Question for Christians Re: Cures (page 2)

mouthy

And I wanted to say I believe man will be able to find cures for ills... When I was young , Polio had a real hold in the world MANY got it, I can name other things that are heading in knowing how to treat. In Mells time when she had cancer , not many were getting better but I watched TERRY FOX thing last night & many testified of a healing....

serotonin_wraith

If sad emo is right and God created the world to have all these diseases, and mouthy is right in saying we were only given the knowledge to cure them after eating from the tree, does this mean that God wanted diseases in the world and for us to suffer with them (forever if they ate from the tree of life) without ever finding cures?

If someone sees their child die from cancer and asks how God could let that happen, is the answer that God set things up that way before man's fall even, so don't complain?

Diseases aren't because of Satan but are in fact God's choice all along?

Deputy Dog

Cures are a form of God's Grace and Christians look for ways to share God's with everyone. I can't think of a better reason to look.

mouthy

If someone sees their child die from cancer and asks how God could let that happen, is the answer that God set things up that way before man's fall even, so don't complain?
I watched my daughter die with cancer & no I dont believe God set it up that way... I believe HE gave us freedom to do as we want. Melanie was a great sun lover, ( a no-no) also I was a great smoker when she was born until she was 5( I was not a believer)second hand smoke? So I believe she could have got Cancer from either of those things. Yes God could have healed her,,, ( I had a real fight with God when he didnt) but I also believe he sees down the road ---if Melanie was a live to day-she would be hurting so much as her kids went haywire....And she thought they were perfect....
my 2 cents worth

Sad emo

It took me ages to find this thread again this morning - I must have passed it about 3 times lol! I'm here now though!

So God created Adam and Eve to have a limited lifespan as well as sickness and disease? It sounds like how things work today. Who am I to question the Lord, but a few things strike me as odd about this. Why make diseases when you know man won't be able to cure them for hundreds or thousands of years, or perhaps never?

I was tempted to reply to that first question "And...?" but I think I understand where you're coming from. My own thoughts on this is that yes God created the bugs, they might have been harmless at one time, or just not introduced to mankind, and it was our own lifestyles which created the right environment for the bugs to mutate and become harmful to other species.

A modern-day analogy of this could be the rat. Rats are actually very clean animals - they are staple meat for humans on remote islands, yet the rats we have here in the UK are 'dirty' and carry disease - largely as a result of man's own pollution of the environment.

What I'm trying to say is disease and sickness isn't always God's punishment - it's to a significant extent self-inflicted.

There's a tree of life in the garden too, which God doesn't forbid them eating from. He stops them getting to it AFTER the fall. I'm not sure if you believe the Earth will be transformed in the future, but if you do, when God says sickness and death shall be no more, why make the improvement then, instead of back in the Garden?

Connected with my above answer, and I know that this really grates with some folk here, but for those who read and have an instant gut reaction to this, you may understand more if you walk away after reading, calm down and re-read slowly:

Life would be so cool if we didn't have consequences wouldn't it??!!!

Consequences make God look like such an evil bad meanie because it must be Him who's behind them!!

This is at the very heart of what's gone wrong with this planet - we want it all but we want someone else to blame if it all goes wrong. We want our rights but without responsibilities! It seems very apparent that some only say God might exist when we've run out of other people to blame for the mess this world is in. "Well if there was a God, He wouldn't let this happen..." We're like selfish brats who never learnt how to say thank you for the good things people give us but are quick to complain when we don't get it our own way.

Adam blamed Eve and Eve blamed the serpent... and history goes on repeating itself...

When will the human race ever grow up? (And that includes people of any faith or none!)

serotonin_wraith

Cures are a form of God's Grace and Christians look for ways to share God's with everyone. I can't think of a better reason to look.

It does seem less than loving to do that though, in my eyes. Why let someone suffer with an illness at all, if you could have made them without it in the first place? "I'll make it so that humans suffer for hundreds of years with a disease, and then I'll be kind and help one generation over the last." I can't see it as loving. Many people will refuse to have children of their own if they are afraid of passing on a genetic illness, so humans wouldn't purposefully do it out of love. Why is human love and God's love so very different? God's love looks to me like my version of spite sometimes.

