For Current JW's- Watchtower Society Examined!

by Vinny 22 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • startingover

    I too think you really nailed it in the first few paragraphs. I haven't read all the rest yet, will use this post to find it later.

    Not to hijack this thread, but you made this statement:

    The bible writers CLAIMED that what they wrote was inspired of God. (2Tim 3:16,17 and 2Peter 1:20,21 and Acts 3:21). And the things that has been written by those bible writers has proven truly inspired. It has withstood the test of time. It nails things down correctly. The weather systems are correctly explained. The earth hangs upon nothing and is a sphere, it tells us. A little wine is good for the stomach, which is true. Prophecies fulfilled, one after another after another. Now, there are very solid reasons then to believe that the bible has God's approval and backing and is inspired. This is why I am still a Christian today. What all those bible writers said about Jesus COULD be made up, I'd suppose that's possible. But these Gospel stories have a very honest believability to them. They admit mistakes, arguments and conflicts. Peter denying Jesus. Paul and Barnabas burst of anger. The Apostles arguing who's the greatest again and again,David's sin with Bath-sheba and then Uriah.The many BAD Israelite Kings along with many other similar accounts. The fact that our very own calendar is based on the very year Jesus was born adds to my own reasons to believe he really existed. Secular historian Josephus testifies to Jesus existence as well. Again, the bible gives thinking people sound reason to believe it is indeed from a powerful, heavenly source. It does appear to many, to be God's thoughts rather than mens.

    You may want to research this stuff as much as you have the WT stuff. For instance, the bible speaks of a circle, not a sphere. A circle is a pizza, not a ball. And Josephus, better look into that too, and the calendar too. Again, not to hijack, but I thought it needed to be said.

  • icocer

    I wish I could challange you. I was never a JW and thanks to posts such as these never be. Basicly bookmarking for future reference.

  • hawkaw

    Interesting points. If God was behind an organization, why would it voluntarily approach and then partner (with annual renewals) with the scarlet coloured beast (UN) for ten years.

  • Terry

    I've narrowed my argument a bit.

    I have two arrows in my quiver where Jehovah's Witnesses are concerned.

    1.The test of a prophet. (Does what they predict come true? If no--don't listen to them.)

    2.The integrity of scripture. (Easily demonstrated there are NO original manuscripts, no copies of original manuscripts; consequently no comparison to a "True" text can ever be made.)

    Either way, JW's fail.

    Arguing the "meaning" of scriptures is the long way around.

    If they, as an organization and religion, cannot pass the test of the true prophet there is no need to proceed.

    (By the way; only the JW need believe the bible is the inerrent word of God for them to fail the test of the true prophet.)

  • Kaput
    Interesting points. If God was behind an organization, why would it voluntarily approach and then partner (with annual renewals) with the scarlet coloured beast (UN) for ten years.

    It would if it was "the god of this system of things" who was behind it.

  • sf

    Comprehensive List of False Dates Set by the Watchtower

    1776" is the year the year to which the claim refers. Where no specific date is claimed, the earliest date of publication by WTBTS of the quoted text is shown. The list is sorted by this date.
    The section following that, within " ", is the quotation. Anything within brackets ( ) therein was also bracketed in the original. Anything in " " within the quoted text has been altered to ' ' for clarity. Text has only been omitted for brevity, without changing the meaning of the quotation - omitted text is replaced by ..
    The source publication is identified in { } - here BATT refers "C.T.Russell: Studies in the Scriptures IV - Battle of Armageddon (till 1910, called The Day of Vengeance), 1897, 1904-20, 1923-5, 1927". The key-list of publications appears at the end of Part 3/3. As no date is shown against the abbreviated name, the quotation is present in the earliest version (and is likely to be present in all versions, as there is no reference to the contrary). 584 refers to the page number on which the quotation is to be found in the version referred to.
    Text within [ ] represents (my) commentary. It may well contain other quotations in " ".

    1776 "And this long persecution, in which 'many were purified and made white and tried,' and in which the Mother of Harlots was 'drunk with the blood of the saints and the martyrs of Jesus' (Rev. 17:6) ended as we have already shown, practically in 1776.." {BATT 584} [Also see 1799]

    1780 "signs in sun, moon and stars [of] Matthew 24:29" {WR Jan 1885 711}

    1780 "Are these signs to be regarded as literal or as symbolic? and have they yet been fulfilled? We answer that they have had a literal fulfillment, and are now having a symbolic fulfillment much more momentous. On May 19, 1780 (still 'in those days,' the 1260 years of Papal power, but after that power had begun to wane and the brunt of the tribulation had passed) a phenomenal darkening of the sun occurred, for which scientists of that time and since have never been able to account.. This unaccountable day, except as a sign from the Lord, is reckoned to have extended over 320,000 square miles - an area about twenty-five times the size of Palestine, to which the signs of the first advent were limited. Indeed, the fact that these signs were chiefly confined to the New England and Middle States need not surprise us, when we remember that the first movement amongst the 'Virgins'* (Matt. 25:1-5) was chiefly in the same locality. And that God should use the 'land of liberty' for sending the message of these signs to the world, is no more wonderful than that he has been pleased to send from the same quarter many of the modern blessings and inventions and lessons, recognized by the whole world, and aptly emblemized by the gift of the great French artist, Bartholdi, to New York harbor - the statue of 'Liberty Enlightening the World.'" {BATT 585-8}

    1798 "Start of 'the last days'" [i.e. after the end of 1260 days of Rev 12.] {HOTW 1147}

    1798-99 "Having thus furnished grounds for establishing the identity of this character (Napoleon), whose deeds mark the beginning of the 'Time of the End,' the prophecy proceeds to show which particular event of that time is to be understood as definitely marking the exact date of the beginning of the 'Time of the End.' This event is shown to be Napoleon's invasion of Egypt, which covered a period of a year and nearly five months. He sailed May, 1798 and, returning, landed in France Oct. 9, 1799. This campaign is graphically described in a few words in verses 40-44. Verse 40: 'And at the (fixed) Time of the End shall the king of the South (Egypt) fight against him, and the king of the North (England) shall come against him like a tempest, with chariots and with horsemen (the Egyptian Mamelukes, etc.) and with a great navy. (The English forces consisted of a navy under Admiral Nelson.) And he (Napoleon) shall enter into the countries, and shall destroy and pass through (victoriously).'" {TKIC 44-5}

    1799 "After the three and a half years, 1260 days, when Elijah returned from the wilderness, the errors of Jezebel's priests were manifested, the true God was honored, and copious rains followed. 1 Kings 18:41-45. At the end of 1260 years the power of the truth and its witnesses was manifested (A.D. 1799)" {TIAH 256}

    1799 ".. this great apostasy or falling away mentioned by Paul has come, and that this Man of Sin has been developed, has sat 'in the temple of God' (the real, not the typical), has fulfilled all the predictions of the apostles and prophets concerning his character, work, etc., has been revealed, and now, since A.D. 1799, is being consumed by the spirit of the Lord's mouth (the truth), and will be utterly destroyed during this day of the Lord's wrath and revelation with flaming fire of retribution, already beginning." {TIAH 272-3}

    1799 "Henceforth we deal with the Antichrist, whose gradual development and organization from secretly working ambition are a fitting prelude to the terrible character displayed after the coveted power had been grasped - from 539 A.D. to 1799 A.D., 1260 years." {TIAH 296}

    1799 "1799 .. start of 'the last days'" {WR Jan/Feb 1889 1093}

    1799 "THE 'Time of the End,' a period of one hundred and fifteen (115) years, from A.D. 1799 to A.D. 1914, is particularly marked in the Scriptures.. Though our information pointing out the date of this period is furnished in Daniel's prophecy, we know that he understood nothing at all concerning it, as he said: 'I heard, but I understood not.' (Dan. 12:8). In answer to his anxious inquiries he was told that the words were closed up and sealed until the Time of the End. It follows, therefore, that no one could understand the prophecy before 1799 .. But 1799 was only the beginning of the period known as 'the Time of the End,' within the limits of which every vestige of that system shall pass away.. We have thus shown that 1799 began the period called the Time of the End; that in this time Papacy is to be consumed piece-meal" {TKIC 23-4/48/59} [Did every vestige even of the Papacy pass away in 1914?]

    1799 "The length of time this persecution was to continue is not stated here, except that it will be concluded as appointed, at the Time of the End. From other scriptures we learn that it was a period of 1260 years, which ended with A.D. 1799, a date prominently noted by Daniel and the Revelator as well as in history." {TKIC 38}

