To Wt apologists - this is all that mattered to me... please address

by AK - Jeff 35 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  AK - Jeff

  Forget all the other smoke. B-days, xmas, holidays. Forget doctrine issues. Trinity, hellfire, soul, death.

  The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society does not claim to be God's mouthpeice based on having all the doctrine correct. They claim to have God's blessing based on having been selected as the mouthpiece in or around 1919 CE. This is the basis of thier claims of having the 'truth', not doctrine. THe doctrines keep changing anyway, as the light 'get brighter'! In fact this religion would be virtually strange to CT Russell or even to Rutherford if they were to come back to life, due to all the doctrinal flips and flops.

  Only one issue needs to be proven -

  Please prove, without assertion, without skirting, without stepping around the question this - Please prove that the organization known today as Jehovah's Witnesses, and known in 1919 as the International Bible Students Association, was selected by Christ as the 'Faithful slave class' as they claim, due to having proven themselves to be 'dispensing food at the due time'.

  This should not be hard to do. Would God be so hapless so as to leave this question unanswerable? When Moses lead the Isrealites out of Egypt he left no doubt. Miracles abounded to prove the claim that God was using Moses. When Jesus walked miracles abounded to prove that he fulfilled the role of Messiah to the jews. Those that refused to accept that died - and will mostly be resurrected according to JW doctrine. But today those who refuse to accept the premise that Jw's are the 'ark of salvation' in this world - are by Jw doctrine damned to eternal death. That means 6 Billion will die. Would a loving God not make it clear with solid evidence that he was using a particular group? Please recognize that this is precisely what they claim, to have been selected by Christ. I just desire the proof of that assertion.

  I await. Governing Body members can feel free to contribute to the answer if they like. I will not shun you for your 'apostate acts'.

  Jeff
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  minimus

  The food was bad, wrong. Anyone eating of this food would get sick. It was really not nourishing at all. Contaminated food is always unhealthy. Unclean water is never good for you even if you're thirsty.
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  FairMind

  The proof is abundant! Simply scoure the WT publications written down through the years and you will see this point repeated thousands upon thousands of times. Also consider, would the FDS say this was true if it weren't? After all they are the FDS. Now it is excusable to not see at first glance that the appointment as God's mouthpiece came in 1919. After all the FDS itself did not understand this indisputable fact for quite a number of years. Judge Ruthefraud had this revelaed to him at the bottom of a bottle.
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  cheezy

  those who refuse to accept the premise that Jw's are the 'ark of salvation' in this world - are by Jw doctrine damned to eternal death. That means 6 Billion will die. Would a loving God not make it clear with solid evidence that he was using a particular group?

  Jeff, I agree that this is the essential question. However, there is no answer without reading an entire bookshelf full of smarmy little books with colorful bindings. And after you've read all that, it still makes no sense that God would choose such a bunch of clueless knotheads to communicate His thoughts to mankind.
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  jstalin

  Does the 1919 selection act as the sole source of authority for the GB and FDS, or are there other factors?
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  AK - Jeff

  Does the 1919 selection act as the sole source of authority for the GB and FDS, or are there other factors?

  Good question. As a 40 year veteran dub I always said that what mattered was that we had the 'truth' now. But if that is so, then how was the faithful slave properly 'feeding the domestics' in 1919? They were, other than some odd doctrine, basically in line with many of the churches they were condemning then. Later all the doctrine has changed. Why would God bless someone due to special 'knowledge' anyway? How can a relationship with God be defined by knowledge? I find it extremely interesting that I have not ever been able to get a single apologist to address this issue. Here is the claim.

  FOUNDING

  THE "NEW EARTH"

  We remember that Jehovah promised not only to plant the "new heavens" but also to "lay the foundation of the earth," that is, the "new earth." When Jesus came to God’s spiritual temple in 1918 for the purpose of judging men, Christendom was rejected. A remnant of Jesus’ anointed followers on earth passed that temple judgment and were cleansed and purified and sent forth as Jehovah’s witnesses, as visible representatives of the "new heavens." During the high point of World War I the spiritual remnant were practically silent, and they were in captivity to symbolic Babylon, Satan’s world. But in 1919 Jehovah regathered his disorganized people, increased their numbers and organized them for Kingdom preaching. What does this have to do with founding the "new earth"? The restoring of the spiritual remnant from antitypical Babylon from 1919 forward is the founding of the "new earth."

  Watchtower August 1, 1960 Page 462

  40 The serving of food, the right sort of food, at the proper time was the issue. It had to be according to this that a decision must be rendered by the returned master. Well, then, what about that body of Christians internationally hated and persecuted? (Matthew 24:9) Down to 1919 C.E. they had endeavored to give "food at the proper time" to the "household of faith" or the "domestics" of the heavenly Master. They did this despite interference by persecutors and the warring nations. Not only was the regularity in serving the spiritual food a problem, but the quality of the food itself was to be considered. In this respect the body of hated, persecuted Christians, who always sought to be faithful slaves of Jesus Christ, met the test. During the years of the world conflict they had not joined Christendom or pagandom in preaching the war propaganda submitted by the political governments. They persisted in preaching the Bible message for the time and in advocating a Christian adherence to Bible principles for everybody.

  41

  What, then, did the heavenly Master decide regarding these obedient slaves of his? He was not influenced by their unpopular, persecuted position in the war-mad world, for he had foretold such a hard experience for them during his invisible parousia or "presence." Did he find that body of Christian slaves disregarding the unpopularity of the world and seeking to be pleasing to their Master by doing what he had appointed to be done during his absence? He must have found them so, according to the way the inspection, begun in 1919, has affected his decision since. His actions, his dealings with his Christian slaves, speak louder than words.

  God's Kingdom of a Thousand Year Has Approached 1973 Page 350
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  MerryMagdalene

  For me this teaching that they were chosen by Jesus way back when itself hinges on proving that Christ actually came invisibly and that they were not among those false prophets who were declaring when he would come (no one was supposed to know ahead of time) or that he had already come unbeknownst to the majority of people (since he said his parousia would be obvious to everyone). Is there a non-circular answer for that?

  ~Merry
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  Poztate

  And after you've read all that, it still makes no sense that God would choose such a bunch of clueless knotheads to communicate His thoughts to mankind.

  You are being far too kind to them
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  greendawn

  That claim of being chosen by Christ to be over all his belongings and dispense spiritual food to the world is nothing but a spider web of deception to catch the naive and the ignorant. It sounds authoritative and has a lot of impact but their history belies this heavy sounding grandiose claim.
  
  They don't even know what to be spirit inspired means and they muddle the definition of it. They gave the world a "truth" that can not be from God because it keeps shifting and changing whereas God's truth is eternal and stable.
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  MegaDude

  The JWs are fond of saying, Jehovah has always had an organization. To which I respond, Jehovah has always destroyed his organization. How many times were the Jews or Israel decimated by God in the Bible? The typical JW cannot refute this and will look befuddled when you say this.

  Jesus was raised in Jehovah's organization, which murdered him. If anything, the Bible proves Jehovah having an organization doesn't work. If Jehovah could have rehabiliated his so-called orginal organization, Israel would still be his chosen people. Does the point need to be proven again in our time? Doesn't make sense even if you believe the Bible.