Mouthy, I'll agree that we may bring these things upon ourselves by not being careful. But there are so many other diseases and ailments that we get that aren't our fault. Sometimes we are just born with them. In the grand scheme of things, the ones we bring on ourselves are a small minority. With God seeing ahead and perhaps wanting to protect your daughter from pain, that may be understandable. But at the same time he's allowing people to deteriorate with Parkinson's Disease over a period of many years?

I suppose this is why I put it down to random genetic defects or things we bring on ourselves, rather than a higher power intervening.

Sad Emo, with consequences for our actions, I can see what you mean with some of the things we get. But I don't think it covers most of them. We have an appendix which could burst and kill us- how is that possibly our fault? We are born with it, and we don't even need it. That's why it's removed if it's a threat to us. It's going in a different direction so I won't go too much into it, but that doesn't seem to be a good design to me.

Sad emo

The appendix wasn't originally a poor design though - it did its job, but as its original use has decreased so has its size. Is it possible that the incidence of appendicitis may have increased as a consequence of the change in our diet? Not only are we no longer herbivorous, but we have notoriously poor diet (high fat, low fibre etc). Not just this, but according to the link below, the appendix may apparently reduce the risk of ulcerative colitis - it may be to some extent the 'fall guy' of the digestive system, the lesser of two evils perhaps? And if it is part of the lymphatic system, what are the major causes of suppressed immunity other than other illnesses - poor diet and lifestyle? Consequences? It all seems more connected than at a first glance.

Very interesting, balanced article here about it: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/vestiges/appendix.html

serotonin_wraith

Do you believe in evolution then? I believe the appendix was useful in the past, but evolution has changed our bodies in such a way as to make it dangerous now. You agree it's changed too- so if you believe in evolution (which is small changes as you described), where do Adam and Eve come into it?

jgnat

Q. But I thought about that. Christians believe the diseases, the backache, the toothache, and all these other ailments we suffer with through life came about after the fall of man. It was God's punishment (or at least he set up a system in which ailments would come about if man ever fell)

A. Question right back atcha. Then why did Jesus heal so many people when he was hear, shedding tears on their behalf and showing compassion to them? Matthew 11:5

Q. so I'm wondering on what basis Christians could say they can look for cures.

A. The same reason they can interact with bankers, grocers, and contractors. Because we live in a world where we need help for some things.

Q. Wouldn't that be trying to get out of the punishment we (apparently) deserve as a fallen species?

A. Do we deserve it, or does it just happen? John 9:1-5 If the species as a whole suffers from a past catastrophic event, are they being punished for their own deficiencies or simply the victims of their birth?

Q. Doesn't God deserve to do what he wants to us because afterall, he made us? What right to Christians have (according to their beliefs) to even use asprin?

A. Perhaps because God doesn't want us to suffer? I think it is pure foolishness to deny assistance as it is available. I think Jesus cured the incurable because there was no resort for those people. But these days, there's all kinds of medical support available.
I remember a poor bent woman who used to attend our church. There was a deformity of her hips that kept her leaning over at more than a 45 degree angle. I felt sorry for her until I heard her story. There was a surgery available, but she preferred to wait until Jesus healed her. Well goodness gracious woman! Get yourself down to the surgeon! He's God's answer, silly woman.

Deputy Dog

s_w

It does seem less than loving to do that though, in my eyes. Why let someone suffer with an illness at all, if you could have made them without it in the first place? "I'll make it so that humans suffer for hundreds of years with a disease, and then I'll be kind and help one generation over the last." I can't see it as loving. Many people will refuse to have children of their own if they are afraid of passing on a genetic illness, so humans wouldn't purposefully do it out of love. Why is human love and God's love so very different? God's love looks to me like my version of spite sometimes.

The fact that I can take my next breath is God's grace. I don't deserve anything from God. My life is possible only by God's grace no matter how short or long.

What makes you think you deserve life at all?

Question for Christians Re: Cures

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