I'm a Non-JW looking to ask a few questions re dfing

by RocketQueen 19 Replies latest jw friends

  • RocketQueen
    RocketQueen

    Someone close to me has been brought up as a JW since a very early age. He's now looking to exit. He was baptised as a teen and is now early 20s. His family have said that if he were to leave and then be seen to do ungodly things e.g. have a girlfriend (!?!?!?) then he would be disfellowshipped and they would no longer be able to speak to him.

    I guess what I want to ask is that how would he get disfellowshipped? Who would tell the elders that he had a girlfriend? Would his family do that to him, knowing he would be df'd? I'm a bit lost with it all tbh!!!

    Why can't they just let him leave and continue to be his family?

  • konceptual99
    konceptual99

    Hi RocketQueen.

    Because it's basically a cult that uses coercive techniques to keep people within the structure.

    If he were to have a girlfriend who was not a witness then eventually it would be assumed that he was sleeping with her. This constitutes "fornication" which, if practiced unrepentantly, would lead to his disfellowshipping as a person willingly committing a "gross sin". Disfellowshipped persons should not even be greeted in the street.

    The organisation promotes loyalty to God and his standards (i.e. their interpretation of them) by equating loyalty to the organisation as loyalty to God. Families are put in the difficult position of having to choose association with a DFed person or risk their own status as an approved person in the organisation.

    Disfellowshipping is promoted as a positive thing which can help one to want to return to the fold. Compromising on association with a DFed person is seen as undermining the disciplinary process and disloyalty to Jehovah and his organisation.

    Even if your friend tries to tread a fine balance and avoid being accused of a gross sin, his behaviour would be perceived as not meeting the mark and individuals, including member of his own family, may choose to shun him or minimise their association.

    Your friend can just leave and avoid contact with the Witnesses ("fade") but at some point any "sinful" actions may catch up with him and he could end up being disfellowshipped. Having said that, as a single and young person this is far more achievable than for those even more ingrained in the structure and those with families.

    Hope that helps a little!

  • RocketQueen
    RocketQueen

    It's all so frustrating. I've used this forum before (as MissyM). the aforementioned is actually my stepson and he will be coming to live with us if he decides to leave. He'll be moving quite a distance from his Mum and Stepfather and half siblings but his sister (full sister) lives near to us with her husband and I cannot begin to imagine how it will work if she shuns him. Would she still come to our house, would she have anything to do with us and her half sister (my daughter)? Could she REALLY do that to her own brother? Are they that entrenched and brainwashed?

    It's a lot to comprehend and my mind is ready to explode.

  • konceptual99
    konceptual99

    Yes they are that brainwashed.

    If you live in an area that is not the same congregation as where he currently lives then it is possible for him to simply move, stop coming and fall off the radar.

    If he adopts a lifestyle that is contrary to Witness standards then his sister may dob him in to the local elders but that really depends on what sort of people she and her husband are. Some people are so entrenched they will escalate the situation but others know how to play the game and know that if they want to keep the status quo then they keep their traps shut.

    If he moves and his family keep quiet about whatever he chooses to do then he can successfully fade.

  • RocketQueen
    RocketQueen
    Let's hope they choose the fading route.
  • Finkelstein
    Finkelstein

    Why can't they just let him leave and continue to be his family?

    Because the JWS is a high controlling religoius cult that imposes penalties and punishment for not obeying the directives of the top leaders, this also involves dating or marrying nonbelievers

    If you become a baptized JWS, from then on you are the controlled holding property of the WTS and the organization has its enforcers to those imposing directives, namely elders whom scrutinize individuals to their personal adherence to those directives.

  • dozy
    dozy

    He was brought up as a JW since a very early age. He's now looking to exit.

    Ha Ha - Nope - you can't do that. JWs are like the Hotel California - you can check out any time you want , but you can't ever leave ( at least - not on your own terms without any sanctions ).

    There are a lot of factors here at play in this kind of situation. Some families are very keen ( feeling it is their Christian obligation ) to "tell" on their "sinning" ex-JW relatives. Some ( even supposedly "spiritual ones high up in the Org ) keep it very hush hush indeed. Some elders will snoop around , looking for dirt. Others couldn't be bothered - too busy and/or too lazy.

    Dating an unbeliever isn't in itself a DFing offence ( though possibly he may be "marked" as bad association. ) The key is whether they have committed "fornication".

    Its obviously much easier to DF him if there is categorical undeniable evidence easy to obtain that he has a "worldly" girlfriend. How "brazen" is he in the relationship? Posting lots of updates on Facebook etc or well known in the community that obviously indicate an ongoing "sexual" relationship ( eg holidays abroad , living together etc ) could lead to trouble. If he is discreet - then maybe there will be no action taken.

    A few others - how long has it been since his last meeting at the Kingdom Hall - last time in field service? Was he high profile - eg an appointed ministerial servant and/or a pioneer - or was he just a grunt rank & file member who did very little in "the truth". Is he known in the community as a JW? Was he popular in the congregation or did he p**s some people off who would be happy to snitch on him or lobby the elders to get him DFd? Would he be happy to meet the elders and co-operate or would he refuse to get involved ( which can muddy the waters a bit )? All of these come into the equation but there is no hard & fast rule about DFing faders / ex JWs in this kind of situation. It is just the luck of the draw.

  • DesirousOfChange
    DesirousOfChange

    After moving in with you, he needs to keep a low public profile regarding anything contrary to JW teachings. No public holiday celebration. No public overdrinking or drug use. No public displays with girl friends. (Note the comment about Facebook.)

    Usually, if he stays "off the radar" for a while, they will forget about him and he can go on and live his life. Hopefully he isn't wanting to escape the JW fold so he can go "experience all there is" to life. Many of the JW or Bible standards are a protection to avoiding life's problems. The ball is in his court.

    Doc

  • RocketQueen
    RocketQueen
    His cousin was df'd last year (apparently force himself on an underage girl but oddly the police were never involved) and i think that opened his eyes a little bit to the darker side of the religion, the shunning, lack of tolerance etc. The only thing that's been keeping him in is his Mum and siblings but he can't continue to do it for them. If he stopped going and then changed his mind, how long would it take for him to be accepted back in?
  • Finkelstein
    Finkelstein

    That's all relative if he gets DFed or not.

    If he does get DFed, then its usually months of constant attendance to meetings etc., a show of remorse is also important.

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