Flood Legends "Proof" of Global Flood...

by AlanF 61 Replies latest jw friends

  • AlanF
    AlanF

    The March 1, 2002 Watchtower contains a couple of articles on Noah's Flood and the application of this legend to "our day". Thrust of the articles is first to show that the Flood was a real, earthwide event, and then to scare ignorant readers into accepting the JW message by claiming that our world is about to undergo a similar divine punishment. Pretty standard fare for long time JW observers.

    In the past the Watchtower Society has published extensive material purporting to show that a global Flood occurred a few thousand years ago. Over the years a great deal of unassailable geological information has appeared that proves that a global Flood could not have so occurred, and therefore that the Society's claims are nonsense. The only thing that cannot be definitively used to disprove the claim of a global Flood is that old saw that there are lots of Flood legends in various cultures around the world, and so, during the last few years the Society has grasped mostly at this straw to salvage its notions about the Flood. The main reason that legends cannot be used to disprove that Noah's Flood occurred is obvious: legends are by nature not generally susceptible to disproof. I cannot prove that that unicorns had no influence on the ancient Greeks.

    Here follows the text of the Society's latest discussion on the Flood, from the above-mentioned Watchtower, pages 4-5. Speaking of the Genesis account of the Flood, the article says:

    Is that record correct? Did such a thing really happen? Was there really an ancient world before the present one that flourished and was then destoyed? If so, why did it end? What went wrong? And is there any lesson that we can draw from its demise?

    Was an Ancient World Really Destroyed?

    Such an awesome catastrophe, if it really happened, would never have been completely forgotten. Hence, in many nations there are reminders of that destruction. Consider, for example, the precise date recorded in the Scriptures. The second month of the ancient calendar ran from what we now call mid-October to mid-November. So the 17th day corresponds approximately to the first of November. It may not be a coincidence, then, that in many lands, festivals for the dead are celebrated at that time of year.

    Other evidences of the Deluge linger in mankind's traditions. Practically all ancient peoples have a legend that their ancestors survived a global flood. African Pygmies, European Celts, South American Incas -- all have similar legends, as do peoples of Alaska, Australia, China, India, Lithuania, Mexico, Micronesia, New Zealand, and parts of North America, to mention only a few.

    Of course, over time the legends have been embellished, but they all include several details indicating a common source narrative: God was angered by mankind's wickedness. He brought a great flood. Mankind as a whole was destroyed. A few righteous ones, however, were preserved. These built a vessel in which humans and animals were saved. In time, birds were sent out to search for dry land. Finally, the vessel came to rest on a mountain. Upon disembarking, the survivors offered a sacrifice.

    What does this prove? The similarities cannot possibly be coincidental. The combined evidence of these legends corroborates the Bible's ancient testimony that all humans descend from the survivors of a flood that destroyed a world of mankind. Hence, we do not need to rely on legends or myths to know what happened. We have the carefully preserved record in the Hebrew Scriptures of the Bible. -- Genesis, chapters 6-8.

    The Bible contains an inspired record of history extending back to the dawn of life. Evidence proves that it is more than mere history, however. Its unfailing prophecy and deep wisdom demonstrate that it is what it claims to be -- God's communication to mankind. Unlike myths, the Bible includes names and dates as well as genealogical and geographical details in its historical accounts. It gives us a picture of what life was like before the Flood and reveals why a whole world came to a sudden end.

    What went wrong with that antediluvian society? The following article considers that question. It is an important question for those who may wonder just how secure the future of our present civilization is.

    The above article contains many fallacies, as the astute reader can see. Let's look at some of them, line by line:

    Such an awesome catastrophe, if it really happened, would never have been completely forgotten.
    This is a good example of how the Society's writers use certain words to hedge their statements so as to give a wrong impression to readers. The writer says that the Flood "would never have been completely forgotten". That means that if the writer can find even a single instance of a Flood legend, then his statement is correct, and by implication, "such an awesome catastrophe" must have "really happened".

    But does the fact that the statement is correct prove much of anything? Not at all. For one thing, really cool stories tend to propagate. The Flood legend is a particularly entertaining and frightening story. Relatively recent history demonstrates how early explorers from the 15th-century onward related some of their favorite stories to various peoples and tribes with whom they came in contact, and then later explorers found that the stories had been changed somewhat and incorporated into the local body of lore. They were astounded to find that certain stories were "common" to their own culture and to that of the "primitives" they met.

    The history of Egypt is a good example that strongly tends to disprove the Society's claims. Recorded Egyptian history goes back to at least 3500 B.C.E. -- more than a thousand years earlier than the supposed "biblical date" for the Flood. And because fully functioning civilizations able to make written records, like Egypt, don't spring full-blown from nothing, it is obvious that Egypt must have functioned as a society for hundreds of years longer than that. Since Egptian history is continuous right through the time when a global Flood supposedly occurred, such a Flood obviously did not occur.

    A particularly important exception to the Society's 'rule' about legends is that the Egytians have no Flood legend at all. One would expect that a major civilization right there in the Middle East would have a Flood legend, "if it really happened".

    Hence, in many nations there are reminders of that destruction.
    Since the Society's premise is not proved, the use of "hence" here is inappropriate.

