The Holy Spirit
Okay, I'm interested in what everybody thinks on this. I believe that for the most parts all religions start off with a good motive, i.e., to provide a forum that will help people to serve God. (Basically). In time, however, they seem to take on a life of themselves and begin demanding allegiance (loyalty) for themselves. Then at some point they become the voice of God and presume to speak for him on ALL issues.
Now my question is this: What has happened to God's Holy Spirit? Suddenly we are no longer able to read God's Word and let it move our hearts and instruct because without this religion, we are told, we cannot understand God's word. What about the Holy Spirit, does it not operate on individuals? If it does not, then why are to to pray for it? If it does operate on us, why is it we cannot understand the Bible which is a product of that spirit?
I look forward to your replies.
First off are you certain the H.S. is Jehovah's active force and not some third person in a Godhead?
Hehehe...actually I say that with a smirk on my face because I'm not serious when I ask that question, however I do wish to point out there are as many beliefs as there are people on this whole religion thing.
It appears that what beliefs are real and work for one person do not for another and yet each is comfortable with their own brand.
These same issues are evident in all religions including our own. Only difference with our JW brand is that if we choose to disagree our whole life is disrupted.
Therefore my biggest contention right now is that the Society should allow for liberal
congregational discussion periods of our beliefs OR allow for exiting our belief system all together but without reprisals.
Sorry to have changed the subject on you Frenchy, but what your pointing to is a deviance from traditional WT teaching. Even though I may agree with you that Holy Spirit is operative upon any individual with faith, how can I seek new beliefs when it's difficult to release myself from present beliefs without getting DF'd for apostacy?
Still very open of course to hearing views of others on the subject you have raised here regarding God's H.S.
Love and Friendship,
Frenchy, THANK YOU!! These are questions that have haunted me for some time now. I do not have the free time now to give a proper response. I'll be back later with my two cents worth.
Martini, Sorry, I didn't mean to ignore you. Nice to see you again. You brought up some interesting topics for discussion also. See all of you later.
Sooooo???? What do you think?
Frenchy in reply to your question,
...why is it we cannot understand the Bible which is a product of that spirit?
If I understand you correctly, in your complete post, you point to the fact that we as a religion and because of the FDS that no one can really understand the Bible outside of us, well I hate to disagree with you.
The Bible being a product of God's spirit is available to all mankind and no one has the absolute complete truth decoded from God's prohecies and other deep things. Jehovah sees fit to reveal his truth about Himself to anyone who sees fit regardless of your occupation or status, that includes some of the following examples:
3-The little girl who advised Naaman's wife on where he could get a cure from his leprosy.
4-The fellow who the disciples opposed and complained to Jesus about wanting to stop his activities.
5-The evildoer on the stake beside Jesus and the list could go on and on.
The point I want to make is this, you can understand the Bible on your own by reading it however there are deep things and if a person is willing to put forth the effort out of a clean heart, then God is looking for such like ones to worship with spirit and truth. Of course Jehovah has sent friends of His to help sheep like ones which we should never discount.
If any of you think that it's not possible to understand the Bible outside the FDS you are mistaken. You should ask yourself the question:
Why do you think the Bible holds the world record for the most distributed book on the earth, the most translated book in nearly every earth's languages, isn't it God's will for everyone to avail themselves and not only for a small group?
Spectrom, I may be wrong, however, I dont think Frenchy is saying that we cant understand without them, i think is is questioning this kind of thinking,I happen also to think anyone can understand the deep things of the binle, anybody saying you cant is trying to control. in my opinion.
Spectrom: Claudia is right,you missed the point of my post. I was indeed questioning the reasoning that has been presented to us as witnesses for many years now. I was wondering how many other witnesses felt like I did (and apparently you and Claudia as well) about the Holy Spirit operating on individuals to help them understand God's purpose and our role here on earth.
I beleive that religions do their flocks a great injustice when they presume to be able to act as the Holy Spirit in interpreting the Bible for their members. Personally I find it very evident that no such group has been authorized by God to do so in light of all the mistakes that are made by EVERY religion.
I think that ANY person or group that professes to speak for God is setting themselves up for some serious reprocussions from the Almighty. What amazes (and sometimes angers) me is when such a group makes mistake after mistake and still refuses to acknowledge that all of these 'divine revelations' were nothing more than human speculations. AND then have the nerve to print articles discouraging 'independent thinking'.
Oh, I thought I'd better mention that this is Frenchy. I'm at another location.
To see is to see all.
Edited by - Ben on 22 April 2000 17:19:20
I meant to respond to your post earlier but I have come down with a horrible case of the flu. I'll be home from work for several days-hope to reply during that time.
Hope you get better, hon, look forward to your reply.