    1799 ".. the Lord's little flock of consecrated followers, now living, enjoy greater enlightenment than was ever the privilege of any of their forerunners; for in this period all the rays of prophetic testimony reach a grand focus, illuminating to the eye of faith the plan of God, including its developments, past, present and future. Since the beginning (1799) of the Time of the End, God has been preparing his consecrated 'holy people,' his 'Sanctuary,' for the great blessings he intended to pour upon them during these forty years of harvest: which blessings are also intended as special preparation for their entering with Christ into full joy and joint-heirship with him, as his bride. At the exact 'time appointed,' 1799, the end of the 1260 days, the power of the Man of Sin, the great oppressor of the Church, was broken, and his dominion taken away. With one stroke of his mighty hand, God there struck off Zion's fetters, and bade the oppressed go free. And forth came, and are coming, the 'Sanctuary' class, the 'holy people,' weak, and halt, and lame, and almost naked, and blind, from the dungeon darkness and filth and misery of papal bondage. Poor souls! they had been trying to serve God faithfully in the very midst of the lurid flames of persecution, clinging to the cross of Christ when almost every other truth had been swept away, and courageously endeavoring to emancipate God's 'Two Witnesses' (the Old and New Testaments), which had so long been bound, and which had prophesied only under the sackcloth of dead languages. 'Rev. 11:3'. In his wisdom, God did not overpower them with the great flood of light now granted to the saints..." {TKIC 122-3} [The last sentence means, it was all hidden - predicting events which cannot be verified is relatively safe! TIAH 256 and WR Apr 1880 87 have the same theme]

    1799 "The predicted Man of Sin, the Antichrist, has also made his appearance, and accomplished his long and terrible reign; and at the exact 'time appointed' (1799) his dominion was taken away. The cleansing of the sanctuary was also accomplished as predicted." {TKIC 129}

    1799 "At the end of 1260 years the power of the truth and its witnesses was manifested (A.D. 1799) .. The saints will be changed from earthly to heavenly conditions.. The present little season, before the storm-cloud bursts upon the world, is a most favorable time for the work of the Elijah class, and corresponds to the successful days of both Elijah and John." {TIAH 256-7}

    1799 "We have noted the fulfillment of the 1,260 days, or the time, times and half a time, of Papacy's power to persecute, and the beginning there, in 1799, of the Time of the End." {TKIC 306}

    1799 "The Papal dominion (and much of the abject reverence of the people for ecclesiasticism in general), as already shown, was broken down at the beginning of the Time of the End - 1799; and, though the subsequent process of consumption has been slow, and there have been occasional signs of apparent recovery, which never seemed more flattering than at present .." {BATT 37}

    1799 "The fact is that the entire Gospel age has been a period of tribulation referred to in Matt. 24:9-12, and now in verse 29. (1) The early Church was persecuted by civil Rome, while later, when Papal Rome got control, all who refused to approve her abominations were persecuted by her (Jezebel) directly, or indirectly by the civil powers to which she was wedded (Ahab). And they were given into her power, and she wore out the saints of the Most High for a time, times and a half time - 1260 years - until A.D. 1799. And this long persecution, in which 'many were purified and made white and tried,' and in which the Mother of Harlots was 'drunk with the blood of the saints and the martyrs of Jesus' (Rev. 17:6) ended as we have already shown, practically in 1776 and actually in 1799 when the Pope and his authority were humiliated before the World." {BATT 584}

    1799 "Napoleon began this Egyptian campaign in 1798, finished it, and then returned to France on October 1, 1799. The campaign is briefly, yet graphically described in the prophecy, verses 40-44 [Daniel 11:40-44]; and its being completed in 1799 marks, according to the prophet's own words, the beginning of 'the time of the end'." {CREA 293, THOG 1925 ed 228-9}

    1799 "'The time of the end' embraces a period from 1799 A.D. to the time of the complete overthrow of Satan's empire and the establishment of the kingdom of Messiah." {CREA 319}

    1799 "Twelve hundred and sixty years from 539 A.D. brings us to 1799, which is another proof that 1799 definitely marks the beginning of 'the time of the end'. This also shows that it is from the date 539 A.D. that the other prophetic days of Daniel must be counted." {CREA 294}

    1799 "'The time of the end' embraces a period from 1799 A.D." {THOG 236}

    1799 "The time of the end is from 1799.." {WT Nov 1 1922 333/346}

    1799 "The indisputable facts, therefore, show that the "time of the end" began in 1799 .." {WT Mar 1 1922}

    1799 "In Biblical symbology a time means a year of twelve months of thirty days each, or 360 days. Each day is considered for a year .. Here are mentioned, then, three and a half times of 360 prophetic days each, or a total of 1260 prophetic days, equal to 1260 years. The Prophet then was shown that 1260 years would mark the beginning of the time of the end of this beastly order. Twelve-hundred sixty years from A.D. 539 brings us to 1799 - another proof that 1799 marks the beginning of the 'time of the end'. This also shows that it is from the date 539 A.D. that the other prophetic days of Daniel must be counted." {THOG 229-30}

    1799 "Some Roman Catholics have claimed that Jesus Christ's thousand Year Reign ended in 1799 when French armies captured Rome and deposed the pope as its ruler, so that he was deported as a prisoner to France, where he died." {WT Sep 1 1989 12}

    1800 "As, prior to the year 800, Papacy was rising, supported by the Roman 'beast' (people) and by its 'horns' (powers), so since

    1800 it has been cast off from temporal authority over kings and peoples, and has been torn and pillaged by those who formerly gave it support. (Rev. 17:16,17)" {TIAH 354-5}

    1829 [End of the 1290 years (from 539 A.D.) of Daniel 12:11, when W.Miller's movement started.] {TFIM 40/60/163, OLOR 27}

    1829 "Though our information pointing out the date of this period is furnished in Daniel's prophecy, we know that he understood nothing at all concerning it, as he said: 'I heard, but I understood not.' ('Dan. 12:8') In answer to his anxious inquiries he was told that the words were closed up and sealed until the Time of the End. It follows, therefore, that no one could understand the prophecy before 1799; and before leaving the subject we shall show that the prophecy indicates that it would not begin to be understood before 1829 .. We have seen how the 1,290 days marked the beginning of an understanding of the mysteries of prophecy in the year 1829." {TKIC 24/306}

    1829 "And note, further, that both of these measures are given in answer to Daniel's question as to what would occur to God's holy ones after their power (the truth) would be released from Papal crushing, (that is, after 1799), and before the setting up of the kingdom of Messiah - Michael. The reply in substance is that Daniel need not hope to understand further, but that in thirty years after the beginning of the Time of the End (1260 + 30 = 1290), a purifying, cleansing, refining work would begin among the holy people, in connection with which an understanding of the prophecy would be granted to the wise among this tried, cleansed, separated class; yet the knowledge would be so communicated that the ungodly and unpurified would not receive or believe it. It was shown, further, that the right understanding of the vision would be far from complete or full; in fact it would be deficient in some of its chief elements until 45 years later (1290 + 45 = 1335), or 75 years after the beginning of the Time of the End, A.D. 1799 (1260 + 75 = 1335). This is clearly indicated by the Hebrew text, which represents the matter as though the watchers, who already have seen something, and are waiting patiently, would suddenly (when '1335 days' had passed) get a full, clear view, far beyond their expectations. 'Oh! the blessedness of him!'. Reckoning from A.D. 539, the 1290 symbolic days ended in 1829 .. A religious movement .. generally known as 'Second Adventists' and 'Millerites,' .. began about 1829.. Thus it will be seen that the separating work of the 'Miller movement' had its beginning at the time foretold - at the end of the 1290 days, 1829." {TKIC 83-4/88}

    1829 " Those who choose might without inconsistency say that the century or generation might as properly reckon from the last sign, the falling of the stars, as from the first, the darkening of the sun and moon: and a century beginning 1833 would be still far from run out. Many are living who witnessed the star-falling sign. Those who are walking with us in the light of present truth are not looking for things to come which are already here, but are waiting for the consummation of matters already in progress. Or, since the Master said, 'When ye shall see all these things,' and since 'the sign of the Son of Man in heaven,' and the budding fig tree, and the gathering of 'the elect' are counted among the signs, it would not be inconsistent to reckon the 'generation' from 1878 to 1914 - 36 1/2 years - about the average of human life today." {BATT 604-5} ["the genea of 1833"]

    1829 "This message concerning Michael's Kingdom, gradually opening from 1829 onward, is symbolically represented in the book of 'Revelation (chap. 10:2,8-10)' as a 'little book,' which the 'wise' of the 'holy people,' represented by John, are instructed to eat" {TKIC 89}

    1833 "signs in sun, moon and stars [of] Matthew 24:29" [had their fulfillment in a mysterious event in 1833] {WR Jan 1885 711}

    1833 "Half a century passed before the next sign appeared, the falling of the stars from heaven, as when a fig tree casteth her unripe fruit when shaken of a mighty wind. Our Lord's words found a fulfillment (though not their complete and only fulfillment, as we shall see later) in the wonderful meteoric showers of the early morning of Nov. 13, 1833. Those inclined to quibble by urging that 'the fixed stars did not fall' are reminded that our Lord said nothing about fixed stars falling, and that fixed stars could not fall: their falling would prove that they were not fixed. the event of 1833 seems to have accomplished the purpose of the sign; and indeed, in connection with the preceding sign, it evidently had considerable to do with the first arousing of the Virgins to meet the Bridegroom, prophesied in the next chapter. Matt. 25:1-5.. these literal signs served their designed purpose in drawing general attention to the Time of the End" {BATT 589-91}

    1840 "We need not here repeat the evidences that the 'seventh trump' began its sounding A.D. 1840, and will continue until the end of the time of trouble" {ZWT Nov 1880 1}

    1844 "But in each case only a few are able to recognize the Deliverer and enlist under his banner in the service of the truth. In the Jewish harvest, there was a going forth of many to meet the Lord when all men 'were in expectation' of him (Luke 3:15), at the time of his birth, thirty years before his anointing as Messiah at the beginning of his ministry; and so there was a corresponding expectation and movement on the part of many (afterward called Adventists) led mainly by a Baptist brother named William Miller, in this country, and by Mr. Wolff and others in Europe and Asia. This culminated in the year A.D. 1844, just thirty years before A.D. 1874, when Christ the Bridegroom and Reaper actually came, as shown by the Jubilee's teaching. In this we find another striking time-parallel between these ages; for those thirty years corresponded exactly to the thirty years from the birth of the babe Jesus unto Messiah the Anointed - baptized, and introduced as Bridegroom and Reaper, at the age of thirty. Matt. 3:11; John 3:29. In both cases there was a disappointment and a tarrying-time of thirty years, during which all slumbered, and only a few in each case awakened at the proper time to a realization of Messiah's presence. The great nominal mass in both houses fail to recognize the visitation, because overcharged and lukewarm, neglecting the command to take heed and watch. Thus will be fulfilled the prediction by the Prophet --'He shall be for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offense to both the houses of Israel.' ('Isa. 8:14') The fleshly house stumbled because they had made void the law of God through giving attention to traditions ('Mark 7:9,13'), and so had not a proper conception of the manner and object of the first advent. For that reason they were unprepared to receive him in the way he did come, and so stumbled over him and his work of sacrifice." {TIAH 240-1, also references in WR Oct 1879 3941, TKIC 84}

    1846 "Then, 1810 years (prophetic, symbolic days) must be the measure from the close of the seventy weeks to the time when the Sanctuary class will be cleansed from the various defilements of Papacy--the desolating abomination which has for so many centuries defiled the temple of God. The death of Messiah, as shown, was in the spring of A.D. 33; and this was the midst or middle of the last week of the seventy, the full end of which was therefore a half week, or three and a half years later--in the autumn of A.D. 36. Therefore, 1810 years from the autumn of A.D. 36, viz., the autumn of 1846, marks the end of the vision of the 2300 days, and the date when the Sanctuary was due to be cleansed. This prophecy being fulfilled, we should expect, in this as in other cases of fulfilled prophecy, to find the facts proving its fulfillment clearly set forth on the pages of history; for, though historians are often unbelievers in the Bible and the God of the Bible, yet, unknown to them, God has overruled their work, so that wherever a prophecy has been fulfilled, the facts have unmistakably passed into history, and always on good and reliable authority. And so it has been in this case of the cleansing of the Sanctuary." {TKIC 107-8}

    1846 "We have marked, too, the fixed dates to which the Prophet Daniel calls attention. The 2,300 days point to 1846 as the time when God's sanctuary would be cleansed of the defiling errors and principles of Papacy; and we have noted the cleansing there accomplished." {TKIC 305-6}

    1846 [Start of] "spiritistic" "evangelical alliance" [between protestant churches.] {TFIM 163}

    1846 "Although the Evangelical Alliance was organized in 1846, it has not been able to accomplish its purpose, because it did not know how to operate." {BATT 9}

    1872 "In this chapter we present the Bible evidence which indicates that six thousand years from the creation of Adam were complete with A.D. 1874; and hence that, since A.D. 1872, we are chronologically entered upon the seventh thousand or the Millennium - the forepart of which, the 'Day of the Lord,' the 'day of trouble,' is to witness the breaking into pieces of the kingdoms of this world and the establishment of the Kingdom of God under the whole heavens." {TIAH 1913 ed 33}

    1872 "THERE ARE EVIDENCES THAT - Six thousand Years from Adam ended in A.D. 1872." {DPOA A17}

    1872 "No, they are not accidental: undoubtedly the same all-wise One who taught us through the Chronology that six thousand years from Adam's creation ended with A.D. 1872, and that the seventh thousand, the Millennial age, began there; who through the Jubilee cycles taught us that the Lord would be present and the Times of Restitution begin in the fall of 1874; and who through the Times of the Gentiles showed us that we must not expect these things to be done in haste, but by seemingly natural means covering a period of forty years, has in these Parallel Dispensations marked by Israel's 'double' given us evidence which not only itself teaches clearly the Lord's presence, the harvest and the restitution (beginning with favor to fleshly Israel), but at the same time furnishes a proof of the correctness of the other prophetic evidences and of the Chronology. For be it distinctly noticed that if the Chronology, or any of these time-periods, be changed but one year, the beauty and force of this parallelism are destroyed. For instance, if the Chronology be altered but one year, more or less - if we add one year, say to the period of the Kings or the Judges, or if we make it one year less - it would spoil the parallelism. If we should add one year it would make the first of Israel's periods 1846 years long, and the double or other half of it would thus be thrown one year later, while, on the contrary, by such a change of the Chronology the Jubilee cycles would be thrown one year earlier, i.e., A.D. 1873; and it would make the 6000 years end in A.D. 1871, while the Gentile Times would not be affected by it at all. All can see that the harmony or parallelism would thus be utterly destroyed. Or, if one year should be deducted from the chronological reckoning the confusion would be just as great, the changes to the several periods being in an opposite direction. Thus these various time prophecies corroborate each other, while the parallelism of the two dispensations clinches their testimony." {TIAH 241-2} [So exactly A.D. 1872 is.. it]

    1872 ".. the exact Bible Chronology points to October 1872 as the beginning of the seventh thousand years, or Millennium .." {TKIC 1905 ed 127}

    1872 ".. six thousand years from the creation of Adam .. ended with the Jewish year which began in the autumn of A.D. 1872, and we are, therefore, already in 'the great day of the Lord'; or seventh thousand." {HOTW 67}

    1872 "We are already living in the seventh millennium - since October 1872." {TIAH 1915 ed 363}

    1872 "Six thousand Years from Adam ended in A.D. 1872." {DHMB 6 from end}

    1872-3 ".. showing the year 1872 A.D. to be the year of the world 6000, and 1873 A.D. the commencement of the seventh thousand-year period, the seventh millennium .." {TIAH 1913 ed 53-4}

    1872-3 "Here we furnish the evidence that from the creation of Adam to (but not including) A.D. 1873 was six thousand years. And though the Bible contains no direct statement that the seventh thousand will be the epoch of Christ's reign, the great Sabbath Day of restitution to the world, yet the venerable tradition is not without a reasonable foundation." {TIAH 39} [the venerable tradition referred to is of a a Lutheran minister from Philadelphia named Joseph A. Seiss, editor of The Prophetic Times, in whose Jan 1870 issue Vol VIII No 1 p 12-3 appears "1870 brings us to the commencement of the Seventh Thousand of the years since the present world began .. We lay no great stress upon the arithmetic of prophecy; because the starting-points, as well as many of the integers of the calculations, lack in certainty.. It has been a very old, and a very widely accredited theory, that the world, of which Adam was the beginning, is to continue 6000 years in its secular, ailing and toiling condition; and that the seventh thousand is to be one of glorious sabbatic rest, ushered in by the winding up of this present age or dispensation."]

    1873 [Six thousand Years of man's existence ends in A.D. 1873] {WR Apr 1880 88}

    1873 "Here we furnish the evidence that from the creation of Adam to A.D. 1873 was six thousand years. And though the Bible contains no direct statement that the seventh thousand will be the epoch of Christ's reign, the great Sabbath Day of restitution to the world, yet the venerable tradition is not without reasonable foundation.. If, then, the seventh thousand-year period of earth's history be an epoch specially noted as the period of Christ's reign, we shall, by showing that it began in A.D. 1873, be proving that we are already in it." {TIAH 1915 ed 39-40}

    1873 "Thus the Word of God corrects the few slight errors which have crept into it by any means.. God has so guarded his Word that the few trivial errors of copyists are made very manifest, and the full harmony of his Word gives ample foundation for faith .. So, then, whereas Usher dates A.D. 1 as the year 4005 from the creation of Adam, it really was, as we have shown, the year 4129, according to the Bible record, thus showing the year 1872 A.D. to be the year of the world 6000, and 1873 A.D. the commencement of the seventh thousand-year period, the seventh millennium, or thousand-year day of earth's history. {TIAH 53-4}

    1873 "The Bible chronology herein presented shows that the six great 1000 year days beginning with Adam are ended, and that the great 7th Day, the 1000 years of Christ's Reign, began in 1873." {TIAH 1916 ed Foreword 2}

    1873 "If, then, the seventh thousand-year period of earth's history be an epoch specially noted as the period of Christ's reign, we shall, by showing that it began in A.D. 1873, be proving that we are already in it." {TIAH 1915 ed 40}

    1873-4 "For instance, as we look back and note that the Scriptures marked 1873 as the end of six thousand years from Adam to the beginning of the seventh thousand, and the fall of 1874 as the beginning of the forty-year harvest of the Gospel age and day of wrath for the overthrow of all the institutions of 'this present evil world (or order of affairs),' we can see that facts have well borne out those predictions of Scripture." {WR Jul 15 1894 1675}

    1874 "The Scriptures show that the second presence [of the Lord] was due in 1874 .. This proof shows that the Lord has been present since 1874" {WT Mar 1 1923 67}

    1874 The next chapter will present Bible evidence that 1874 A.D. was the exact date of the beginning of the 'Times of Restitution,' and hence of our Lord's return." {TAIH 170-1}

    1874 "Hence the 2500th year, which would be the great 50th Jubilee, must be the antitype, the real Jubilee or Restitution. But instead of being a year, as in the type, it will be larger; it will be the beginning of the great thousand-year Jubilee - the Millennium. Just so it has been in the fulfillment of every type in which time was a feature. Thus the Pentecostal outpouring of the holy Spirit came upon the typical day of Pentecost - or fiftieth day. Christ, our Passover sacrifice, died in the same night in which the typical lamb was appointed to be killed - a day before or a day after would not answer. So here, not the year after nor the year before the 2500th, or closing of the typical cycle, would do; but that very year, beginning October, 1874, must have begun the antitype of Restitution times." {TIAH 181}

    1874 "We have marked with special delight the 1,335 days, pointing, as they do, to 1874 as the exact date of our Lord's return; and we have since that time experienced the very blessedness promised--through the clearer unfoldings of the wonderful mysteries of the divine plan." {TKIC 306}

    1874 "Christ came in the character of a Bridegroom in 1874 .. at the beginning of the Gospel harvest." {WT Oct 1879 4}

    1874 "[Entering] age of .. Laodicean church.. C.T.Russell is .. messenger or 'angel' of [that] church." {WR 1918 6212}

    1874 "The fact of our Lord's second coming is definitely settled by the Scriptures.. The Scriptures show that his second presence was due in 1874.. This proof shows that the Lord has been present since 1874 .. The indisputable facts, therefore, show that .. the Lord's second presence began in 1874." {WT Mar 1 1922 67-}

    1874 "The Lord did not come in 1844, and the world was not burned up with fire .. this was a great disappointment to those 'holy people' who had so confidently looked for Christ ('Michael') then to appear and to exalt them with him in power and glory. But, notwithstanding the disappointment, [Miller's] movement had its designed effects - of awakening an interest in the subject of the Lord's coming, and of casting reproach upon the subject by reason of mistaken expectations. We say designed effects because without a doubt the hand of the Lord was in it. It not only did a work corresponding to that of the first advent movement, when our Lord was born, when the wise men came from the East and when 'all men were in expectation of him' ('Matt. 2:1,2'; 'Luke 3:15'), but it corresponded with it in time also, being just thirty years before the anointing of our Lord, at thirty years of age, at the beginning of his work as Messiah.. we recognize that movement as being in God's order, and as doing a very important work in the separating, purifying, refining, and thus making ready, of a waiting people prepared for the Lord. And not only did it do a purifying and testing work in its own day, but, by casting reproach upon the study of prophecy and upon the doctrine of the Lord's second advent, it has ever since served to test and prove the consecrated .. it was the beginning of the right understanding of Daniel's visions, and at the right time to fit the prophecy. Mr. Miller's application of the three and a half times (1260 years) was practically the same as that we have just given, but he made the mistake of not starting the 1290 and 1335 periods at the same point. Had he done so he would have been right. On the contrary, he started them thirty years sooner - about 509 instead of 539, which ended the 1335 days in 1844, instead of 1874." .. The disappointment of 1844 is briefly recorded in the parable, by the statement that 'the Bridegroom tarried' - i.e., he seemed to the expectant ones to tarry. And the confusion and darkness experienced by all, and the many false and visionary views entered into by some who were there disappointed, are shown in the parable by the statement: 'While the Bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.' Yea, and in their darkness and slumber many of them dreamed strange, unreasonable things. But the parable shows a second movement, similar, and yet different, among the same virgins. The same general class is referred to but not necessarily the same individuals. As the first movement was the result of light upon the prophecy, regarding the time for Messiah's second advent as the Bridegroom of the Church, so was the second movement. But there are several differences. In the first, the lamps of all the virgins burned alike, and the company expecting the Bridegroom was mixed; whereas in the second movement, while all will be aroused, only those will be led out who have the spirit of the truth in their hearts, as well as a knowledge of the Bible - a trimmed lamp. Disappointment was predicted for the first movement, and waiting for the 1335 days was necessary; but the second was not a disappointment, and a waiting was no longer necessary; for fulfillment came exactly at the close of the 1335 prophetic days - in October 1874. " {TKIC 85-93}