    Consider, for example, the precise date recorded in the Scriptures. The second month of the ancient calendar ran from what we now call mid-October to mid-November. So the 17th day corresponds approximately to the first of November. It may not be a coincidence, then, that in many lands, festivals for the dead are celebrated at that time of year.
    Using the phrase "it may not be a coincidence" might convince JW readers, but not someone capable of thinking. The fact is that "festivals for the dead" are celebrated at all times of the year in various cultures, so the Society's argument is meaningless. There is also an internal flaw in that argument. If Noah and his family were so faithful to God that they alone survived the Flood, then they would not have remembered with fondness those who died in the Flood. Indeed, they would have remembered the destruction with happiness, just as Jehovah's Witnesses today are taught to look with happiness on the "coming destruction" of our civilization. Most festivals for the dead honor the dead, and so if any such festivals arose after the Flood, they can hardly have been connected to a remembrance of the Flood.

    Other evidences of the Deluge linger in mankind's traditions. Practically all ancient peoples have a legend that their ancestors survived a global flood. African Pygmies, European Celts, South American Incas -- all have similar legends, as do peoples of Alaska, Australia, China, India, Lithuania, Mexico, Micronesia, New Zealand, and parts of North America, to mention only a few.
    This is meaningless. As I said above, particularly entertaining or frightening legends propagate easily from culture to culture. We know today that there was extensive trade among various civilizations in the ancient Middle East, the Mediterranean area, Persia and India and the surrounding areas, and even China. Why would it be surprising if some legends were traded along with physical goods?

    What does this prove? The similarities cannot possibly be coincidental.
    Likely the similarities come from propagation of one particular legend, not from some common remembrance of an ancient event. The Society's poor argumentation skills is very evident here because they neglect to consider these possibilities. That this neglect is deliberate is easy to prove: The Society is well aware of the criticisms that have been published of views like its own. These views are not unique to the Society, for they are common in the literature of Fundamentalists going at least back to the 19th century.

    The combined evidence of these legends corroborates the Bible's ancient testimony that all humans descend from the survivors of a flood that destroyed a world of mankind. Hence, we do not need to rely on legends or myths to know what happened. We have the carefully preserved record in the Hebrew Scriptures of the Bible. -- Genesis, chapters 6-8.
    The above is a wonderful example of lousy reasoning. The first sentence says that the many legends corroborate the Bible's account of the Flood. This would indicate to a reader that the Bible is therefore supported by the legends. But the very next sentence negates the value of this support completely: "Hence, we do not need to rely on legends..." What? Why show that legends support the Bible if the Bible is so reliable that we don't need legends to support it? Naturally, the JW readers for whom this nonsense is intended are too intellectually beaten down to notice such blatantly ridiculous reasoning.

    I'll leave the finding of other flaws in the WT article to other readers. For a more extensive treatment of why Flood legends are meaningless in proving the historical reality of a global Flood, see the section "Flood Legends" of the essay "The Flood" here: http://www.geocities.com/osarsif/flood20.htm .

    AlanF

  • expatbrit
    expatbrit

    Incredible how the Watchtower not only grasps at straws but then twists them too.

    I remember an elder giving a public talk expounding at some length on why it is no coincidence that Rememberance Day is in early November, since it is a festival of the dead, and this corroborates the bible's account of the flood.

    The fact that the armistice happened to be signed on November 11 appeared to escape him.

    Oh, of course, that's all part of Satan's dastardly deception.

    Expatbrit

  • Satanus
    Satanus

    Thanks Alan

    It's funny the wt doesn't treat the trinity idea the same way. There are many divine trinities scattered throughout ancient and more modern myth and legend. Using the wt's above reasoning, this would prove christendom is right.

    SS

  • uncle jimbo
    uncle jimbo

    Hi alan-

    Right on. did you catch the matrix of flood legends in the article. They took a probably not-so random sampling of 14 flood legends and compared them across 10 different metrics (stuff like "Lengend includes a boat", "legend includes divine warning", "legend includes lots of water, etc"). So, they had a 14 x 10 element matrix. If the legend had the metric element, it got an "X", if not it was blank.

    Not that many "X's" in the matrix. WT analyzed across rows (how many metrics did each legend have). But, the more interesting would have been vertical analysis of the columns.

    The ONLY THING they virtually all agreed on were a lot of people died and that divine warning was given. Considering these are fairy tales from ancient, superstitious aboriginal cultures, the second item is meaningless.

    None of the other ten metrics (boat involved, god pissed at wickedness, sacrifice offered, etc.) had more than 2/3 of flood legends agreeing, while most were 1/3 - 1/2.

    Considering most of the metrics were things common to most aboriginal, ancient stories in general, and that the WT made the criteria for filling in the matrix elements (no source was cited, so I assume some brainiac in writing did it), you would think the matrix would have been fuller.

    uncy

  • uncle jimbo
    uncle jimbo

    thanks for your analysis of the language too.

  • Simon
    Simon

    yes, floods are not exaclty 'rare occurences' in a lot of places in the world so naturally, lots of places have some stories surrounding them.

    The fact that they are all so different tends to indicate that they are not describing the same event. Of course, the WTS will say they have many similarities ... such as water being involved, LOL.

    Even if they are around the same time it makes sense that they would be around the rainy season instead of mid summer!

  • Seeker
    Seeker
    The similarities cannot possibly be coincidental.

    Inigo Montoya to the WTS: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

  • TR
    TR

    This topic makes me wonder why the WTS hasn't expounded on the historical legends of "Bigfoot", what, with all the legends and so on.

    TR

    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    --Benjamin Franklin, 1759

  • Fredhall
    Fredhall

    Hey AlanF,

    I thought you was to smart to read the Watchtower.

  • AlanF
    AlanF

    No, Fridolin, I go slumming in the intellectual wasteland regularly. That's how I keep up with folks like you.

    AlanF

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit