Comments You Will Not Hear at the 12-11-05 WT Study (Walk/God)

by blondie 19 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  SadElder

  Blondie, this happens to be my favorite scripture. They've missed the point by taking a snippet of the verse for their platform pablum of a sound bite.

  "He has told you, O earthling man, what is good. And what is Jehovah asking back from you but to exercise justice and to love kindness and to be modest in walking with your God?" NWT

  or this slant from another:

  "But he's already made it plain how to live, what to do, what GOD is looking for in men and women. It's quite simple: Do what is fair and just to your neighbor, be compassionate and loyal in your love, And don't take yourself too seriously-- take God seriously." (The Message)

  This one verse if practiced in one's daily life is the embodiment of what Christ taught. The Borg continues to proffer more rules, followed by interpretations of the rules, and then secret rules told only to elders for enforcement of the rules. Is it any wonder that the sheep wander about in sadness instead of with joyous hearts?

  It's this uncaring attitude that led first to my resigantion as an elder and then my fade.
• 

  heathen

  The first pair assumed the
  
  right to determine for themselves what is good and what is bad. (Genesis 3:1-6)
  
  That right simply "does not belong" to us.

  Ok ok you win , you don't know the difference between good a bad . I love this, now watch the tower try and exsplain the difference after stating we don't have the right . Unquestioning obedience to publishing corporation = good,anything else =bad .

  Who the hell says you can't literally walk with God? Did not God literally walk through the garden when adam and eve had sinned ? doesn't the tower believe that jesus has returned to the clouds ? He may be miles above but still can walk with people . Boy these people are really screwed up .
• 

  yaddayadda

  Is the WTS teaching the Trinity--then we are following in Christ's footsteps...as a result we are walking with God.

  So we need to believe in the Trinity to follow in Christ's footsteps? COBBLERS!
• 

  cyber-sista

  For example, we would not even consider engaging in wrongdoing and
  
  then try to hide our sins from Christian elders or family members.

  This is a prompt to weed out any who are hiding "secret sins" and make them feel guilty. So if an adult of legal age does something of question the first thing it is required to do is to run to the elders and turn yourself in. (Mostly speaking of sexual nature, I'm sure) the WT leaders seems to get off on hearing all the nitty gritty on its members intimate personal lives.

  thanks blondie, cybs
• 

  stillajwexelder

  Sorry all - I played Theocratic Warfare Strategy today and answered up on how important it was to recognize the salve and that was walking with God - got to play them at their own game
• 

  heathen

  Stilla --- Why don't they just come out and say " we are your God ?" Just think of all that holy spirit they carry around in them book bags ..... It's obvious they are now trying to replace God and not just jesus the mediator . I am so glad I don't have to sit through this dogmatic load of tripe .
• 

  Pistoff

  What is meant by “some years ago” on page 170, paragraph two, in the “organization” book?

  This indicates more than a year or two. It may be noted that it did not say “many years ago.” So it is not an exact number of years, but more like two or three years. It was not intended to have a brother go back into the distant past to bring up wrongs of which he repented years ago and that have evidently been forgiven by Jehovah and are not being practiced now. In many cases the wrongs occurred prior to the time when the “watchtower” drew attention to what the Scriptures say on such misconduct.

  If a brother has been serving faithfully for some years and has seen evidence of Jehovah’s blessings upon him, why should he now step down from office? If he has a right viewpoint now on conduct and will give good counsel he should be able to continue to serve. If the local body of elders see that he has the respect of the congregation and has shown the proper qualifications over the last two or three years, he may remain in his position of service. .

  Must wrongdoing be brought to public attention after many years? The book (page 168) under “Public Reproof” quotes 1 Timothy 5:20 and mentions reproof of those who confess to committing more than one offense. But it really has to do with recent events. The “Interlinear” refers to those “sinning,” something going on at the time. So if repentance occurred some years ago, three years ago or more, and sinning ceased, and he is respected by the congregation, it is not necessary now to publicly reprove one who committed more than one offense “some years ago.”

