Help --Pre-JW Faithful and Discreet Slave??

by lynnmelo 28 Replies latest jw friends

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  blondie

  *** w75 10/1 p. 583 Almost 6,000 Years of Witnessing for Jehovah ***

  Amidst Christendom’s vast domain of imitation Christians, the true anointed Christians continued to remain loyal in the face of sadistic tortures and martyrdom at the hands of the Catholic priesthood. From the twelfth century C.E., the "Waldenses" in France rejected Catholic traditions in favor of adhering closely to the Bible. Many of these became martyrs. One of them said: ‘The Cross should not be prayed to but loathed as the instrument of the Just One’s death.’
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  blondie

  The WTS teaches a form of Apostolic Succession, although strangely enough denying such. In order to prove the "always existed" theory they have engaged in interesting revisionism. The WTS has put forth that groups such as the Waldenses and the Lollards were part of JW history.

  "It is quite evident that the early Waldenses were faithful Witnesses of Jehovah."
  Theocratic Aid to Kingdom Publishers pg. 307.

  (ALSO SEE WT 8/1/80 PGS24-28, WT 8/1/81 PG. 15)

  The WTS has been unable to show any real "unbroken chain" that links them to anything before C. T. Russell. This somewhat blatant fact has caused many good hearted JWs to question the entire "always existed" theory. The various unconnected groups (Waldenses, Lollards, and Anabaptists) that the WTS has used to prove the "always existed" theory, cannot substantiate the claim that the FDS was "a close-knit body" that "one generation of the slave' class fed the succeeding generation" WT 1/15/75 pgs. 46,47

  The Watchtower January 15, 1975 states:

  "Apparently one generation of the "slave" class fed the succeeding generation thereof, as well as continuing to feed themselves. We see, then that Jesus Christ himself called attention to this method of feeding his people not as isolated, independent individuals, but as a close-knit body of Christians having real love and care for one another."

  also

  http://www.jwfacts.com/index_files/slave.htm

  http://www.escapefromwatchtower.com/slave.html
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  johnny cip

  http://www.jwinfoline.com/Page/audio2.htm there is a tape on this page that addresses your subject about the fds . it's about an hour long. and this woman is great. one of the only tapes i even like listening to. she really breaks it down. i've heard it about 20 x's when you get to the link above. schroll down to the tape called "THE WHEAT AND THE WEEDS" BY JOY VEINOT. i promise you . you will not be disappointed. and she's entertaining. again the best tape i've even heard on the fds and 1919 ,who was the fds for the last 2000 years. she covers it all. enjoy john
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  bennyk

  Let's not forget our friends the 16th-century Anabaptists. I once asked an Elder why, according to JW doctrine, they've already been resurrected and are to reign with Christ in Heaven, DESPITE the fact that they believed in the Trinity, the doctrine of an immortal soul, and eternal Hellfire. (Of course, I didn't get a convincing answer: only 'they were true Christians, but still in darkness....')
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  yesidid

  Hi Johnny,

  Thanks for the tape recommendation sounds good. Do you know if there is any I could download it to a CD. I am very low tech.

  Thanks,

  yesidid
• 

  jaffacake

  Lynn

  It really must be all or nothing with this religion.

  A chapter in the Ray Franz book "In search of Christian Freedom" deals with your question - Chapter 5 - The Faithful & Discreet Slave.
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  jaffacake

  Your question is a very good one.

  Watchtower

  “Down through the years the slave-like congregation has been feeding its true members faithfully and discreetly. From Pentecost, AD 33, up to the very present hour this has been lovingly and carefully performed. Yes, and these domestics have been fed on progressive spiritual food that keeps them abreast of the “bright light that is getting lighter and lighter until the day is firmly established”. (Prov 4:18) All this has proved to be “food at the proper time” as stated by Jesus.”

  So the claim is that this faithful & discreet slave was to have a continuous uninterrupted history down through the centuries up to and including the end of the world. The congregation, through this spiritual food would become increasingly enlightened. Each century & succeeding generation passing on increased illumination. By 1870 & CT Russell, the light should have been very bright, so why did he not receive guidance from this close-knit organised & enlightened body of Christians. After all the WT says “we cannot find the Scriptural guidance outside the faithful & discreet slave organisation.”
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  Slave1111

  Hi, folks. For those who may not remember my previous posts, I'm someone who has been studying with the JW's for about two years but didn't commit (i.e., get baptized) because, as I thought then, I was just too selfish and cowardly to join up with the JW's. That's before I found this site and watched the Dateline video on the child molestation problem. Now, I realize that the JW's probably aren't God's chosen organization and the that Governing Body certainly isn't the Faithful and Discreet slave. However, I'm still intending on going to the Sunday meetings because I just don't know another church to attend (I have major disagreements with most other organized religions as well), and I still believe that the JW's are right about some things (e.g., no Hellfire, paradise earth, etc.).
  
