by Big Tex 20 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse
Now you know why I married him. Great thread, hon. And to those who wonder why we stick around here now that we've been out of the Witnesses for a few years (besides the wonderful friends we've made), it is this: to help others who are just starting their journey. All of us who have been through it can now extend a helping hand to those just coming out and assure them they're not crazy and it will get better.
Nina
I was never sexually abused, but I was savagely physically abused by my step father, as was my brother. We found out later my younger sister was molested by him from the age of 2. He threatened her that he would kill all of us if she said anything. She was abused from the ages of 2 to about 9. I was between the ages of 4 and 11 during this time. He was extremely violent and we were scared to death of him. He was careful to never hit our faces so nobody would know. He was so charismatic, nobody would believe that he was capable of what he was doing. Sadly, because we were raised in this environment, we thought we deserved the treatment. My mother should have left sooner, but back then, you didn't leave your mate, no matter what. She went to the elders many times, but all they did was call her a liar. Finally, she brought my brother and I in before the elders and showed them the severe bruises that were always had. She wanted permission to separate, that's all she wanted. She didn't want to be reproved or disfellowshipped for separating from him. They all called us liars and were disgusted with us and how we could make such false accusations against such a wonderful brother as my step father. I told them I would never speak to an elder again....I was 10 years old.
Even at that young age, we could see my mother was losing it. She was plotting to kill him. She didn't feel we could safely get away, and the only way would be for him to die. My brother and I convinced her that we could leave and get away safely. We waited for our chance. He had to take a trip to NY. During that two weeks, we moved everything out. A single sister let the 4 of us come stay with her in her house. Then we stayed with a woman she worked with. We lived in constant fear for the next few years, always looking behind us, waiting for this monster to find us. The elders treated all of us like we were disfellowshipped. That was over 20 years ago, and a couple of the brothers that were on that body STILL shun her.
About 10 years ago, my sister admitted that she had been molested by that step dad and the one after that one. My mother went to an elder in his hall to let them know, in accord with an article that came out about that. The elder said "why are you burdening me with this??"
Where is he now? He's in my district, in good standing. I can only hope the brothers in his hall keep an eye on him and protect the young ones that are there.
(((jwcol))) I'm so sorry. You say he's in your district. Are you still attending meetings?
Excellent post, Chris.
I know that in my father's case, he convinced himself that the abuse cases he dealt with as an elder were isolated one-off type instances and that he was right to wait on Jehovah....each time.I've often wondered what these men think in the middle of the night, when no one's around and there's no game to play, really how do they justify it?
Chris-
That was beautiful.
Thank you-
Kimberlee d.
Joe
Do not ever, ever, allow anyone (apart from parents/carers of course) anywhere near a child abuse victim unless and until the professionals have done their jobs and finished with their interviews. The parents/carers should share no details with anyone else - especially not the alleged or putative abuser or anyone connected with them.
The professionals work under very strict guidelines and rules to ensure that the evidence of the victim is not 'tainted' - i.e. can't be excluded by a court.
This is my huge problem with the elders getting involved in these cases. They contaminate the evidence and make things worse, retraumatize the victim and then do nothing.
Blondie
In my abuse, it was easier to understand my father's actions than my mother's allowing it and still today saying that she had to protect herself first and truly believes that is normal.
One theory I know is that the mother who was possibley abused in her childhood (mine was) and her reaction to do nothing may be related to several foctors.
The WTS adds a new angle
Chris
Yeah this is me as well. I've often wondered what these men think in the middle of the night, when no one's around and there's no game to play, really how do they justify it? Or maybe they don't. In which case, how do they live with it? Dunno.
I have only dealt with two men (in therapy) and that was enough for me. One justified it by minimizing what he did and the impact it had on his daughter, her sister and his wife. (The wife was in total denial - she sat there and heard him say what he did, really only a small part of what he did, and said it didn't happen)
The other blamed it on the victim. He said she wanted it and she seduced him.
When I confronted my father his response was "If you think I'm going to apologize, you're crazy" In my fahter's case I think he simply believed he had the right to sexually abuse me. He had no regret at all.
jwcol
My heart goes out to you. I know many families like this - abusive parent and the elders just force the family to stay toghter, more for the sake of appearances than any scriptural reason.
The elder said "why are you burdening me with this??"
that is so sick. I'm glad you all got away from him. But that fear stays with you a long time. My father told me he would kill me if he ever saw me again and I believed him.
hemp lover
I know that in my father's case, he convinced himself that the abuse cases he dealt with as an elder were isolated one-off type instances and that he was right to wait on Jehovah....each time.
Hmmm I haven't thought about what the elders thought about the accusations. I know some who have posted here have said they argued with the other elders or it made them feel sick to see the railroading. I suspect most are WT-yes-men who foillow the party line and think they have done a good job.
Thanks Kim and HL.
(((jwcol)))
I"m so sorry. Your experience with that elder reminded me of something an elder once said to me: "Jehovah is far too busy to worry about your petty little problems." Sort of sums of that sect doesn't it?
