by altom 14 Replies latest jw friends

  • altom

    Does anyone have any info on this subject FROM W.T.PUBLICATIONS?? Will a disfellowshipped person who dies prior to The Great Tribulation be resurrected?

  • Fredhall

    If they are in God's memory then they will be resurrected. John 5:28, 29

  • blondie

    Romans 6:7 ***
    7 For he who has died has been acquitted from [his] sin.

    Unless it is the unforgivable sin, the sin against the holy spirit, and no one on earth can judge that.

    John 5:22 ***
    22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has committed all the judging to the Son,

    Since the separation of the sheep and the goats has been moved to after the Great Tribulation starts, all those who die before have the hope of a resurrection (except for the sin against the holy spirit which no human can determine).

  • Thirdson

    Good points Blondie,

    Romans 6:7 ***
    7 For he who has died has been acquitted from [his] sin.

    According to current WTS teachings (I think) God's promise of new life is now granted to deceased DF'd persons since the moving back of Jesus' judging of the nations and dead DF'd persons can expect to be retained in God's RAM (Fred's comment). Hopefully, God didn't delete dead DF persons prior to his release of new light a few years back.

    While for God it is easy to resurrect the dead it still is exceedingly difficult for JWs to bury the dead. Even though death aquits someone of sin a funeral for the dead DF'd cannot be held in a KH and the dead one's family may have difficulty getting local JW clergy to participate in the funeral at all.


    'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

  • Francois

    "If they are in God's memory...."?

    God forgets?

    How human.


  • blondie

    Thirdson, I know that God does not need to adjust anything he is doing based on “new light” from the WTS. It only illustrates the danger of taking on responsibilities that have not been given you. I always think of king Uzziah who decided he was qualified to be a priest and was struck with leprosy and lost the kingship. He tried to “adjust” Jehovah. I trust God but not always the WTS to have the right idea...I just wait and see. How many times have the people of Sodom and Gomorrah been in and out of Gehenna?

    Matthew 16:19 ***
    19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of the heavens, and whatever you may bind on earth will be the thing bound in the heavens, and whatever you may loose on earth will be the thing loosed in the heavens.”

    Matthew 18:18 ***
    18 “Truly I say to YOU men, Whatever things YOU may bind on earth will be things bound in heaven, and whatever things YOU may loose on earth will be things loosed in heaven.

    The WTS understanding of these scriptures:

    Insight Volume 2 page 149 Key ***
    Since other texts make clear that the resurrected Jesus remained the one true Head over the Christian congregation, it is obvious that his promise to Peter did not mean Peter’s dictating to heaven what should or should not be loosed."

    *** w91 3/15 5-6 Confession of Sins-Man's Way or God's? ***
    Did this mean that heaven would follow the decisions of humans? No. As Bible scholar Robert Young indicates, any decision made by the disciples would follow heaven’s decision, not precede it. He says that Mt 18 verse 18 should literally read: What you bind on earth “shall be that which has been bound (already)” in heaven.

    Really, it is unreasonable to think that any imperfect human could make decisions that would be binding upon those in the heavenly courts.”

  • gumby

    There was a QFR on that subject in the 70's or 80's. It said Jehovah would have to judge the heart, however it leaned twards a good chance they would'nt.
    They believe that all the ones who have died without hearing the good news will be resurrected to a life of judgement. That will be during the 1000 year reign.
    What about all the muslims and others who will never see a witness before armaggedon? Will he kill all those who are not witnesses before armaggedon,then turn around and ressurect all those who have never heard and give them a chance.
    NOW THAT JUST AIN'T FAIR!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Ranchette

    This is from the Insite #2 which is one of the main refrence books the Witnesses use.Alot of Witnesses believe that if you are still DF'd when the end comes you will be destroyed because of info provided below.
    My mother believes this way.
    She thinks my sister who is Df'd will die if not reinstated before the end comes.
    When I was a witness I tried to reason with her because she suffered so much over this.
    I told her that imperfect men can not know hearts and they make mistakes.I also told her that I did not care what the FDS said I knew Jehovah wouldn't be so shallow as to destroy people because of a title that men gave them!