  For example, we would not even consider engaging in wrongdoing and
  
  
  
  

  SO: the message as these two conflicting articles lays out--if you are an elder, as long as you let 3 years (or is it 2? 2-3?) you do NOT have to tell the other elders about it; hell, you don't even have to step DOWN from being an elder or MS.

  IT PAYS TO BE IN POWER AND CONTROL.
• 

  Flash

  4...Jehovah has given humans free will, and he wants us to use that gift along with our own
  "power of reason." (Romans 12:1)

  Power of Reason = Critical Thinking.

  6...Those who insist on going their own way, independent of God, make the same mistake that Adam and Eve made.

  "Independent of God" is not to be confused with or equated to independence from others who assume to know better than we ourselves how we should live our lives and enjoying correctly the full freedom given us by God.

  11...In a spiritual sense, Jehovah's rebellious people in Israel needed to do something similar. They needed to find their way back to "the roadways of long ago." That "good way" was the way in which their faithful forefathers had walked, the way from which the nation had foolishly strayed.

  Perhaps if they didn't follow their Spiritual leaders in their error they wouldn't have had God's wrath upon them.

  12 Since late in the 19th century, Christ's anointed followers have applied the counsel of Jeremiah 6:16 to themselves. As a class, they have led the way in a wholehearted return to "the roadways of long ago."

  A clear turn was made from "Judge" Rutherford onward when the Evil Slave Class began to rule and 'Lord it over' the congregation.

  12...To this day, the anointed help one another as well as their "other sheep" companions to pursue the healthful, happy way of life that Christendom has abandoned. John 10:16.

  Those who are like Nicodemus do, but they have limited power.

  16..."Studying Jesus' life course" -- how when 99% of the WTS publications push Jehovah and OT examples?

  Absolutely!! .................................................... Thanks Blondie
• 

  blondie

  Hi Serendipity,

  Women were not valued for much beyond their wombs, and it's only exceptional ones that were mentioned in any significant manner.

  My favorites

  Abigail

  Deborah

  Huldah

  Jael

  Did you notice the names of “evil” women and goddesses in that list?

  Hello, tjik,

  What can you say about an organization that still thinks spanking a crying baby is the way to get them to “stop” crying?

  Thanks for not sharing the “f” names. If anyone every watched Seven Brides for Seven Brothers, the brohers were given Bible names alphabetically, the six brother had to be named Frank(incense) because there were not “f” names.

  Zeroday , do you remember what the congregation publisher quotas were until about 1971?

  10 hours

  12 magazines

  6 backcalls (rvs)

  1 bible study

  Good day, jgnat,

  Why the apostrophes for "reason"?

  I think that is one of those obnoxious snippets

  along with our own "power of reason." (Romans 12:1)

  (Romans 12:1) Consequently I entreat YOU by the compassions of God, brothers, to present YOUR bodies a sacrifice living, holy, acceptable to God, a sacred service with YOUR power of reason.

  Surely the Watchtower Society never intended to resurrect the Catholic confessional with the penances, purgatory, and penalties?

  It dances around that one.

  *** w01 6/1 pp. 30-31 Questions From Readers

  In view of Jehovah’s willingness to forgive sins by the merit of the ransom sacrifice, why is it necessary for Christians to confess to the older men in the congregation?

  As can be seen in the case of David and Bath-sheba, Jehovah forgave David’s sin, grave though it was, because of David’s genuine repentance. When the prophet Nathan approached him, David openly confessed: “I have sinned against Jehovah.”—2 Samuel 12:13.

  However, Jehovah not only accepts a sinner’s sincere confession and extends forgiveness but he also makes loving provisions to help the erring one progress to spiritual recovery. In David’s case, the help came through the prophet Nathan. Today, in the Christian congregation, there are spiritually mature older men, or elders. The disciple James explains: “Is there anyone [spiritually] sick among you? Let him call the older men of the congregation to him, and let them pray over him, greasing him with oil in the name of Jehovah. And the prayer of faith will make the indisposed one well, and Jehovah will raise him up. Also, if he has committed sins, it will be forgiven him.”—James 5:14, 15.

