I have debated this, also with my mother, since I was a small child. I now debate it with my catholic husband. He has no ready answers, as the JW's do. He believes that there is heaven and if I will at least believe in that we will be together forever. I love him dearly and wish I could be with him forever, but the questions raised here are the exact reason I now consider my self agnostic. I do not necessarily believe in a God, however, my point is what everyone else has pointed out.
If God were all knowing and powerful, he knew Eve was going to mess up, Satan was going bad...etc. We are lab rats in a great experiment.
If you carefully read that account in Genesis, you will discover a very startling thing: Satan told the truth, and God lied.
God said they would die on the day the ate. Satan said they wouldn't die, but that they would become like God. (Gen. 2:17; 3:4-5) They ate and what happened? They didn't die that day (I know, I know - the WTS and it's explanation of "day" here!!!). But what's even more interesting is God's statement in Gen. 3:22: "Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad." Exactly what Satan had told Eve would happen, and Jehovah is verifying it!!
Ah, the problems that arise when we try to understand myths as real events. Give it a rest. The myth makes incredibly good sense - much more so than the WTS's trying to make this into an actual event.
>>I don't think that 48 years of my existance, nor thousands of years of humans existance would put any one in a position to know what really is right conduct on God's part.<<
No offense D, but I've always thought this argument was a cop out. God's actions, his book, his reasoning should stand up to human scrutiny. A mystery that is beyond our comprehension is one thing, but a book that contains stories that when analyzed make no logical sense, is something else all toghether. I think the human race deserves better than that from its creator.
Seeker4, 'J'dubs are skewed in their view because they do not understand the immortal soul and election. I did not understand until a year and a half ago.
>'Death' is literally, 'separation from God' and this indeed happened: spiritual death occured, for from the moment that they rebelled they started to die physically. Allowing mankind to procreate in the imperfect state is actually the first grace offered by God. Any idea that anyone here would have passed the 'test' is laughable due to the 'hindsight is 20/20' principle. He gave us what we wanted, FREEDOM to run our own affairs within his soverignty. BTW, you have not proven that Genesis is a 'myth'. In fact, the resurrection of Christ, Him voluntarily laying down His life and picking it up again within three days is confirmation that regardless of what any man THINKS, Genesis is literally true. God also did know completely...does know completely the whole of history of time on earth. He is by very nature, outside of time and therefore He says, "I Am" is His name (as also Jesus proclaimed Himself). He is entirely just and loving, for He provides a means for us to escape the spiritual death we have inherited by simply believing in His son, salvation is by grace through faith (Eph. 2.8,9). He has the complete right to demand our souls since we are all sinners, none are 'good' (Romans 3.23; 6.23). Romans 10.9-11 and John 3.16,17 proclaim the gospel. John 14.6 points us again toward the way to life. Paul explains the theology of the church throughout Romans and John confirms the deity of Christ in his gospel. Whining about this cold cruel world is entirely a moot point. None of us would even be drawn to God without the Father calling us, the Son redeeming us and the Holy Spirit sealing us. Rex
No offense D, but I've always thought this argument was a cop out.
I don't take any offense speak as frankly as you like I don't think I will feel bad. I disagree with you though, and don't feel it is a cop out, I think hard and often about these subjects and will continue to think and think about these things. I may one day have the answers and then again I may never have them. I just feel many are jumping to hastily to conclusions that may take alot more time to decide.
If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?