Have you changed your mind about ABORTION?

by nicolaou 171 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • fifi40
    fifi40

    I have questions for those who strongly argue the case against abortion even to the point of calling it pre meditated murder.....

    What percentage of your life choices are you prepared to hand over to others to make the decision for you?

    What rules would you impose on mothers who choose to carry a child to term, in relation to the activities they choose, the food they put into their bodies etc..........because if these could be proven to be harmful to the baby they are carrying would it require prosecution of the pregnant mother?

    If your own daughter was given the choice of her own life over the child she was carrying......which would you choose for her?

    Do you support the use of contraception...........as some forms of contraception cause a fertilised egg to be wasted/aborted and others prevent the opportunity for life?

    IMO for abortion to be classed as pre meditated murder it would require a woman deciding to become pregnant so she could abort the baby.

    Women get pregnant.....fact. They can be raped and get pregnant. They can use contraception and get pregnant. Are you suggesting that the only time that a women has sex is on an occassion when she is happy to become pregnant and carry a child to term........because it would seem that this would be the only possible sure fire way of preventing unwanted pregnancies?

  • Sad emo
    Sad emo
    omg will everyone plz stop saying "pro-life"?!?! it's "anti-choice" people. we're not "pro-death" as the term "pro-life" would imply. sheesh....

    I'm not quite sure exactly what you were saying there karvel. Anyway fwiw here's my own definition of 'pro-life' - the ultimate choice is still down to the woman who is pregnant, yes, I'd rather that the baby was born (hence, I'm pro-life), and would encourage them to explore all the options available which might improve the chances of that happening - but I accept that there are situations where that either isn't an option or the best option - and that's ok too. Not anti-choice at all...

  • Merry Magdalene
    Merry Magdalene

    Can't quite say that I have changed my mind since my mind was never fully and firmly made up as to the details of the matter, how I felt about the possibility arising in my own life and what I thought the law should be. It was one of those uncomfortable subjects I didn't even want to think about for too long.

    But it seemed obvious to me that abortion ends life and is therefore killing which, in some circumstances can be murder and in other circumstances can be justified as necessary. But how to delineate that?

    Personally, there was a woman in my family who died long long ago of a coat-hanger abortion, and everyone spoke very sympathetically of her even though they were against abortion. Her circumstances were very bad. But I wonder now if they would have been as sympathetic to her if only the baby had died and she had lived. Knowing them, I rather think they would have been, but would they have gone so far as to want to allow legal abortion to be limitedly available? I don't know.

    Also personally, I was always very careful to prevent pregnancy for myself to the best of my ability...with the eventual exception of the one time that I got pregnant. It was not a good time in my life for a pregnancy, not at all. I panicked. I considered abortion. Cold sweat. Hot sweat. Nowhere to turn. 35 years old. Unmarried, recently jobless (in a very small town with very limited opportunities) and on the verge of being homeless, completely in debt to survive and with no money to file for bankruptcy. I could go on but I won't.

    At least I can empathise better now with those who find themselves in difficult circumstances. But still, when I hear someone speak of "my body" "my right" I cringe. Because it isn't just "my body". There's another body inside it, completely helpless and dependant. Both bodies and both rights must be considered. That is why I tend to understand and agree with the analogy of how people once felt about the treatment of slaves and wives and children outside the womb--theirs to do with as they pleased and no one had the right to interfere.

    So I have to say I am truly pleased and relieved to find general Islamic teachings on this to be balanced and helpful.

    ...theologians have concluded that the killing of a fetus is not permissible as soon as one can speak of it as of a "child", a person whose parts are fully formed and into whom a soul has been breathed. There is no agreement among legal scholars – including those of the founders of the four schools of religious law of the early Islamic period – as to the exact point in time this happens, however.

    The Hanafi school (predominant in Turkey, the Middle East and Central Asia) allows abortions to take place principally until day 120; some jurists restrict this provision to "good cause", e.g. if the mother is still nursing an infant and fears that her milk may run out during the new pregnancy. In aborting up to day 120, the woman commits a mere moral transgression, not a crime. The Shafi school (Southeast Asia, southern Arabia, parts of East Africa) allows abortions to be performed up to day 120. For the Maliki school (prevalent in North and Black Africa) an abortion is permissible with the consent of both parents up to day 40; it is no longer allowed after that. For the Hanbali school (predominant in Saudi Arabia and United Arabic Emirates) abortions are principally prohibited from day 40 onward.

    Exceptions are made in some countries if the life of the mother is endangered, based on Surah 2.233: "A mother should not be made to suffer because of her child." As a result, abortion is possible for health reasons up to day 90 according to a number of scholars.


    The eminent Muslim scholar, Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi states in his well-known book, "The Lawful and the Prohibited in Islam":

    "While Islam permits preventing pregnancy for valid reasons, it does not allow doing violence to it once it occurs.

    Muslim jurists have agreed unanimously that after the fetus is completely formed and has been given a soul, abortion is Haram. It is also a crime, the commission of which is prohibited to the Muslim because it constitutes an offense against a complete, living human being....However, there is one exceptional situation. If, say the jurists, after the baby is completely formed, it is reliably shown that the continuation of the pregnancy would necessarily result in the death of the mother, then, in accordance with the general principle of the Shari'ah, that of choosing the lesser of two evils, abortion must be performed.

    The reason for this is that the mother is the origin of the fetus; moreover, her life is well-established, with duties and responsibilities, and she is also a pillar of the family. It would not be possible to sacrifice her life for the life of a fetus which has not yet acquired a personality and which has no responsibilities or obligations to fulfill.

    ~Merry

  • Save My Soul
    Save My Soul

    I have always felt it was a woman's choice. Then and now. Even as a witness, I was a free thinker. I feel it is murder, but again, I can not tell a woman who was raped to place her life on the line to have a baby she did not ask for.

    Contradictory? Maybe, but it is not my choice, it is hers.

  • 5go
    5go
    Anyway fwiw here's my own definition of 'pro-life' - the ultimate choice is still down to the woman who is pregnant, yes, I'd rather that the baby was born (hence, I'm pro-life), and would encourage them to explore all the options available which might improve the chances of that happening - but I accept that there are situations where that either isn't an option or the best option - and that's ok too.

    I think that is what some was trying to say when he said pro-lifers ( BTW Pro-lifers I see you in Huntsville protesting all the time for the executions ) are anti-choosers. No one is pro-death! We all want it to work out; but there are hard choices in life, that they say they don't want made. They rather people be totally miserable with choices the Pro-Lifers made for them. BTW (I am BTW happy today) wouldn't orphanages result in bigger government with the dreaded government raising the kids at taxpayer expense to become atheist. Some conservatives you guys are!

  • 5go
    5go

    Damn IE !

  • Hiddenwindow
    Hiddenwindow

    I used to describe it as criminal before; now I am pro-choice.

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips

    My baby was pro-life but now that he is born he is pro-choice

  • sammielee24
    sammielee24

    A question to ponder.

    If Hitler's mother had wanted an abortion and saved 6,000,000 lives would it have been worth it? (PS - I already know the flip side of the 'if Beethoven had been aborted we'd be robbed of his genius)...this is just another way to ponder things. If all lives are sacred and we could go back and terminate all the child rapists and murderers - would we? Just a question. sammieswife.

  • nicolaou
    nicolaou

    I'm still looking for references on the Watchtower's teaching of no resurrections for aborted fetuses and embryos. I cannot find anything on the CD Library but I suspect I'm just not searching for the right phrase. Any help would be much appreciated.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit