Somebody Help!!

by RichieRich 26 Replies latest jw friends

  • RichieRich
    RichieRich

    ok, so we all know about myspace, but there is another big network out there called Facebook. It's a pretty exclusive thing, you have to have a college email address to get in, etc, but anyhow, there's different groups , and of course, there's a big JW group.

    So I joined the group, and just said that I was raised a Witness, and I left but that I miss my mother, etc.

    Then I noticed that this was posted:

    Anisha Camp (New York, NY) wrote on Feb 1, 2007 at 8:00 AM I am NOT a JW but I have some family that are. They are a bit weird to me too. Can you please explain your doctrine to me?
    So I posted this ( credit doesn't go to me, its been posted all over this website- I think we all put it together or something):

    Here's some of the basics to get you started:
    1. Jehovah God is not a Trinity
    2. The doctrine of the Trinity is inspired by Satan
    3. Jesus Christ is a created being, who at one time did not exist (a.k.a.Michael the archangel)
    4. The Holy Spirit is not a person but is "God's active force" i.e. gravity, electricity etc.
    5. Heaven is only for select Jehovah's Witnesses
    6. Heaven is limited only to 144,000 Jehovah's Witnesses
    7. Jehovah's Witnesses are the only true Christians
    8. There is no Hell (It is simply the grave)
    9. There is no life after death (except for the 144,000)
    10. Salvation is by good works not by Grace
    11. You cannot be sure of salvation
    12. Jesus is not to be worshiped or prayed to
    13. Jesus did not rise from the dead bodily but as a spirit being
    14. You are discouraged from attending college
    15. The "first resurrection" occurred in 1918
    16. All pastors are the "Antichrist"
    17. All churches are of Satan
    18. All governments are controlled by Satan
    19. You cannot take a blood transfusion
    20. You cannot be a police officer
    21. You cannot salute the flag, stand for the national anthem, or own a flag
    22. You cannot serve in the military
    23. You cannot buy girl Scout cookies
    24. You must attend five meetings per week
    25. Jesus'second coming occurred in 1914 (only known to Jehovah's Witnesses)
    26. You cannot marry a non-Jehovah's Witness
    27. If one does not follow the rules of the Watchtower they will be shunned
    28. You cannot read Christian literature from a Christian book store
    29. You cannot be a cheerleader
    30. You cannot celebrate any holidays (Christmas, Easter, etc.)
    31. You cannot celebrate your birthday
    32. You cannot run for or hold a political office
    33. You cannot vote in any political campaign
    34. You cannot serve on a jury
    35. You are discouraged from giving to charity (except Watchtower causes)
    36. You cannot speak to former members who are shunned (disfellowshipped)
    37. You cannot accept Christmas gifts
    38. You must read and study Watchtower literature regularly
    39. Only Jehovah's Witnesses can understand the Bible
    40. Angels direct the Watchtower organization
    41. Jesus did not die on a cross but an upright pole
    42. You cannot own or wear a cross
    43. You must report your witnessing activity to the elders
    44. You must go from door to door weekly to gain converts
    45. You cannot have friends who are not Jehovah's Witnesses
    46. You must refer to all Jehovah's Witnesses as "brother" or "sister"
    47. You cannot play chess*
    48. You cannot understand the Bible without Watchtower literature to explain it
    49. A child abuser is reported to Watchtower elders and not the police
    50. You must forgo vacations to attend annual conventions
    51. You are discouraged from buying a two door car-A "Theocratic" or "spiritually strong" Jehovah's Witness will have a full size car for the door to door work
    52. Men cannot wear beards
    53. Men must wear short hair
    54. Women cannot pray in the presence of men without a hat
    55. You cannot have a tattoo
    56. You're forbidden to use any tobacco products
    57. Only officially approved sexual practices are allowed in marriage
    58. You must appear before a Judicial committee if you are caught breaking Watchtower rules (Secret files are kept on all members which record these meetings-these files are kept in New York and are never destroyed)
    59. You must not own wind-chimes (they are for chasing away evil spirits)*
    60. You cannot read any anti-Jehovah's Witness material
    61. You cannot use pet foods made with blood or blood products
    62. You cannot join any clubs or sports teams
    63. You cannot wear jade jewelry*
    64. You cannot purchase Christian products (books, music, plaques, pictures etc.)
    65. You cannot wear any Christian jewelry
    66. Jehovah's Witness meeting places have no windows
    67. If you see another Jehovah's Witness breaking the rules you must turn them in to the elders to be interrogated
    68. Jesus could have sinned and failed in his mission
    69. Jesus was not born the savior but became the savior at his baptism
    70. The Watchtower organization is God's prophet on earth today
    71. Women must submit to Watchtower elders
    72. You cannot support your country
    73. One must study Watchtower books at least six months before he can be baptized
    74. Before baptism, one must answer over 80 questions in front of a panel of elders
    75. Most of The Book of Revelation applies to the Jehovah's Witnesses
    76. You cannot celebrate Mothers or Fathers day (it may produce pride)
    77. Kingdom Halls cannot have pews for seating
    78. JWs are are fobidden to say "good luck"
    79. God is not omniscient "all knowing"
    80. God is not omnipresent
    81. God only speaks through the "Governing Body" in Brooklyn, New York
    82. The Holy Spirit is only for select Jehovah's Witnesses
    83. The Lord's supper is only to be eaten by select Jehovah's Witnesses (144,000 group-99.99% of Jehovah's Witnesses are forbidden from taking the Lord's supper)
    84. The Lord's supper can only be offered once per year
    85. JWs in times of crisis, are strongly discouraged from consulting with family counselors, including mental health professionals who are not Jehovah's Witnesses
    86. Only faithful Jehovah's Witnesses will survive Armageddon
    87. If you have a non-Witness spouse your first loyalty is to the elders over your spouse
    88. Jesus was equal to Adam (just a man)
    89. Judgment day is 1000 years long
    90. If you leave Jehovah's Witnesses or are expelled from the organization you will not be resurrected
    91. Only Jehovah's Witness prayers are heard by God
    92. Man's salvation is secondary in God's plan; Jesus was sent to "vindicate Jehovah's name"
    93. God will destroy all non-Jehovah's Witnesses at armageddon
    94. You forbidden to say "God bless you" when someone sneezes.
    95. You must never enter a church building
    96. You must never attend a church service
    97. You cannot be involved in martial arts, boxing or wrestling
    98. You cannot participate in a school play
    99. You cannot donate blood or your organs when you die
    100. You can never question what is printed in Watchtower literature
    10l. You are forbidden to attend a funeral of an ex-Jehovah's Witness

