by LadyBug 41 Replies latest jw friends
The Holy spirit does not appoint the elders in the same way that no Holy Spirit appointed Russell and all the other old nutheads that have been members of the GB since then.
All the GB members arn't worth the dust the wind blows on their wrinky face......
Ciao
Gianluca
I suppose the ones that turn bad can be all placed under the "Jesus chose JUDAS and HE turned bad didnt he?" theory of bad elder choices.
What the Holy Spirit does and what organized religions do are often two different things.
THEN: Yes, as a JW, I accepted the concept that by living as a mature Christian, meeting the standards set out in Timothy and Titus, I was functioning according to the operation of Holy Spirit. The organizatonal official recognition of that by appointment was a mere confirmation of what had already taken place. The WTS Organized book pretty much lays it out that way.
NOW: I have totally removed from my beliefs the concept of any official church government appointments as correlating to the operation of Holy Spirit. I now believe that when either male or female Christians attain maturity and live by the standards set out in the Bible, that God, via Holy Spirit will cause other Christians in need, whether new Christians, sick Christians, or others in need, to look to those who are elder or mature in thier behavior and spirit.
Absolutely NO organizational or church government recognition is needed, wanted, or desirable. All we need in the Christian faith are those who have faith and do their best. God takes care of the rest. There is NO Biblical basis for any form of Church government and institutionalization of Elders, or others. That is one of the serious myths pushed off on many people today, whether they are Jehovah's Witnesses or not.
In spite of this disconnect between church government and the Holy Spirit, most Christian denominations do quite well in keeping abuse in check. The Jehovah's Witness religion is guilty of waste, fraud, and abuse of this basic Christian function, and they have no business being in the business of having a Church government. - Amazing
I'm with YOU Amazing. The relationship between God and man is direct. He is our father, we are his children. And as such we need no intervening organization of men.
As noted, all who are lead by the spirit of God are the children of God.
Knowing that, how can anyone think we are in need of an organization to intervene for us with God? Did we need a third party to intervene for us with our earthly fathers?
Simple as that.
Francois
I find the topic of the Holy Spirit interesting because I never felt it or witnessed it as an elder. It's one of the nebulous things talked about as Witnesses, but who really felt it? The fact is, if any JW claimed they personally felt the Holy Spirit, other Witnesses would accuse them of "running ahead of the organization." Can you imagine a Witness giving a talk in the TMS saying, "The Holy Spirit directed me to the following conclusions on this topic?" A JW saying that would be in the back library with the elders before they could mark 3 "W"s on the Counsel Sheet.
Holy Spirit should be called Holy Smoke by the Witnesses; it's a term used to cloud the idea of a publishing firm acting like God.
G'day all,
My own experience is that the elders don't see themselves as being appointed by H.S. It's the Watchtower magazine and the talks at assemblies where this is heard. It seems the Borg is trying to convince the local elders that they are special!
I can recall asking the question at Bethel: How can an elder be appointed by H.S. when we disfellowship him the next week? (Yep, it happened...here in the good old country of Oz)
Cheers,
Ozzie
Freedom is not having to wear a tie.
A CO once told us (a group of pioneers) about an experience he had had. A couple of elders took a dislike to one of the brothers in the congregation, so they concocted evidence to disfellowship him. The brother appealed the decision, and patiently attended all the meetings, preparing his WTs etc. I am not sure of the exact steps, but eventually the CO was one of the ones called to fix the problem. The result was that the entire body of elders was disfellowshipped.The Co told us this when he was encouraging us to "wait on Jehovah" to put matters straight, not to deny that the elders were chosen by holy spirit.
esther
you asked:
Any of you who are ex elders, did you really believe you were appointed by holy spirit?
how about ex-servant? its really amazing. simply amazing. no, i have not felt that god used holy spirit to appoint me as an m.s. that became evident after i saw the church politics when i was a servant. my becoming aware of it, that it wasnt holy spirit, but just men campaining to get who they wanted, in the positions they wanted, subcontiously, i knew it. that and other factors that did not become clear untill very recently, cause this m.s. to resign. that was over 10 years ago. wanna know how many sheparding calls i get to get me back in the ranks? nope, aint fallen for it yet.
__
zev
Now feeling the pain of sitting on the pickets class.
Hello BEW, Interesting question. I pose another.
How the hell do you recognise holy spirit???!
I agree: There are often hidden motives, or kickbacks for friends.
There was a saying in my old congregation: Elders kids were the most rebellious. Hey, I was one of them!
What part of Oz do you call home?
The Schmoly Schpirit appointed me a Watchtower elder.
Izzat the same thing you were asking?
Hey BugEyeWife... Bug's a Kool Dude!
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