    *** it-2 775-6 Repentance ***
    Beyond repentance. Those ‘practicing sin willfully’ after having received the accurate knowledge of the truth have gone beyond the point of repentance, for they have rejected the very purpose for which God’s Son died and so have joined the ranks of those who sentenced him to death, in effect, ‘impaling the Son of God afresh for themselves and exposing him to public shame.’ (Heb 6:4-8; 10:26-29) This, then, is unforgivable sin. (Mr 3:28, 29) It would have been better for such “not to have accurately known the path of righteousness than after knowing it accurately to turn away from the holy commandment delivered to them.”—2Pe 2:20-22.
    Since Adam and Eve were perfect creatures, and since God’s command to them was explicit and understood by both, it is evident that their sinning was willful and was not excusable on the basis of any human weakness or imperfection. Hence, God’s words to them afterward offer no invitation to repentance. (Ge 3:16-24) So, too, with the spirit creature who had induced them into rebellion. His end and the end of other angelic creatures who joined him is everlasting destruction. (Ge 3:14, 15; Mt 25:41) Judas, though imperfect, had lived in intimate association with God’s own Son and yet turned traitor; Jesus himself referred to him as “the son of destruction.” (Joh 17:12) The apostate “man of lawlessness” is also called “the son of destruction.” (2Th 2:3; see ANTICHRIST; APOSTASY; MAN OF LAWLESSNESS.) All those classed as figurative “goats” at the time of Jesus’ kingly judgment of mankind likewise “depart into everlasting cutting-off,” no invitation to repentance being extended to them.—Mt 25:33, 41-46.
    Resurrection Affords Opportunity. By contrast, the people of Sodom and Gomorrah as well as those of Canaanite Tyre and Sidon are spoken of by Jesus as finding “Judgment Day” more endurable than would the people of certain Jewish cities. (Mt 10:14, 15; 11:20-24) Those of pagan Nineveh are similarly spoken of. (Mt 12:41) This of itself implies that people from all such places, including the Jewish cities mentioned, will be resurrected and have opportunity to manifest humble repentance and “turn around” in conversion to God through Christ. Those failing to do so will receive everlasting destruction. (Compare Re 20:11-15; see JUDGMENT DAY.) Those, however, who follow a course like many scribes and Pharisees, who willfully and knowingly fought the manifestation of God’s spirit through Christ, will receive no resurrection, and so they cannot “flee from the judgment of Gehenna.”—Mt 23:13, 33; Mr 3:22-30.

    I hope this info is what your looking for.


  • Ranchette

    I know that this research doesn't say Df'd ones won't be ressurected,it says ones who practice sin won't be ressurected but we as witnesses were taught that a Df'd person is not repentent,spiritually dead etc...so it is assumed.

    This causes fear and confusion.


  • Amazing


    First, there is almost no Biblical basis for Christians to take DF action. The only time it was employed, to a degree, was in Corinth where a Christian man was having sex with his step-mother. This was so notorius and infamous that the Apostle Paul strongly edorsed extremely limited fellowship with this man. Then, in 2nd Cornithians,when the man was welcomed bacl with joy (reinstated), Paul noted that the reproof by the "majority" was sufficient. This clearly and strongly suggests that not all Christrians chose to shun the man or limit association. So, employment of Paul's exhortation in 1st Corinthians was up to the individual.

    Second, Your question suggest something that might be related to 'sinning against the Holy Spirit. Many will quote Hebrews to suggest that one who goes that far will not be forgiven, hence not resurrected. However, Paul was spekaing a hyposthesis to the hebrews if you read the entire context, and use some Bible commentaries to help out ... it can be likened this way:

    "If you jump off of the planet earth, you will die in space, without hope of breathing or getting back to earth."

    That is a truism, but we all know that Gravity keeps us from going that far. Yes, we can stretch the illustration to show that we could get in a rocket, fly into space, and then jump out of the rocket, and remove out space suit and then die. So, yes, with extreme measures, it is possible to jump off of the planet.

    Now, what Paul was saying is, that if one were to sin to that extreme, then it would be possible to lose all hope. But, we are not of that sort. And his comments at Romans 8, from about vs 31 to 39, he shows that once we are in God's hands, no one and no power can remove us, and that includes we ourselves - we cannot take ourselves out of God's protective hands as being one of his children. Therefore, for a Christian to defy Holy Spirit is about like a person trying to defy gravity and jump off of the planet into space with the use of their legs alone. It is not possible.

    But, every now and again, we see certain controlling religions try to scare its members with the inappropriate use of Hebrews. They also then set up rules and laws to live by, and make people afraid to violate those rules. But, Paul also said that love throws fear outside. So, once we are in God's love, we should no longer have any such fears, a fear inspired by false religion, and not God our father. - Amazing

Share this