  Skillful elders can do much to ease the pain of heart that is felt by the remorseful sinner. They strive to imitate Jehovah in their dealings with him. They never want to be harsh, even though strong discipline may

  be warranted. Rather, they compassionately consider the immediate needs of the individual. Patiently they strive to readjust the erring one’s thinking by using God’s Word. (Galatians 6:1) Even if a person does not voluntarily confess his sin, he may still be moved to repentance when approached by the elders, as David was when approached by Nathan. The support thus rendered by the elders helps the erring one to avoid the danger of repeating the sin and the serious consequences of becoming a hardened practicer of sin.—Hebrews 10:26-31.

  It is certainly not easy to confess to others deeds that one feels ashamed of and to seek forgiveness. It takes inner strength. Reflect for a moment, though, on the alternative. One man who failed to reveal his serious sin to the elders in the congregation said: “I felt a pain in my heart that would not go away. I increased my efforts in the preaching work, but the sickening feeling remained.” He felt that confession to God in prayer was enough, but clearly it was not, for he experienced feelings similar to King David’s. (Psalm 51:8, 11) How much better to accept the loving assistance that Jehovah provides through the elders!

  Right, peacefulpete, the WTS says that repetition is good.

  Very good, pistoff,

  Sinning: Go your way and sin no more?

  Or go to the elders, who will want all the details?

  Titles: All you are brothers; call no man teacher?

  Or: elder, CO, DO, Judicial committee etc etc FAITHFUL AND DISCREET SLAVE.

  Jesus walked with sinners: being seen with a DF'd one will get you thrown out today.

  Rules: Jesus said just 2 laws; today the elders must find out from a young sinner if he touched the breasts repeatedly, through the clothes or not, and if he did so with greediness.

  With just one reference to Jesus, the WT has invalidated their entire existence and their method

  That’s why they are called “Jehovah’s” witnesses not Christians or Jesus’ Witnesses (that one’s take I think).

  Hi SadElder,

  Blondie, this happens to be my favorite scripture. They've missed the point by taking a snippet of the verse for their platform pablum of a sound bite.

  Isn’t that the point of snippets to direct attention away from the real meaning and to the WTS meaning?

  Rules make the Bible invalid; who needs the Bible when you have WT publications to guide you?

  The Borg continues to proffer more rules, followed by interpretations of the rules, and then secret rules told only to elders for enforcement of the rules. Is it any wonder that the sheep wander about in sadness instead of with joyous hearts?

  Heathen , you got the equation.

  Unquestioning obedience to publishing corporation = good,anything else =bad .

  Yadda , the WTS writes Jesus out of the script and puts in God. Jesus becomes an impersonal object rather than someone to really draw close to.

  Cyber,

  So if an adult of legal age does something of question the first thing it is required to do is to run to the elders and turn yourself in. (Mostly speaking of sexual nature, I'm sure) the WT leaders seems to get off on hearing all the nitty gritty on its members intimate personal lives.

  Only the perverts. I know of some elders who get tired of people running to them with every little sin they make and every little sin they think others make.

  Stilla,

  They do teach the only way to God is through the slave (or salve) not Jesus. And they don’t get it because it has been ingrained in the rank and file for so many years.

  Thanks for that quote, pistoff. One to save for a future time.

  Thanks, flash,

  Perhaps if they didn't follow their Spiritual leaders in their error they wouldn't have had God's wrath upon them

  .

  Exactly.

  Thanks everyone for your wonderful comments and insight. Better than any WT study ever.

  Love, Blondie
• 

  SadElder

  BTW Blondie remember when the "quota" was 12 hours?

  Anybody aroiund that remembers what they called literature placements in the 30's and 40's?