    What they're called...

    -JW services are called "meetings"
    -JW hymnals are called "song books" (all songs have to be composed by JWs)
    -The JW religion is referred to by the Witnesses as "The Truth"
    -The JWs call themselves "The only true Christians"
    -The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society Inc. of Brooklyn, New York is called "God's Organization"
    -In conversation JWs call Watchtower headquarters "The Society"
    -All other religions (pagan, Christian, or any world religion) are called "Babylon the Great"
    -All Christian pastors and ministers are called the "Antichrist"
    -Changes in doctrine is called "New Light"
    -The five meetings JWs must attend are called:

    1. Public Talk
    2. Watchtower Study
    3. Area Book Study
    4. Theocratic School
    5. Service Meeting

    -A non-Witness is called "a worldly person"
    -A person who rejects the JW message is called a "goat"
    -A person who is studying to become a JW is called "a study"
    -God's judgment on all non JWs is called "Armageddon"
    -The JW Bible is called "New World Translation
    -The door to door work is called "the Service"
    -Those who bring "new light" or new revelations to the JWs are called "The faithful and discreet slave"
    -JWs who have an earthly hope are called "Other Sheep"
    -Old term for earthly hope "Jonadab"
    -JWs who have a heavenly hope are called "Anointed Remnant"
    -A JW who is enthusiastic is called "theocratic"
    -Every JW is called a "Publisher"
    -Part time door to door workers are called "Auxiliary Pioneers"
    -Full time door to door workers are called "Regular Pioneers"
    -Full time door to door workers who have stricter quotas than Regular Pioneers, are called "Special Pioneers"
    -Appointed Local leaders are called "Elders"
    -Appointed Local helpers/workers are called "Ministerial Servants"
    -The group responsible for discipline are called "The Judicial Committee"
    -A traveling Watchtower representative is called a "Circuit Overseer"
    -The Circuit Overseer's boss is called "District Overseer"
    -The District Overseer's boss is called "Zone Overseer"
    -The Zone Overseer's boss is called "Branch Overseer"
    -The Brooklyn, New York Headquarters is called "Bethel"
    -Headquarters workers are called "Bethelites"
    -A person who is a weak Witness is called "unspiritual" or "Un-theocratic"
    -A JW who is publicly disciplined by the elders is called "publicly reproved"
    -A JW who is privately disciplined by the elders is called "privately reproved"
    -A JW who rejects Watchtower teachings and leaves or is expelled is called "an apostate"
    -A JW who breaks any of the Watchtower rules and does not repent to the elders is "disfellowshipped" (Shunned)
    -A disfellowshipped person who wants to return to the organization, repents to the elders and is called "reinstated"
    -Jehovah's Witness meeting places are called "Kingdom Halls"

