by metatron 25 Replies latest jw friends
I wonder too, if more of us aren't being very vocal about having ethical and moral issues with the Borg's thinking. It used to be that when people left, the assumption was they wanted to lead an "immoral" lifestyle. For hardliners I'm sure that's still the belief, but more and more I think those on the edges recognize it CAN truly be a ethical dillema. Or maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part... *sigh*
brunn
Great thread metatron! I agree, it seems that having a "c of c" is all the rage now.
Growing up a witness and being an elders daughter and then an elders wife I recall many who left or were DF'd, but can't think of anyone who walked away feeling it was not the "truth". It seems we know better now.
changeling
as a 46 year old born in and still in, I only know one who left and was labeled an apostate. in other words he was not branded with moral failure. apostates only told lies about us I thought. I have infected three states, and 6 halls with the truth about our altered bible and other truths, not lies.
sad day...coaster
Active disbelief? that was my M.I.L. about 30 years ago. She joined a group out in the San Francisco area called. "Christian Prophets of Jehovah". Megaphones
at the conventions, disrupting bookstudy conductors. Quite a stir back then.
From my observation at the local hall, I have not observed any open display of disbelief. What I have observed over the years is the loss of all the young people. Every teenager from the 90's had faded, or got disfellowshiped minus one, an elders son.
The mike rovers consist of 60- 70 year old elders. More subtle yet blatantly observable is that there are 8 former pioneers,elders and ministerial servants that attend but no longer comment or go out in service. It is a strange sight to see 40 and 50 something year old former elders and ministerial servants sit and watch the old guys not only roving but answering most of the questions. There have been no teenagers at the hall for about ten years. 4 couples w/children now.
It has gotten so bad that they recently recruited two pioneer couples in their early 30's to 'assist' the congregation. They have also been recruiting speakers from over 100 miles away and other states to fill in the talk schedule the past 6 months.
I think a big factor is the increasing prevalence of DF who don't ever come back because of finding out about the other side while out. My brother and two other friends of ours are in this category.
Until I left, my brother still thought they had the truth and would have encouraged anyone looking into the Bible to study with Jehovah's Witnesses. He was very proud of his daughter's first student talk. Now, he can explain to anyone why he will never be a JW again, and why he would encourage them to look elsewhere for Scriptural understanding.
He got a call from his daughter a couple of weeks ago telling him that she is getting baptized at the next Assembly and won't be talking to him anymore. Her mother and my wife are firmly opposed to her decision, but my extended family are all glowing and atitter (<--- love that word, for some reason ) with praise for her because she has "taken a firm stand for Jehovah." [Urp!] Sorry, I just spit up a little in my mouth.
Anyway, I think there is more than just one piece to this thing. People who used to never be in contact with "apostates" and were unlikely to ever meet one are now only one or two mouse-clicks away from more information than they could absorb in a year.
I expect the tilt toward higher percentages of DA to get increasingly sharper over time.
Respectfully,
AuldSoul
I'm currently keeping up with five different former JW's (so if you throw me into the group, we're talking six total).
Of the six of us, four left for non-intellectual reasons.
The other two (this includes me) left on a different basis, but our leaving was gated by at least one of the other four.
So the real base impetuses for all six departures (even if by extension) were emotional (more classic).
If you were to ask anyone of us why we left, we would all say that we left because of intellectual differences (the new).
I think it's rare for a person to leave purely from reasoning that The Truth isn't the truth. On the other hand, I think this intellectual understanding, however and whenever it comes, makes the separation stick.
Another interesting thing to note - of the six of us, four have made a b-line for behaviors and practices that we were taught not to take part in. The other three men in our group all have beards, for example. One guy smokes a pipe, one cigars, and one of the ladies is trying cigarettes. None of this bothers me (outside of the fact I think these otherwise intelligent people wouldn't be making such poor choices health-wise had it not been for the fact they were raised JW's and are experiencing something similar to teenage rebellion aka exertion of newly-found independence), but they do seem to have a sort of mental list - "now that I can, I'm going to..." It does move me to call into question their initial motives for leaving.
It would seem that JW's want you to believe that people who leave are immoral unethical sinners who've let themselves be stumbled. Ex-JW's seem to want to be thought of as thinking people who have discerned the truth of The Truth. Like everything else, I'm sure the answer lies somewhere in between.
It may be that this "active disbelief" is gaining ground, but perhaps it's only that the perception was once more heavily weighted on the moral departure and now that perception has shifted to the intellectual. Either way, things are looking up for those looking to tear down the WTBS. Remember, it's the perception that will drive things so, where things are equal, downplay the moral/ethical/emotional and up-play this "active disbelief" idea.