LL
My last therapist had to quit treating offenders as it was too difficult on her. She only told me once what one said to her, that he stalks his victims based on the ones who appear most vulnerable. Then from that set he selects the one child who is most good looking and happiest so that he could "wipe that smile off their face". I'll never forget that.
Of course there weren't two witnesses so it never happened. Riiiiight.
I'm coming around to thinking that talking with deniers is almost as bad. I had to kind of fight through some dissociation and big feelings after reading thirdwitness' little diatribe. It's stunning to me that an average person could be so uncaring toward a horribly injured child. Even after all my dealings with the Witnesses, there's still a part of me that's amazed. And worse still, now, is that so many in denial don't wan't to know.
Chris
Big Tex - your logic is w/o fault. The problem is that you are dealing w/ people who will turn their back on logic in the guise of religion.
I had a convo w/ a very active JW the other day. When I made the comment about the 2 witness policy, she said it was a "test" and we should "wait on Jah". Then she used an example of a man who molested his step daughter. She accused him, he said she was a slut. She got DF'd . She turned to drugs and living on the street. Fast forward, he gets remarried to a chick w/ a minor and he is caught molesting that little girl. He is DF'd and sent to jail. The active JW I was speaking with said "see, jah would not allow the uncleanness to continue". My comment was "well, really if jah were a part of this equation, he would have never allowed other little girls to be touched, because the first hint of something would have brought fire and brimstone down upon the perv." Then when I tried to cite legal cases, where there is evidence of BOE and JC's covering up allegations of abuse and threatening those who were abused, her comment to me was "I don't want to hear any of this." That was when I asked her and how would you have handled that if you found out that he molested your daughter. Her response was, I would have taken it all the way up the chain of command and if I got DF'd, then I got DF'd but it is the truth and I would have always returned to the religion, because I will not turn my back on jah because of imperfect people in his org.
In other words, JWs will always have an excuse. Just like other religions who do horrible things in the name of their faith. Sad but true. But that is why we are here and they are else where (working on their tract campaign so they can point out to people the problems with their religion)
Chris
My last therapist had to quit treating offenders as it was too difficult on her. She only told me once what one said to her, that he stalks his victims based on the ones who appear most vulnerable. Then from that set he selects the one child who is most good looking and happiest so that he could "wipe that smile off their face". I'll never forget that.
That shows just how sick and perverted abusers are.
I'm coming around to thinking that talking with deniers is almost as bad. I had to kind of fight through some dissociation and big feelings after reading thirdwitness' little diatribe.
I haven't seen this at least I don't think I have. I haven't been on the board a lot lately. But I think I'm glad I haven't seen it.
It's stunning to me that an average person could be so uncaring toward a horribly injured child. Even after all my dealings with the Witnesses, there's still a part of me that's amazed. And worse still, now, is that so many in denial don't wan't to know.
This really shows how JWs have been programmed to have "no natural affection" When I was reading your first post on the thread I was thinking how not only do they not have "natural affection" they don't have common sense either.
People don't want to know because knowing will mean a couple of serious things:
Fast forward, he gets remarried to a chick w/ a minor and he is caught molesting that little girl. He is DF'd and sent to jail. The active JW I was speaking with said "see, jah would not allow the uncleanness to continue".
This is what I was told, 18 years ago, and is one of the stupidest, most infuriating arguments I've ever heard. Like you, I pointed out that if the offender would have been stopped with his first victim, he wouldn't have had the opportunity to attack another child (and who knows how many other children that are unknown or too frightened to come forward!).
My response then was what would Jehovah, or the laws of the land, say if you knew of a crime and did nothing to stop it? Hello! Closed minds are so difficult to reason with.
Her response was, I would have taken it all the way up the chain of command and if I got DF'd, then I got DF'd but it is the truth and I would have always returned to the religion, because I will not turn my back on jah because of imperfect people in his org.
This is similar to a woman staying with a man who beats her. I pointed this out to an elder once and his response was: "Yeah I can see that. You're probably right."
ooookay.
I haven't seen this at least I don't think I have. I haven't been on the board a lot lately. But I think I'm glad I haven't seen it
You're not missing anything LL, believe me. hillary_step said something yesterday that put in focus for me when he said active Witnesses don't know how to debate; only preach. That "article" is very much like that.
This really shows how JWs have been programmed to have "no natural affection" When I was reading your first post on the thread I was thinking how not only do they not have "natural affection" they don't have common sense either.
You know one thing I'll always be grateful to this board, and the people, is it gave me some much needed perspective. I've posted here some fictional short stories (that were based on actual events) I had written way back when and the reaction was polar opposite each other. I showed a couple to Witnesses I knew and the reaction was either flat (who gives a shit) or angry. The reaction here was one of empathy and the point of the stories actually reached several people. I was totally gobsmacked at first.
And this idea is partly behind this thread, in that how sad is it to spend your life surrounded by a religious life and yet not learn the very first, very simple rule of love? Isn't that what Christianity is supposed to be all about?
Chris
Isn't that what Christianity is supposed to be all about?
Not if you are a JW. Love for "mother WTS" always comes first, even before women and children. Even the captain of the Titanic realiazed the most vulnerable needed protection before anyone or anything else