    1874 [Division between the "wise and foolish virgins" was over the 1874 date of the return of the bridegroom] {WR Apr 1880 88} [This matter was not raised when C.T.Russell was divorced by his wife for sexual misconduct with a maidservant/secretary]

    1874 "Our Lord, the appointed King, is now present, since October 1874, A.D., according to the testimony of the prophets .." {BATT 1913 ed 621}

    1874 "[end of the] tarrying time [of Christ, corresponding to 30 years from Jesus' birth to his baptism]" {TIAH 240, WR Oct 1879 3941} [also Adventist's end of the world per W.Miller]

    1874 "Prophecy can not be understood until it has been fulfilled or is in the course of fulfillment. From 1874 to 1914 the prophecy concerning the Lord's coming was being fulfilled and could be understood, and was understood, by those who were faithful to the Lord and who were watching the development of events, but not by others." {CREA 290}

    1874 "Thus we find that the twenty-five hundredth year began with the beginning of the year A.D. 1875, which in Jewish civil time, by which this is reckoned (Lev. 25:9), began about October, 1874. So, then, if the great Jubilee were to be only a year, like its type, it would have commenced October, A.D. 1874, at end of 2499 years, and would have ended October, A.D. 1875. But this is not the type, but the reality; it was not a Jubilee Year, but the antitypical Thousand years of Restitution of all things, which commenced October, A.D. 1874." {TIAH 187}

    1874 "Bible prophecy shows that the Lord was due to appear for the second time in the year 1874. Fulfilled prophecy shows beyond a doubt that he did appear in 1874. Fulfilled prophecy is otherwise designated the physical facts; and these facts are indisputable." {WT Nov 1 1922 333}

    1874 "Applying the same rule then, of a day for a year, 1335 days after 539 A.D. brings us to 1874 A.D. at which time, according to Biblical chronology, the Lord's second presence was due." {CREA 298} [the day for a year basis is a technique used in Astrology known as Progressions]

    1874 "We have no doubt whatever in regard to the chronology relating to the dates of 1874 .." {WT May 15 1922 150}

    1874 "The most important thing to which all the prophecies point and for which the apostles looked forward has been the second coming of the Lord. It is described by the Prophet as a blessed time. Daniel then says: 'Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.' (Daniel 12:12). The watchers here, without question are those who were instructed by the Lord to watch for his return. This date, therefore, when understood, would certainly fix the time when the Lord is due at his second appearing. Applying the same rule, then, of a day for a year, 1335 days after 539 A.D. brings us to A.D. 1874, at which time, according to Biblical chronology, the Lord's second presence is due. If this calculation is correct, from that time forward we ought to be able to find some evidences marking the Lord's presence." {THOG 229-30}

    1874 "No one can properly understand the work of God at this present time who does not realize that since 1874, the time of the Lord's return in power, there has been a complete change in God's operations." {WRT Sep 15 1922 278}

    1874 "The Scriptural proof is that the second presence of the Lord Jesus Christ began in 1874 A.D." {PROP 65}

    1874 "The Scriptural proof is that the period of his presence and the day of God's preparation is a period from A.D. 1874 forward. The second coming of the Lord therefore began in 1874 .." {CREA 310}

    1874 "[C.T.Russell taught that 1874 marked] "the start of the Battle of Armageddon" {TIAH 101}

    1874 "(Revelation) 3:20. Behold, I stand at the door. Some of the Scriptures, which, when understood in their connections and significance, prove that the Lord's Second Advent occurred in the fall of 1874 are as follows: [a jumble of Biblical verses follow as 'proof'] and these are but 88 of the proofs hastily collected." {TFIM 68-71}

  • bigmouth

    Excellent compilation vinny, you found a couple of things I've been looking for for ages.

    "it is necessary that they couch all of their statements in language designed to baffle and frustrate the reader. How often I used to read and reread a paragraph on some particular issue (like the generation, or some other pivotal belief) only to remain frustrated and unenlightened at the end of the exercise. "--

    - and this comment from fringe dweller was/is me too!! Welcome by the way.

  • anakolouthos

    Brilliant research Vinny, thanks for all your work!

  • sspo

    Thanks for all that research.


    Excellent research!

    bttt - so I can find it later.

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