Noah's Arc and the flood.... (page 2)

funkyderek

greendawn:

I am not an evolutionist but it is far fetched to identify the Neanderthal with the Nephilim giants, they were just a 100% human race that became extinct, despite what the evolutionists used to claim.

That's almost correct. Neanderthals were human, although they were a different species to us (not just a different "race"), which has been proven by DNA testing. The Nephilim were a mythological race mentioned in the Bible. It's unlikely that there is any correlation between the two as Neanderthals died out tens of thousands of years before the Bible was written.

Tuesday

I don't really know if this is a racist thing, more so just not going in with scientific fact. The FAQ about Noah's ark (gah I suck at spelling earlier) was a life saver, especially with dates and so forth. I like doing research, but I hate going to libraries for it LOL. I'd rather order the stuff online. In a similar vein does anyone have any links that apply the bible in historical terms (i.e. showing that the beasts used in Daniel, Revelation and so forth were illustrations for people/countries around at that time)? That might prove helpful too if I can steer this conversation correctly. And if not, I can always use it when I get the fateful knock on my door LOL.

gaiagirl

There are two lines of reasoning which indicate that the biblical story is not correct. First: the details of the Hebrew account appear to have been "borrowed" from older stories in other cultures, i.e. the rainbow was originally Ishtars necklace, which she placed in the sky after the flood. Second: Geological evidence indicates that there was a large, but still local flood when rising sea levels caused the Mediterranean to flood into the Black Sea basin, greatly enlarging what was until then, a freshwater lake, and drowning coastal villages (evidence is still visible to submersible vehicles equipped with cameras, and was featured on a PBS special). Fossils in the sediments of the Black Sea clearly show how the older freshwater life forms suddenly were replaced with saltwater types. As this event took place before writing was invented, it would be expected that survivors would pass the story down by word of mouth for many generations, until it eventually was recorded. The best discussion of the geological evidence is in the book "Noahs Flood" by William Ryan and Walter Pitman.

greendawn

Derek how were the Neanderthal a different species from the modern humans species? Did they not also have 46 chromosomes and interbreed with them?

Anthropologists now say that if a Neanderthal walked among us today s/he would go totally unnoticed for being so similar to us.

funkyderek

greendawn:

Derek how were the Neanderthal a different species from the modern humans species? Did they not also have 46 chromosomes and interbreed with them?

The significant morphological differences between Homo neanderthalis and Homo sapiens are probably enough to classify them as distinct species. Differences in mitochondrial DNA discovered in recent studies strongly suggest that Neanderthals were not ancestral to modern humans, although some interbreeding may have occurred.

Anthropologists now say that if a Neanderthal walked among us today s/he would go totally unnoticed for being so similar to us.

No they don't. At least no reputable anthropologists. There are many obvious and significant differences between the two species which would likely be noticed even by the casual observer. Compare the two skulls in the below picture: alt (That's H. neanderthalis on the left, by the way.)

Abaddon

This is a simple one, two.

1/ Dendrochronology http://www.sonic.net/bristlecone/intro.html

Earth's oldest living inhabitant "Methuselah" at 4,767 years, has lived more than a millennium longer than any other tree.

There are trees alive that were already several hundred years old when the Flood is meant to have happened.

2/ Ancient civilisations, for example, the Egyptians http://ce.eng.usf.edu/pharos/wonders/pyramid.html

The monument was built by the Egyptian pharaoh Khufu of the Fourth Dynasty around the year 2560 BC to serve as a tomb when he dies.

The Great Pyramid ay Giza is just one of many ancient monuments that pre-date Biblical dates for a Flood yet which cannot have been standing during the Flood.

Therefore the 'global' Flood wasn' global, if it is based on any real event at all, therefore the Bible isn't an accurate hsitorical record.

Just for the record, we share LOADS of DNA with H. neanderthalis, it's just not of a nature which suggests direct decent of modern man from H. neanderthalis. Best guess at this point is modern man decended from a migration of H. sapiens out of Africa which displaced evolutionary cousins who migrated out of Africa earlier and evolved specific morphology for Ice Age environments in (mostly) Europe. This displacement may have been so extensive there was no interbreeding, although there are some claims for hybridisation or (more demonstrably) at least living side-by-side for thousands of years.

In terms of appearance H.neaderthalis would have looked freaky, but MIGHT pass for human with a bobble hat on. We don't know if H. neanderthalis was 'as' human as us (i.e. speaking and thinking as us) or whether the archaic H. sap population had a major advantage because of something like 'modern' thought and syntaxitical language which the older populations of neaderthalis lacked.

Anyone who says they neanderthalis were Nephilim is probably too ignorant to bear talking too for extend periods without your own spleen strangling you...

hooberus

http://www.creationresearch.org

http://www.csfpittsburgh.org/icc.htm

http://www.answersingenesis.org

http://www.icr.org

http://www.trueorigin.org

http://naturalselection.0catch.com

skyman

Here is something else to go along with the Old tree. Why did God allow the Hobbit people to survive the Flood they wer found to have lived just a thousand years ago. They were human but not us. http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/10/1027_041027_homo_floresiensis.html

DannyBloem

ice core dating does give a reliable insight in past climatic changes (no flood to be found there)

for example: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3792209.stm

Global climate patterns stretching back 740,000 years have been confirmed by a three-kilometre-long ice core drilled from the Antarctic, Nature reports.....

hooberus

Discussion of Neanderthal DNA claims

http://www.detectingdesign.com/earlyman.html

Noah's Arc and the flood....

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