  

  I thought that I might just be able to blend into the background of the congregation once my book study had ended, which it finally did last week when I finished the last book. Not so, though. My book study conductor asked me to meet with her one more time to "review" my concerns. I won't go into detail here, but it wasn't a great meeting. It's almost as if she took it very personally that I wasn't buying into some of the "proofs" about the existence of the F&DS (I didn't let on that I'd watched the Dateline video & some other stuff I found here because I didn't want to see her get that self-righteous, patronizing look that says, "See what apostate sites can do). A couple of times, she would say something about it being up to me to accept it and then say, "But I fear for you." In retrospect, that really ticks me off.

  Anyway, I digress. My original purpose in posting is to ask whether anyone here has any idea of the groups that the JW's sometimes point to as the "faithful and discreet slave" between the time the church turned apostate and the time when the JW's were formed. That's a question that I'd previously asked my book study conductor and that had pretty much stumped her. At this last meeting, though, she came prepared. She told me she'd spoken to an elder, and he'd told her something about a group called the Lallerites(not sure I have that right)??? I can't remember the name she gave me, but even she seemed uncomfortable with it (almost like she really didn't believe it). Does anyone have any idea what she was referring to? If so, does it have any validity?

  I could ask her, I suppose, but I really don't want to meet with her again. She asked me if we could meet just once more but this time with an Elder. I agreed at the time, but I've changed my mind now. I get the feeling that the only purpose of this next meeting is for them to come armed and try to get me to admit that they're right on certain points so that they can self-righteously claim to have done "everything they can" for me and shake their head because I just don't get it.

  Thanks!

  
  
  The W.T.S. is correct in many of their teachings but also incorrect. No one religion holds true as JAH will prove all men as liars. If it is from Jehovah, then it will come to pass is the belief. Why is it there was so many dates that proved not to be accurate? The faithful and discreet slave is born only in the end times of which we are in. Many religions lay claim to the promises of Abraham, however they still belong to Abraham and his offspring. I am offspring of Abraham out of the tribe of Levi, and I am anointed king upon the earth in subjection to Jesus Christ. The faithful and discreet slave is a living sacrifice in like manner to the first slave upon the earth, namely Jesus Christ, who was a sacrifice in death. The slave is not greater than the master and I never claim to be.

  Fellowship with those called brothers and sisters in the organization until Jesus arrives in all of his glory upon the earth, as they hold to teachings of everlasting life in paradise earth. However, never put yourself in harms way but preserve yourself alive at all costs. Jehovah only required two righteous sacrifices as slaves of JAH upon the earth. Jesus Christ as a perfect sacrifice in death and I as an imperfect sacrifice in the very end, amen....... The Faithful and Discreet Slave of JAH and CHRIST
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  truth about the last days

  Perhaps i can help. Matt 24:45 says "Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave to whom his master appointed his domestics....". This was really a question that not even Jesus knew who the were. The only way that JESUS knows is seeing the ones that are giving the "food at the proper time" apon his return. And when the "master" (Jesus) arrives, he will see as to who is doing what with his "belongings". And he will also see as to who the "evil slave" is and what they are doing.It could be some of us on this website spending most of our time indoors complaining on this site, when we could be spending time talking to others about the truth and exposing the "son of destruction" in "the temple of The God". The remaining ones of the 144,000 ARE doing the works that Jesus commissioned them, But it is the Governing Body that is being exposed as satens tool influencing all the brothers worldwide through the books and mags.The evidence is shown in the sublimminal artwork in the "Knowladge Book", "The Draw Close To Jehovah Book" and the "Live Forever Book". And publications before this had the false prophcies in- all under the Governing Body. As far as I know, there is only ONE of the 144,000 housed in Brooklin. The Watchtower is now run by the so-called "great crowd".So, the Governing body is NOT the faithful and discreet slave. As to whom the 144,000 are ,we will not know for sure.There are many professing to be part of the group. If the person dies for truth Jehovahs way, then he stands a chance to be either in heaven or earth.And it will be Jesus himself doing the choosing, and not us.Keith
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  blindersoff

  As has been pointed out on other threads, the timing of the context is at Jesus arrival as executioner (NOT 1919). That makes it a moot point who it could have been in the past. Have you considered this?

  B