by Gadget 33 Replies latest watchtower scandals
A few might remember that I arranged to meet with the elders for a chat, and I hoped it might let me get off a bit steam.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/9/76574/1.ashx
It went great! I thought it did anyway. We covered quite a few subjects and they seemed quite uncomfortable, lol. You can read the transcript at
http://www.sassquatch.com/gadget/GadgetsElderVisit.doc
Tell me what you think!
You did good gadget , you spoke calm ,straight to the point. But when all was said and done before the chit chat, as i read the ending they still just don't get it do they. I love your reply of the old light.
How do you think you did?
i think those elders were off their heads, totally one track mind, anything to 'get you back'... selling the party line...
17,000 apostate sites, as if! and if there were, then that just backs up your point about how many people must leave the org, if there are 17,000 sites just for apostates and only one for jw's... the math speaks for itself, hahaha!
they even think the UN official site publishes lies... if that's the case why the hell did they become an ngo in the first place!
'we're not perfect, but we are better than everyone else so buy our brand' - liked the better of two evils analogy! give it to them
'we are gods channel but we make mistakes'
'the light keeps on getting brighter'
'people digging up what russel said 100 years ago' making out as if it doesn't matter. god they are so full of it.
it sounds like the sort of thing jws say though, anything bad that happens cannot be the fault of the society, it's always an 'isolated incident' or 'individual case'
when they asked you whether you thought the society intentionally did this stuff, cover ups etc, you should have said 'no less than the catholics do' i wonder what they would have said!
anyway, i will probably post on here again in more detail, but great to see so many points put across to them, and hope you got it all off your chest!
Interesting read Gadget!!!
Couldn't help but notice the impressions of websites is that unless is comes from the "approved JW site" they are all apostate!!! I guess it is a canned response the elders are told to say to discourage any real research on your computer!!!
Codeblue
Everytime I read a transcript of a meeting with elders it gives me a headache.
Nothing agains you Gadget. You did a fine job. You held your ground and didn't get flustered or anything like that. But at the same time, you didn't make a dent in them either. They left with the same opinion of you, if not worse, than when they came in. Not that anyone can expect anything different from a conversation with elders like that. They're brainwashed. If they ever come around, it will take a series of events to wake them up.
But as I said before, those things give me a headache. They don't let you finish a thought, they interupt, they change subjects, they beat around the bush, they know everything and you know nothing. It's like being a Bush supporter on Bill Maher's HBO show. You ain't gonna get to explain yourself or finish your point.
If I've learned anything about these situations, it's best to pick one subject and beat it to death. Don't let em jump around or create red herring arguments. They usually come in thinking they know everything, then let them answer everything they think they know about one subject at a time and don't let them get out of it. When they try to change the subject, remind them that you aren't satisfied with answers to the first question yet. I've learned to stick with things that are in print by the WTS themselves. Changes in doctrine, failed dates and prophecies. The UN/NGO scandal. Personal experiences or he said/she said issues usually just cloud the doctrinal issues. They'll claim imperfection on those cases and plead you to not blame Jehovah. If you can use the WTS own words against them, they have no argument. Of course, it'll end up just as all meeting with elders end up, them looking down on you as inferior and led astray by apostate thinking.
Gadget,
I read the transcript... all I can say is - you gots guts!
All while reading this I was asking myself if I would be able to do something like this. I don't think so. I tend to tell people like that where to go - (not much patience, I suppose)
The thing that I notice is that they always seem to have a fella 'outnumbered' - with two against one.
That, in itself - makes it difficult to 'pin' them down.
Regards,
Jim TX
Great read Gadget!!! I especially like the line about how you didnt have to search for faults, you ended up tripping all over them :)
Also, at 35,000 newly baptized people a week, that makes about 1,820,000 new witness a year according to their info. You're right, there's NO WAY their numbers add up. You did a great job. You should be proud of the way you handled yourself. I'm still waiting for the video ;)
*muah*
Oh... with regards to how many JWs are baptized per week... I dunno statistics... but here is a cute little web-site 'clock' that supposedly shows the increases in religions. (it is hosted on a Mormon web site...)
http://www.gatheringofisrael.com/gospelclock/gospelclock2002.html
Notice how slowly the JW numbers click. hahahahahaha
Regards,
Jim TX
Elder 1 ? Well several weeks after Paranama had to read out an apology for misleading the public. What they had done is taken a situation and edited it in such a way as to make it sound bad. Gadget ? I don?t know anything about that story. Elder 1 ? The British Broadcasting Standards Agency said they had totally misrepresented the facts and it turned out that the editor of the actual programme was someone, it was a woman actually, that was absolutely nuts against witnesses and thought this was one way that she could have a real go, but she was forced to read out an apology because the facts were really a mess?.
I believe I know what the elder was talking about. The WTS went to a government organization that watches over the media to ensure accurate reporting and complained about the program. The government reviewed all of the information and found one small discrepancy in the report... nothing that would affect the substance of the report.
Does anyone remember this or know where a copy can be found?
Thanks everyone!
I was so nervous just before they got here, and when we were just havingg chit chat, but once they started talking religion and I made one or two points I got much more confident, and towards the end I was starting to enjoy myself! Afterwards I wasn't too sure how I'd got on, but when I watched my video again I was really pleased with how well I done!
I thought the bit about 17,000 apostate websites was interesting. Considering all the hits you get when you put jw into google he might be right, and if so does this mean its an admission that the watchtower does actually keep tracks of/moniter apostate sites?
And chevvy, I wish I'd realised that 35,000 a week adds up to 1.8 million a year, his face would have been brilliant!
