to analyze critical issues even better than those trained through the formal education system."

    That's one of the arguments sometimes made for higher education - it teaches you how to think so even if you can't get a job according to the course that you have taken or [unintelligible] the degree that you have and you have to settle for less but at least in this university you learned how to think... The Lord's people have been learning to think since you came into the world - since the time that your parents had you on their knee they've been teaching you how to think. You come up in the theocratic ministry school you learn how to think, you learn how to read things, you learn how to analyse things, you learn how to put things together, you learn how to present things. The Lord's organization teaches us all that, this divine education.

    A few years back in the country of Liberia in West Africa, the brothers - the branch - arranged a meeting with the President of the country. And the idea was to present first hand to the president, provide first hand knowledge of some of our doctrines, our beliefs, issues of neutrality and things like that so that he would have a very clear picture about what we understand and what we believe. One of the persons making a presentation was a local brother who had a secondary school education. He made his presentation and after that presentation the president called him to the side and he said: "which university did you attend?" He said: "the theocratic ministry school." So impressive. The putting together of the material, the analysis, the arguments, the presentation - he did very well there. It's divine education. Jehovah's organization teaches us that. And with that thinking ability, with this capacity that we've gleaned from the theocratic ministry school and other schools we can handle any situation in the world. We can learn anything. We can have the desire to learn those things - especially if they advance kingdom interests. Divine education.

    Yeah but, its true we understand that parents want their children to be well educated. They want their children to enjoy a happy life now and in the future. Some parents feel that higher education is absolutely necessary if my boy, my daughter is to get a desirable job, earning sufficient funds to care for future needs. Some think that it is impossible to be acceptably employed without first obtaining higher education. Some feel that the faithful and discreet slave just does not know what the reality is on the ground here in my congregation, in my town. When the faithful slave talks about higher education and its issues and the idea of employment, they are just not with it. That works in Brooklyn in Patterson ... but it does not work here. The reality is here where I live. Actually, brothers, the reality is worldwide. And what is the reality? What is the real life? What is the reality of this situation with employment and education and so forth? Think about it.

    One newspaper commenting on a report done on education some years back had this to say that:

    "In many countries there is an acute need, not for university graduates, but for people to work in the trades and services area."

    It said that:

    "70% of the [unintelligible but sounds like "wers"] in the coming decades will not need a 4 year college degree, but rather an associate degree from a community college or some kind of technical certificate."

    Then I start to ask myself: Ok this is a worldly survey they don't have any clue what we're talking about as far as education is concerned, they're looking at it from their perspective they're in the business of education and analyzing what takes place and this is what they say this is where the jobs will be - 70% of the jobs, it says, will be in the trades and services. And I wonder: Can our children possibly find gainful, suitable, acceptable employment in that 70%? Or must they be in the upper 30% where they now have to become the CEOs or the administrators of huge organizations and companies - is that where they have to be in order to serve God? Really - that they won't be able to make it in the 70%? That's the reality. Think about it.

    Now we, we came to [REDACTED] a few years ago as I mentioned and the branch office is up on that hill there, that beautiful hill there and there was an open space on the right hand side. But now today we find that they're building some houses on that plot that was there, so the branch office is going to have neighbors right up close to them on the fence. Now the architect who designed those houses, or the engineer who laid out the structural interior for those houses, or the mechanical engineer who laid out where the pipes go and that kind of stuff, flushing the toilets and bringing cold water here and hot water there - is that the fellow who is on the site building that house? Is that the architect that you see actually lay the block and putting the cement there so that his blocks hold together? Is it the mechanical engineer who is putting in this pipe and tightening it up so that it doesn't leak? Who's doing the work? People in the trades! The architect can have the most beautiful concept of things and he has this PHD and he's all ethereal and he has all of these glorious, grandiose ideas and schemes and he puts them down on a piece of paper and he says now this will be built!

    "No, no, no, we don't have any masons. No, no, no, we don't have any carp... you have to go out there..."

    "What, me?!"

    He's not going to go out there and build this thing. That's the reality, brothers. You cannot run a huge organization. You cannot run a country. You cannot run anything if everybody has a PHD! Who's going to do the work? He's going to say:
    "No, no, no, that work is too beneath me"

    Is it not a rewarding work? Will it not pay the bills? Will it not even allow our children enough income so that they can contribute to the world wide work and the advancement of kingdom interests? Definitely so. That's the real world. That's real life. We need people. What did brother [REDACTED] say - that they're looking to source people with some skills, some construction skills. We come to our kingdom hall we sit down its all nice and comfy, but somebody had to know what he was doing, somebody had to put the blocks in the right place. Somebody had to make sure that the air conditioning was all connected together properly. Trades. Skills in the trades. Skills in the services - that's what the experts say will be need going forward. Can our children find something in there?

    What about this aspect of the math? Another worldly study - because we're not studying that, are we? You know, you don't get a Watchtower study about how people get jobs - it was a worldly study. It says:

    "nearly half are overqualified for their jobs."

    Now brothers that is a terrible thing - to be overqualified for a job. Can you imagine somebody being satisfied if he thinks he should be earning 100,000 dollars a year but there is no job for whatever degree he has? - and that's the other thing higher education doesn't really focus on what the needs are. It focuses on getting a degree. So here you are you think you should be making 100,000 dollars a year, you can't find a job that pays 100,000 dollars a year. Are you going to be satisfied with 50,000? Well if you don't make 50,000 you'll probably say ok i'll be satisfied with that. I knew a brother one time, many years ago the watchtower had an article about a brother who was quite well to do and he uh, in those days 25,000 US dollars was quite a good salary and he turned down this job of 25,000 so he could spend more time in the ministry. Now I was visiting a congregation when the watchtower was studied that week and another brother standing over here said:

    "Me? I'd turn that down too! Im not working for 25,000. you must be crazy!"

    Over-qualification breeds dissatisfaction. It hits the human being right in the middle of his pride and he doesn't like that.

    "I should be here. Am I going to stoop to take one down? Nah uh uh"

    Maybe if someone gets down to the last dollar in his pocket he might decide:

    "Ok I'll try this for a few days - at least put some bread on the table."

    But he's not happy about it. He doesn't throw himself into the work because he shouldn't be there. Over-qualification is a sad thing and yet, it is a reality brothers. Think about it, talk to people about it. You'll see. Its a reality. Over-qualification is there because there are no jobs for people in training. And that is a universal issue. It is not just a Patterson or Brooklyn issue.

    But sometimes people say well education is free so why not? Higher education is free so why not? If you saw the JW broadcast for January and you saw the interview with the brother, the lawyer - one of the strong points he makes about higher education is the battle for the mind. When you are filled with the ideas and the thoughts as to how great you are, and you are going to be the Jesus Christ of this world, the savior of all mankind. When that thinking takes root here in the mind, what kind of choices will you make? What kind of decisions will you make? Will you really know where you are headed and where you are going? Think about it brothers. Give consideration to the real world - not what is imagined, not what is propagated - for what actually takes place on the ground. Give consideration. And I am personally convinced that if you give consideration to the reality of life in this system of things, you parents and you young ones will see the wisdom of the direction and the guidance we receive from the faithful slave. Where are you headed?"

  • stuckinarut2

    Then there was an experience of a sister that was going through university (before learning the TRUTH)

    She was going out with a lovely WORLDLY GUY who was about to ask her to marry him, the she "learned the truth" and knew that she had to make drastic changes.

    yes, she "knew she had to break off her engagement to a worldly man and leave university in order to have Jehovahs blessing"

    How was she blessed???

    " She was asked to go to bethel for several years"!!!

    Wow! Amazing...what a blessing!!

    now though, she lives back at her parents home, looking after them as a spinster as they get older...


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