    ok, so good enough, then I get this reply:

    Shauna Jensen (Georgian) wrote 2 hours ago To richard,
    How can you state some of these things??I have a few problems in your "doctrine"

    9. "there is no life after death" I think this statement is completely ridiculous. The why would we be preaching to people?? Why would we always be talking about the ressurection?? And why would jehovah satte that all preaching about and serving him will be resurected?? Where did you get the "no resurrection" thing from" Who told you that?
    24. "You must attend 5 meetings a week". It is suggested and teached that you attend all 5 meetings. You will not be disfellowshipped if you do not attend all 5.
    26. "you cannot marry a non jw" False. It is suggested strongly that you marry a jw. But it is not a law.
    34. "You cannot serve on a jury" That is a conscience matter that you decide on.
    46. "You must refer to each other as brother or sister" Again you "must" do nothing. You can call them Mrs. or Mr
    47. "You cannot play chess" I have played chess many atime with brothers and sisters.
    51. "must not have a two door car" Seriously?? I know plenty of people that have two door cars, including elders.
    54. "Women cannot pray in the prescense of a man with out a hat" Where did you get that from?? That is very unaccurate there is not rule or even advice to even justify that.
    57. " approved sexual pratices" I won't even go there with that one.
    68. " jesus sinned and failed" how can you say that.
    83. We are not forbidden from participating in the lords evening meal. The 144000 choose to because they are chosen by gods holy spirit. We are not and we respect the decision. that is why we do not participate.
    93. "God will destroy all non-jws at armageddon" That would not be a right and just god. He will no destroy those who have not had the chance to hear about jehovahs god and his message.
    Ok, so can anybody put together a good answer to all the points brought up? Cause I'm drawing a SERIOUS blank here. Thanks.

  • Junction-Guy
    Junction-Guy

    Ok Ritchie, Im gonna book mark this thead, because I dont have enough time right now, i will try to give you a response shortly though.

  • Wasanelder Once
    Wasanelder Once

    Richie,

    The guy's a simpleton who wants to argue about the words. Let it go. Keep stating the reality and let the chips fall. No matter what you write he will pick it apart since he has his head up his hoohoo.

    alt

    W.Once

  • hillary_step
    hillary_step
    24. "You must attend 5 meetings a week". It is suggested and teached that you attend all 5 meetings.

    God bless the modern College education system and all who sail on her.

    HS

  • Junction-Guy
    Junction-Guy

    Ok Ritchie, my response is much sooner than I thought. Im sure that most of his objections to your posting have some WT article dealing with them. If you are good at cutting and pasting try that. You do realize this guy is using a "play on words" to deceive people into thinking you're a liar. He's using theocratic warfare strategy. The headcovering issue is definitely one I can see here. All JW's know that a woman is not supposed to pray in the presence of a JW man if her head is uncovered, he is using a technicality here to try prove you a liar, the techincality being whether or not the man in her presence is baptized. Revise your positions and let them know.

  • GoingGoingGone
    GoingGoingGone

    Richie,

    I can't reply in depth right now, but look here http://www.watchtower.cc/

    There are a ton of good quotes from WTs, sorted by subject.

    Good luck!!

    GGG

  • lola28
    lola28

    Already posted on the thread in facebook.

    lola

  • Gopher
    Gopher

    Richard, I hope this helps.

    9. "there is no life after death" I think this statement is completely ridiculous. The why would we be preaching to people?? Why would we always be talking about the ressurection?? And why would jehovah satte that all preaching about and serving him will be resurected?? Where did you get the "no resurrection" thing from" Who told you that?

    The Witnesses teach that only the 144,000 get immediate life after death. Everyone has to wait until God's appointed time for them, and then it would be in a different physical body (kind of a re-incarnation if you think about it).

    24. "You must attend 5 meetings a week". It is suggested and teached that you attend all 5 meetings. You will not be disfellowshipped if you do not attend all 5.

    If you miss meetings, you hear counsel about 'not forsaking the gatherings'. You will be viewed as spiritually weak, a less-than-desirable associate, and will not get special privileges in the congregation.

    26. "you cannot marry a non jw" False. It is suggested strongly that you marry a jw. But it is not a law.

    If you a marry a non JW, you will be viewed as spiritually weak, a less-than-desirable associate, and will not get special privileges in the congregation.

    34. "You cannot serve on a jury" That is a conscience matter that you decide on.

    The JW is correct on this.

    46. "You must refer to each other as brother or sister" Again you "must" do nothing. You can call them Mrs. or Mr

    If you do not use the terms 'brother' and 'sister', you are viewed as spiritually weak or an outsider. There is nothing in writing on this, but it is very much expected that you do this (especially at the Kingdom Hall).

    47. "You cannot play chess" I have played chess many atime with brothers and sisters.

    The JW is correct. However, sometime during the 1960's or 1970's, the Awake! magazine had called chess a war game. Then 10 years or so later they said chess was an acceptable form of recreation.

    51. "must not have a two door car" Seriously?? I know plenty of people that have two door cars, including elders.

    Those who offer two-door cars for use in the ministry are frowned on. Bigger cars are preferred. There's nothing in writing on this, but anyone who's been around the JW's knows this to be true.

    54. "Women cannot pray in the prescense of a man with out a hat" Where did you get that from?? That is very unaccurate there is not rule or even advice to even justify that.

    The JW is splitting hairs here. A female JW cannot pray without a HEAD COVERING in the presence of a male JW who might normally pray (but cannot due to congregation restrictions on him).

    57. " approved sexual pratices" I won't even go there with that one.

    In about 1973, the Watchtower listed certain practices that were unacceptable for married Christians on the ground that they mimicked homosexual practices. They even tried to have elders enforce this. Later, they had to back off and print that what happens in the bedroom is essentially for the couple to decide.

    68. " jesus sinned and failed" how can you say that.

    The JW misquoted you here. You said the Watchtower has printed that Jesus was under enormous pressure during his last night and day on earth, with the fate of humankind resting on whether he'd be faithful to the death. The clear implication was that if he had failed, what a sad thing that would be for mankind.

    83. We are not forbidden from participating in the lords evening meal. The 144000 choose to because they are chosen by gods holy spirit. We are not and we respect the decision. that is why we do not participate.

    Then why do they spend the first 15 minutes or so of every Memorial talk discussing that there are two classes, and that everyone in the audience is probably of the earthly (non participating) class? If a newer JW chooses to participate, they are viewed with suspicion and sometimes the elders won't even count them on their report to the headquarters.

    93. "God will destroy all non-jws at armageddon" That would not be a right and just god. He will no destroy those who have not had the chance to hear about jehovahs god and his message.

    The JW's teach you must be on the "ark of salvation" to survive Armageddon. By the ark, they mean their organization. If certain governments restrict the Watchtower's work and people cannot be reached with the "kingdom good news" as preached by Jehovah's Witnesses, then those governments bear "community responsibility" (according to the WT) for the deaths of all those people within their borders. While the JW might like to think that his organization allows for non-JW's to survive Armageddon, that is just wishful thinking.

  • Junction-Guy
    Junction-Guy

    Also on #68 the JW definitely misquoted you, you said that they teach that Jesus could have sined and failed. You are correct in this instance as that is what was taught, that Jesus could have sinned. He miquoted you on that, and you should call attention to that.

  • Do you Mr. Jones?
    Do you Mr. Jones?
    24. "You must attend 5 meetings a week". It is suggested and teached that you attend all 5 meetings.
    God bless the modern College education system and all who sail on her. HS

    Is 24 a quote from Geo.W. BUSH. Or, maybe I'm thinking of his famous statement that every American should be "taughten real good to be better wroters."

    DYMJ ... "and, oh, the future's looking better everyday!" -- Pat Buchannan

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